When will this shit end?

[steviewevie]

 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

 

Thanks for posting her stuff, I’ve found it really interesting to go through. 

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, Ozanne said:

Thanks for posting her stuff, I’ve found it really interesting to go through. 

that one is a bit fucking scary....

[Mr.Tease]

35 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

govt is just leaking the news to the telegraph,

It's like they're taking all the steps necessary to completely erode trust in the vaccinations :

 

Completely change the gap between the first and the second dose, to an untested one- check! 

Start to declare we'll now chop and change which vaccine you'll get second, depending on what one we can find on the day (again untested!) - check! 

Lie about the number of vaccines available- check! 

Lie about the vaccine administration rate- check! 

Lie about what the hold up is- check! 

 

Edited January 1, 2021 by Mr.Tease

[incident]

12 minutes ago, efcfanwirral said:

Ah yes a war is exactly what we need right now...

I absolutely agree with him - and I hereby propose that General Farage should gather his troops and lead them into China immediately.

Lead from the front, Nigel. Show them what you're made of. Don't mind all the artillery pointed at you, you're invincible.

[incident]

2 minutes ago, Mr.Tease said:

It's like they're taking all the steps necessary to completely erode trust in the vaccinations :

 

Completely change the gap between the first and the second dose, to an untested one- check! 

Start to declare we'll now chop and change which vaccine you'll get second, depending on what one we can find on the day (again untested!) - check! 

Lie about the number of vaccines available- check! 

Lie about the vaccine administration rate- check! 

Lie about what the hold up is- check! 

 

Yeah I raised this the other day when the idea of delaying the second shot was first raised.

One of the most important things the Government can do is to not let politics interfere in the medical aspects of the rollout as they can't afford to have significant distrust develop.

Delay the second shot of the Oxford vaccine, if there's the data available to support it? Fine, though we've not seen the data yet and probably won't for ~2 weeks when the Public Assessment Report is published.

Doing anything untested beyond that? Fucking irresponsible.

[Radiochicken]

The mixing and matching of vaccines has me worried a little bit. There’s just zero, zilch, data for that yet. And public opinion can be super fragile, so any decisions not made with data - regardless of the current situation - is very bad news. 

[zahidf]

8 minutes ago, Mr.Tease said:

It's like they're taking all the steps necessary to completely erode trust in the vaccinations :

 

Completely change the gap between the first and the second dose, to an untested one- check! 

Start to declare we'll now chop and change which vaccine you'll get second, depending on what one we can find on the day (again untested!) - check! 

Lie about the number of vaccines available- check! 

Lie about the vaccine administration rate- check! 

Lie about what the hold up is- check! 

 

Fwiw the second dose being different is only supposed to be 'in unusual circumstances ' from the reading of the rules. 

[stuartbert two hats]

7 minutes ago, incident said:

Yeah I raised this the other day when the idea of delaying the second shot was first raised.

One of the most important things the Government can do is to not let politics interfere in the medical aspects of the rollout as they can't afford to have significant distrust develop.

Delay the second shot of the Oxford vaccine, if there's the data available to support it? Fine, though we've not seen the data yet and probably won't for ~2 weeks when the Public Assessment Report is published.

Doing anything untested beyond that? Fucking irresponsible.

I think they're making the right call with delaying both. Even those who have already had shot 1 being rescheduled frees up about 1 million extra doses in the short term. I'm not going to post "that graph" again, but the Pfizer vaccine is already highly effective a week before dose 2. They're going to save lives by making this change, what with the new variant, we have to balance the risk carefully and it's more likely to kill people by not increasing the delay for both.

[efcfanwirral]

It's all such a mess isn't it? We're just sat here allowing this new strain to spread everywhere in the country. It WILL spread to the levels in london and SE, schools WILL facilitate this and the rest of the country WILL have no health service just like London won't in a few days. 

This isn't in doubt - and the only time action will be taken is when it does happen. 

It's as if they want the rest of the country to share London's pain. It's all inevitable and the measures need to be harsh and it needs to be now. 

Edited January 1, 2021 by efcfanwirral

[incident]

5 minutes ago, stuartbert two hats said:

I think they're making the right call with delaying both. Even those who have already had shot 1 being rescheduled frees up about 1 million extra doses in the short term. I'm not going to post "that graph" again, but the Pfizer vaccine is already highly effective a week before dose 2. They're going to save lives by making this change, what with the new variant, we have to balance the risk carefully and it's more likely to kill people by not increasing the delay for both.

But mixing and matching (granted, not as the default option but even potentially) is yet another step on from that and completely untested in all possible ways.

I mean fuck, if they're going to do that then they might as well decide that the doses need to be rationed further and everyone gets a half dose.

[stuartbert two hats]

1 minute ago, incident said:

But mixing and matching (granted, not as the default option but even potentially) is yet another step on from that and completely untested in all possible ways.

