When will this shit end?

[Ozanne]

17 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

Thanks - yeah it's thrown us for a loop that she's been allowed to visit. When we first got the news we just had in mind all the stories about how people weren't being allowed to visit at all and folk dying alone which was horrible but sort of simplified things, in a weird way. When we were told it was an option we were pretty confused.

Let us know what you decide to do. 

Edited January 18, 2021 by Ozanne

[zahidf]

Lol what?

0

 

[Ozanne]

A big part of that daily growth is directly due to government policy.

[DeanoL]

8 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Lol what?

0

 

Kinda interesting the government did send a letter to every household at the start of all this, explaining the rules, but haven't done so with all the rules changes since. Obviously it's not viable but at one point they clearly thought it was necessary!

[Chawk]

lol, clearly a piss take. I'm sure they lost it as soon as the police were oot the door

[steviewevie]

A new one...Immune Escape.

 

[Mr.Tease]

3 hours ago, Ozanne said:

Matt Hancock talking about ‘us’ creating the AZ vaccination reminds me of John Terry celebrating the Champions League Final win fully kitted when he didn’t play. 

I’m old enough to remember when the Tories used to go on the attack against “experts”

[stuartbert two hats]

3 hours ago, Andy0808 v5 said:

Hancock is such a weasel. 
If enough of us ask if Glastonbury is on, do you think they’ll answer 

Well, I'm glad they've started doing it.

[Ozanne]

 

[Euphoricape]

53 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

A new one...Immune Escape.

 

This is where I get confused. If a new variant starts spreading which the vaccine doesn't work on, will all the vaccinations we have done become pointless? I know there is talk that the vaccine can be altered but surely this means we have to start again from scratch (no pun intended)? 

[squirrelarmy]

19 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

 

Classic tories. They spend billions on a pointless exercise like Brexit and giving money to their mates, no tax rises mentioned. 
 

On this though they say they will have to increase taxes to pay for it even though it’s a fraction of the cost of Brexit. As the Tories abstained, all the blame for the tax rise will lie with Starmer and Labour. 

[zahidf]

Boom

 

[Ozanne]

4 minutes ago, squirrelarmy said:

Classic tories. They spend billions on a pointless exercise like Brexit and giving money to their mates, no tax rises mentioned. 
 

On this though they say they will have to increase taxes to pay for it even though it’s a fraction of the cost of Brexit. As the Tories abstained, all the blame for the tax rise will lie with Starmer and Labour. 

You can see it coming a mile away can’t you, Labour playing party politics by daring to ask for poorer families to still receive the Universal Credit increase. How dare they. 

[zahidf]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

A new one...Immune Escape.

 

 

 

 

[SheffJeff]

12 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Boom

 

This sounds brilliant but I can't see anything in the article regarding the 'they cannot infect others' tagline. Am I missing something?

Edit: it says 'most likely not to infect others' which will be amazing if true.

Edited January 18, 2021 by SheffJeff
Didn't read the article properly.

[Tranquility of Solitude]

4 hours ago, Andy0808 v5 said:

Hancock is such a weasel. 
If enough of us ask if Glastonbury is on, do you think they’ll answer 

The last thing we want just now is the Tories confirming Glastonbury is on.

[Leyrulion]

41 minutes ago, Euphoricape said:

This is where I get confused. If a new variant starts spreading which the vaccine doesn't work on, will all the vaccinations we have done become pointless? I know there is talk that the vaccine can be altered but surely this means we have to start again from scratch (no pun intended)? 

That's a real risk but we don't know enough yet.

The flu undergoes immune escape and we have to do those shots again annually. However with flu once you've had it once there's generally some immunity acquired to future strains.

So hopefully this behaves more like that.

[Toilet Duck]

33 minutes ago, SheffJeff said:

This sounds brilliant but I can't see anything in the article regarding the 'they cannot infect others' tagline. Am I missing something?

Edit: it says 'most likely not to infect others' which will be amazing if true.

Yeah, 98% developed high levels of antibodies (or seroconversion as they call it...100% in the J&J trial did for comparison), but 98% sterilising immunity it’s not (though we all expect reduced viral loads in vaccinated individuals which should significantly reduce onward transmission). But the performance of the various vaccines is excellent so far. At the rate you guys are going (if you can keep up >2m a week), you could have all over 45s with one shot done before the end of April, which would be huge (since most hospitalisations and deaths occur over 45 and 1 shot of all the vaccines protects against this about 10-12 days later). What non-hospitalised morbidity in under 45s looks like at that stage will be the big question, but we should have an idea from Israel by then. 

