When will this shit end?

[Crazyfool01]

4 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

there's tests available in the £40-£60 price range, and have been mulling over getting one for my mum ... and perhaps even me, too. It'd definitely take a bit of worry away if either came back positive.

Amazon ? Superdrug still ? I did contemplate it earlier on but thought I’d get one at the drs ... sadly not but I did think they got removed ? 

[zahidf]

10 minutes ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

I've yet to see a pub blatantly breaking the rules, since the new clearer rules came in? The penalties for them doing so is more than they are currently taking and I have seen public health inspectors visiting day and night during the week and the weekend! 

I'm a regular pub dweller because I work at home all week, my Mrs is at home all week. Due to Covid our lad is home from school earlier and frankly like millions of others in the same boat I need a bit of time to myself and I choose to have a pint while I do that. 

How many of people claiming pubs are unsafe are regular pub dwellers or is it based on the hearsay and social media? 

I'm going for a couple of pints tonight with a mate of mine, and I've been looking forward to it all week it's a nice break from the new routine and it's a small piece of relative normality in these crazy times. 

One of the pubs near my work was shockingly bad: bar service and no attempts for us to use track and trace. I left without ordering

Saying that it only opened beginning of September, missing eat out, and i was very much getting the impression it was just an exercise to clear out the beer left over before closing for good. 

[Radiochicken]

I’d put a significant proportion of the blame on Track & Trace. I can’t overstate how much of a failure it’s been so far. Now, this includes both operationally how it works, but also the daft lack of aligning incentives so it’s actually in people’s interests to self isolate when asked. No wonder there was evidence so few actually listen. 

In early summer, when numbers were low, a competent system with a joined-up strategy for helping people isolate would’ve/should’ve been able to keep this under control.

Instead, it’s out of control, we’re £12b down, with a demoralised public, and only the blunt instrument of further lockdowns left to try and delay the inevitable until hopefully Science saves the day.

[Gilb]

26 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

just to let the gold readers know if you haven't checked the other thread that a dark skin mode is available by selecting it at the bottom of the page .... looks really good  and if you haven't gone gold .... its time to support the site and at the moment pay for this thread  

Ooh...I hadn't read that and now I have...it's much better on the eye! Thanks for the heads up  

[eFestivals]

8 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

Amazon ? Superdrug still ? I did contemplate it earlier on but thought I’d get one at the drs ... sadly not but I did think they got removed ? 

i googled the other day and found a few, tho I did notice some were out of stock.

[Copperface]

30 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

One Cabinet Minister is calling for more measures. 

Even this clusterf**k of a government aren't dopey enough to appoint Dorries as a cabinet level minister.

[Copperface]

27 minutes ago, Radiochicken said:

I’d put a significant proportion of the blame on Track & Trace. I can’t overstate how much of a failure it’s been so far. Now, this includes both operationally how it works, but also the daft lack of aligning incentives so it’s actually in people’s interests to self isolate when asked. No wonder there was evidence so few actually listen. 

In early summer, when numbers were low, a competent system with a joined-up strategy for helping people isolate would’ve/should’ve been able to keep this under control.

Instead, it’s out of control, we’re £12b down, with a demoralised public, and only the blunt instrument of further lockdowns left to try and delay the inevitable until hopefully Science saves the day.

The below report bears out why Local authorities have been begging for months that they should be coordinating and operating T&T. Far cheaper as well. Local measures and local knowledge far outweigh some remote, solely figures based  assessment.

"In cases handled by local health protection teams, 97.1% of contacts were reached and asked to self-isolate. But when cases were handled online or by call centres, only 62.4% of close contacts were reached and asked to self-isolate."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-54460270?ns_mchannel=social&ns_source=twitter&ns_campaign=bbc_live&ns_linkname=5f7ee936c4548e02bf3ca8f8%26England's Test and Trace at lowest percentage of contacts%262020-10-08T10%3A32%3A05.394Z&ns_fee=0&pinned_post_locator=urn:asset:73ce7b33-a9dc-4d2a-9fb8-34c94cd440ec&pinned_post_asset_id=5f7ee936c4548e02bf3ca8f8&pinned_post_type=share

Edited October 8, 2020 by Copperface

[Radiochicken]

24 minutes ago, Radiochicken said:

I’d put a significant proportion of the blame on Track & Trace. I can’t overstate how much of a failure it’s been so far. Now, this includes both operationally how it works, but also the daft lack of aligning incentives so it’s actually in people’s interests to self isolate when asked. No wonder there was evidence so few actually listen. 

In early summer, when numbers were low, a competent system with a joined-up strategy for helping people isolate would’ve/should’ve been able to keep this under control.