I mean fuck, if they're going to do that then they might as well decide that the doses need to be rationed further and everyone gets a half dose.

Yeah the mixing is crazy. Hopefully it won't have to happen.

[Zoo Music Girl]

1 hour ago, Mr.Tease said:

It's like they're taking all the steps necessary to completely erode trust in the vaccinations :

 

Completely change the gap between the first and the second dose, to an untested one- check! 

Start to declare we'll now chop and change which vaccine you'll get second, depending on what one we can find on the day (again untested!) - check! 

Lie about the number of vaccines available- check! 

Lie about the vaccine administration rate- check! 

Lie about what the hold up is- check! 

 

Yeah I agree. This shit is just going to erode trust more - and I say this as someone who fully believes they are safe and can't wait to have one. I'm not keen on them going against the published scientific guidance.

[DeanoL]

7 hours ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

This stuff is so new we don't have the first notion of any long term effects of it - it's simply not been around long enough to test the theory. 

With all these things now it's there I'm sure there will be hundreds of studies by academics all around the world into the various impact this vaccine and indeed the illness itself has on things like fertility and all manner of other things. 

I'm just not to keen on being the test pilot.

 

I get that, I really do, and I think some people are being a bit harsh. But reality is we won’t manage to eradicate COVID, so unless you plan on staying isolated the rest of your life, your choices will boil down to either getting the vaccine, or getting COVID and getting natural immunity.

And here’s the thing: there’s also no long term evidence about what COVID does. Even in those who get a light or asymptomatic infection. You are right that it’s possible the vaccine could reduce fertility. It’s also possible catching COVID could reduce fertility. We don’t know that yet either.

for every unknown with the vaccine, there’s another with the actual disease.

[mcshed]

6 hours ago, DeanoL said:

I get that, I really do, and I think some people are being a bit harsh. But reality is we won’t manage to eradicate COVID, so unless you plan on staying isolated the rest of your life, your choices will boil down to either getting the vaccine, or getting COVID and getting natural immunity.

And here’s the thing: there’s also no long term evidence about what COVID does. Even in those who get a light or asymptomatic infection. You are right that it’s possible the vaccine could reduce fertility. It’s also possible catching COVID could reduce fertility. We don’t know that yet either.

for every unknown with the vaccine, there’s another with the actual disease.

 

[xxialac]

6 hours ago, DeanoL said:

I get that, I really do, and I think some people are being a bit harsh. But reality is we won’t manage to eradicate COVID, so unless you plan on staying isolated the rest of your life, your choices will boil down to either getting the vaccine, or getting COVID and getting natural immunity.

And here’s the thing: there’s also no long term evidence about what COVID does. Even in those who get a light or asymptomatic infection. You are right that it’s possible the vaccine could reduce fertility. It’s also possible catching COVID could reduce fertility. We don’t know that yet either.

for every unknown with the vaccine, there’s another with the actual disease.

Very good points.  Not getting vaccinated means getting Covid at some stage. Absurd to assume that the latter will lead to better outcomes including on fertility.

Here's a very good thread from an immunologist on why the vaccine doesn't damage female fertility.

Make your own decisions based on practically zero understanding...or the reasoning of a specialist in the area - up to you. 

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1339510379332988929.html

 

[MrBarry465]

As soon as it's available for someone in my age range, 30's - I;ll be more than happy to get that stuff injected into my veins. Bring it on.

[stuartbert two hats]

5 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

As soon as it's available for someone in my age range, 30's - I;ll be more than happy to get that stuff injected into my veins. Bring it on.

Err, actually it's injected into your muscle. 🤓

[xxialac]

I'd have it injected into my bum if that's what was necessary to not get Covid and get closer to herd immunity.

[stuartbert two hats]

37 minutes ago, mcshed said:

 

I believe in getting immunity the old-fashioned way: By letting a bat virus take control of my lungs and turn my face into a disgusting plague fountain while my immune system desperately Googles 'how to make spike protein antibodies'.

[steviewevie]

 

[steviewevie]

 

[steviewevie]

 

[st dan]

I think the decision has been made because ultimately the one dose method will save more lives, due to the immunity it provides within the first two weeks. So it makes most sense to have this rolled out to as many individuals as possible, as soon as possible  

Although this might not be the recommended route and the 2nd dose sooner would certainly bump the immunity up even further, we have to address the circumstances we are dealing with. The key thing to remember is you are much, much more likely to beat this virus if you only ever had the one dose vs none at all. 

[Lycra]

Hospital full, patients waiting in ambulances to be admitted & key frontline staff nursing covid patients being told they will not receive the vaccination until at least 2 more weeks have passed, that's the reality of the situation. Hancock was wise enough not to over promise but his boss just can't help himself.

Edited January 2, 2021 by Lycra