[fraybentos1]

6 minutes ago, Toilet Duck said:

Yeah, 98% developed high levels of antibodies (or seroconversion as they call it...100% in the J&J trial did for comparison), but 98% sterilising immunity it’s not (though we all expect reduced viral loads in vaccinated individuals which should significantly reduce onward transmission). But the performance of the various vaccines is excellent so far. At the rate you guys are going (if you can keep up >2m a week), you could have all over 45s with one shot done before the end of April, which would be huge (since most hospitalisations and deaths occur over 45 and 1 shot of all the vaccines protects against this about 10-12 days later). What non-hospitalised morbidity in under 45s looks like at that stage will be the big question, but we should have an idea from Israel by then. 

At what point will they be able to definitively say whether vaccination stops you from spreading it on. Like is there ongoing studies at the moment of people who are vaccinated or do they just need to wait for weeks/ months and see if case numbers drop in certain ways and that will tell them?

[stuartbert two hats]

Not exactly plummeting, but heading in the right direction.

Hold your nerves folks, it's the home straight, but it's a long one. Stay safe everyone, we'll beat this.

[hodgey123]

Only two weeks into this lockdown and it feels as if it’s been at least five. Just me? 

[Crazyfool01]

1 minute ago, stuartbert two hats said:

Not exactly plummeting, but heading in the right direction.

Hold your nerves folks, it's the home straight, but it's a long one. Stay safe everyone, we'll beat this.

Tauntons going the other way ... you’ll be dropping below us soon ... 400 is our latest 😞 

[Toilet Duck]

11 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

At what point will they be able to definitively say whether vaccination stops you from spreading it on. Like is there ongoing studies at the moment of people who are vaccinated or do they just need to wait for weeks/ months and see if case numbers drop in certain ways and that will tell them?

We look at asymptomatic cases in the vaccinated population, if they are prevented from being infected at all, then they can’t pass it on. For the OX/AZ vaccine, they already have early data from the phase 3 suggesting up to 58% reduction in asymptomatic cases (but that had a lot of variation in it). For Pfizer and Moderna, they are bringing people from their phase 3 trial back in after 6 months to do a seroconversion study like the one described above. At that point, they will look at how many vaccinated individuals generated antibodies to the spike that was in the vaccine and it will let them know how well the vaccine is working. To do that, they need to take blood samples and at the same time, they can also look for antibodies to other parts of the virus that aren’t contained in the vaccine (the most abundant of these target the nucleocapsid, which is also on the outside of the virus). If someone has antibodies to the nucleocapsid, they could only have gotten them from being infected with the virus, not via vaccination. If the vaccinated group have fewer of these antibodies compared to the placebo group, then we’ll know if the vaccine prevents against infection...if there’s no difference in the nucleocapsid antibodies between the two groups, then the vaccine just prevents disease, not infection. That in itself doesn’t preclude the possibility that protecting from disease lowers viral loads and suppresses onward transmission, a signal for that will appear at a population level when sufficient people are vaccinated. 

[Ozanne]

10 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

Tauntons going the other way ... you’ll be dropping below us soon ... 400 is our latest 😞 

It’s going up!?

[fraybentos1]

6 minutes ago, Toilet Duck said:

We look at asymptomatic cases in the vaccinated population, if they are prevented from being infected at all, then they can’t pass it on. For the OX/AZ vaccine, they already have early data from the phase 3 suggesting up to 58% reduction in asymptomatic cases (but that had a lot of variation in it). For Pfizer and Moderna, they are bringing people from their phase 3 trial back in after 6 months to do a seroconversion study like the one described above. At that point, they will look at how many vaccinated individuals generated antibodies to the spike that was in the vaccine and it will let them know how well the vaccine is working. To do that, they need to take blood samples and at the same time, they can also look for antibodies to other parts of the virus that aren’t contained in the vaccine (the most abundant of these target the nucleocapsid, which is also on the outside of the virus). If someone has antibodies to the nucleocapsid, they could only have gotten them from being infected with the virus, not via vaccination. If the vaccinated group have fewer of these antibodies compared to the placebo group, then we’ll know if the vaccine prevents against infection...if there’s no difference in the nucleocapsid antibodies between the two groups, then the vaccine just prevents disease, not infection. That in itself doesn’t preclude the possibility that protecting from disease lowers viral loads and suppresses onward transmission, a signal for that will appear at a population level when sufficient people are vaccinated. 

Thanks a lot!