Instead, it’s out of control, we’re £12b down, with a demoralised public, and only the blunt instrument of further lockdowns left to try and delay the inevitable until hopefully Science saves the day.

Sorry to indulge in quoting myself, but right on cue...

P.S. then when you factor in of those 68% contracted, so few are actually isolating  🙈

[Fuzzy Afro]

43 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

One Cabinet Minister is calling for more measures. 

Nadine Dorries isn’t a cabinet minister. Thank god. 

[ace56blaa]

We need a comprehensive list of the same tired arguments against lockdown: 

(There is legitimate concern about lockdown that people have but so much misinformation about why we shouldn't put in extra measures)

"Covid is Just the Flu" - That ons thread, showing in every way how covid is more dangerous than flu, even going as so far to explain even when cvoid is the underlying cause and not "just on the certificate" as many people false claim most covid deaths are. 

"Lockdown will lead to more cancelled cancer treatments" - No it won't the earlier you lockdown, the less likely hospitals are to be overwhelmed, the less likely they are to cancel treatments. Stopping a lockdown does not stops hospitalizations from covid. 

"It'll tank the economy" - Covid is the thing tanking the economy, even at the height of fewer restrictions in august, shops were still reporting losses, the government was still encouraging people to go back to the office to save pret a manger. People's habit changed because of lockdown and the risk of covid, less people even with little restrictions are gonna go to the cinema or a shop. More people will return to life as normal, when they can see the virus is actually under control. Also with financial aid from the government businesses that are shutting now could have stayed open till a vaccine with support. 

"The government can't just bail out businesses and employees forever" - We are 7 months into lockdown, other countries are extending their furlough till next year and beyond. Other european countries has much better benefits for their people or have raised them since covid. - Furlough wasn't making people lazy or businesses scrounging, it was a lifeline for businesses hugely affected by the pandemic. - If you keep those businesses alive, they could be paramount to an economic recovery when people do feel safe. - Also when you see them giving millions of pounds to their friends for projects that will ultimately fail (track and trace, ppe) but they don't have enough money to help people beyond october?

"Mental health will suffer under lockdown" - This is the most valid argument. The restrictions are tough, not seeing people is tough. But I feel like if people had financial support, decent guidance from the government and a transparent plan going forward, locking down would be a lot easier. Also in a second lockdown, we wouldn't need to ban outside exercise for more than an hour or going for a walk with a friend, as we know outside transmission is unlikely. Obviously there is still a lot of impact on mental health, but there is also a long covid impact from catching the virus, or mental health impacts of someone you know dying. Some of which could be a hell of a lot worse than locking down for a few more months.

Obviously there is probably stuff I've missed or stuff that can be argued, but I think we all knew deep down, we could have a second wave and could need to re-lockdown in winter. 

 

[Ozanne]

Sorry for the length but this is an update on The Guardian about next steps:

 

Three-tier lockdown system to start on Wednesday, but toughest rules yet to be finalised, leak suggests

The government’s new three-tier lockdown regime will be announced on Monday and come into force on Wednesday, according to a leaked document reported by the Nottingham Post.

But the leak also suggests ministers have not yet decided how strict the rules will be in tier three - the places with the highest number of cases.

Kit Sandeman, a BBC local democracy reported working with the Nottingham Post, says in his story that Nottingham is set to enter level two. And he explains in his story what that will mean. He reports:

All of the county and Nottingham city would go into ‘Level Two’ of a new traffic light system for local lockdowns due to be announced next week.

The documents, which have been sent by the government to senior figures in the city and county, show that people can still go on holiday outside of your area, but you should only do this with people you live with or have formed a support bubble with.

In addition, they say meeting people from other households in private dwellings will not be allowed

Visiting indoor hospitality, leisure and retail settings will be restricted to one household, meaning two households must not meet in these settings unless those two households are in a support bubble.

Sandeman’s story also quotes from the document, which says the government has yet to decide exactly what restrictions will apply in the areas subject to the tightest ‘Level Three’ rules. The document says:

The secretary of state wants to be in a position to move across to the new tiering approach, now called local risk levels, in one step next week.

There will therefore be no announcements of the local risk levels from central government this week and we are currently seeking to clarify whether or not the watchlist [a Public Health England list of local authority areas that might need Covid interventions] will be published this week accordingly.

Our current expectation is that the approach will be announced on Monday, October 12 with the new standardised regulations coming into force on Wednesday October 14 ...

Level One and Two measures have now been signed off by Covid O [operations] committee but there is further work ongoing on Level 3.

[Fuzzy Afro]

The next presidential debate is being held over Zoom. 

[Fuzzy Afro]

1 minute ago, Ozanne said:

Sorry for the length but this is an update on The Guardian about next steps:

 

Three-tier lockdown system to start on Wednesday, but toughest rules yet to be finalised, leak suggests

The government’s new three-tier lockdown regime will be announced on Monday and come into force on Wednesday, according to a leaked document reported by the Nottingham Post.

But the leak also suggests ministers have not yet decided how strict the rules will be in tier three - the places with the highest number of cases.

Kit Sandeman, a BBC local democracy reported working with the Nottingham Post, says in his story that Nottingham is set to enter level two. And he explains in his story what that will mean. He reports:

All of the county and Nottingham city would go into ‘Level Two’ of a new traffic light system for local lockdowns due to be announced next week.

The documents, which have been sent by the government to senior figures in the city and county, show that people can still go on holiday outside of your area, but you should only do this with people you live with or have formed a support bubble with.

In addition, they say meeting people from other households in private dwellings will not be allowed

Visiting indoor hospitality, leisure and retail settings will be restricted to one household, meaning two households must not meet in these settings unless those two households are in a support bubble.

Sandeman’s story also quotes from the document, which says the government has yet to decide exactly what restrictions will apply in the areas subject to the tightest ‘Level Three’ rules. The document says:

The secretary of state wants to be in a position to move across to the new tiering approach, now called local risk levels, in one step next week.

There will therefore be no announcements of the local risk levels from central government this week and we are currently seeking to clarify whether or not the watchlist [a Public Health England list of local authority areas that might need Covid interventions] will be published this week accordingly.

Our current expectation is that the approach will be announced on Monday, October 12 with the new standardised regulations coming into force on Wednesday October 14 ...

Level One and Two measures have now been signed off by Covid O [operations] committee but there is further work ongoing on Level 3.

Any leaks on exactly who is going into each level? 

[Fuzzy Afro]

Spanish court voids the local lockdown in Madrid over human rights concerns 

[Crazyfool01]

3 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

The next presidential debate is being held over Zoom. 

With breaks for drugs ? 

[SheffJeff]

4 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

With breaks for drugs ? 

I had to take a few breaks during the last one for drugs!

[st dan]

8 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

The next presidential debate is being held over Zoom. 

Trumps not going to go on mute is he 

[Fuzzy Afro]

Top 5 words/phrases I’m looking forward to never heard again after this pandemic finishes

 

“Socially distanced” (when used as a verb)

 

”Furlough”

 

”Professor Devi Sridhar said...”

 

”Government approved exercise”

 

”Blended learning model”

[Fuzzy Afro]

Actually let’s add “staycation” for a Brucie bonus

[Mr.Tease]

1 hour ago, Ozanne said:

One Cabinet Minister is calling for more measures. 

Because she got covid back in March and passed it on to her elderly mum- she hasn't forgotten that awful experience. As much as I dislike her politics, I'm glad she's learned from that and wants to protect others from going through it. 

[Zoo Music Girl]

20 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

With breaks for drugs ? 

At least the interviewer can literally mute Trump between answers.

[efcfanwirral]

 

Controversial thought exercise to throw out there - could a blanket ban on alcohol sales (including shops) for a few weeks help stop the spread? 

Obviously economic issues but it does seem that drinking, either at home or out, is the driver here. I know it's the driver of our economy too but if they really want to "circuit break"...

But the big problem is that 1) I don't trust them to put provisions in place to help people who already know they are physically dependent as public health system seems stretched with only what it has to deal with normally and 2) I think we would find that many of us are dependent without realising it! 

[Fuzzy Afro]

1 minute ago, efcfanwirral said:

 

Controversial thought exercise to throw out there - could a blanket ban on alcohol sales (including shops) for a few weeks help stop the spread? 

Obviously economic issues but it does seem that drinking, either at home or out, is the driver here. I know it's the driver of our economy too but if they really want to "circuit break"...

But the big problem is that 1) I don't trust them to put provisions in place to help people who already know they are physically dependent as public health system seems stretched with only what it has to deal with normally and 2) I think we would find that many of us are dependent without realising it! 

South Africa tried that I believe.

 

I don’t think it would fly in this country of pissed up alcoholics. 

[Crazyfool01]

1 minute ago, efcfanwirral said:

 

Controversial thought exercise to throw out there - could a blanket ban on alcohol sales (including shops) for a few weeks help stop the spread? 

Obviously economic issues but it does seem that drinking, either at home or out, is the driver here. I know it's the driver of our economy too but if they really want to "circuit break"...

But the big problem is that 1) I don't trust them to put provisions in place to help people who already know they are physically dependent as public health system seems stretched with only what it has to deal with normally and 2) I think we would find that many of us are dependent without realising it! 

They did that in South Africa I think ... to prevent hospitals being over used due to alcohol related violence ... not sure if it worked or not ? 

[Ozanne]

Trump has refused to do the debate over Zoom.