When will this shit end?

[steviewevie]

II've posted this before...covid map...now up to 24th.

https://www.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=47574f7a6e454dc6a42c5f6912ed7076

[DeanoL]

46 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

This is kind of the point I was making after Sunaks statement in the HoC last week, why does the Government get to decide what job is viable? If those rich, out of touch Ministers decide a job in a Night Club isn't viable anymore because Clubs can't open bat the moment then that's it, they've gone. We could have a vaccine of some kind in 6 months and those jobs would be viable again. Sunak is dangerous, I can't stand him.

Without a comprehensive protection package though furlough alone wouldn't be enough to save most businesses anyway - there are other fixed costs and even if you had zero payroll costs, 12 months with zero trading is going to leave most organisations in trouble. The big one of course being rent for properties. And there's no-way a Tory government is going enforce rent holidays for businesses with premises that aren't allowed to open. 

Of course, the unemployment issue wouldn't be so bad if we had proper unemployment protection in place, with a proper regular payout for those that lose jobs that is actually enough to keep up rent/mortgage payments.

[Crazyfool01]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

I reckon they  could employ a few people to sort this shit out ... surely they could  call them Viable jobs 

[st dan]

Boris’ Twitter profile picture - says a lot of somebody when you see them looking smart and tidy, and that actually shocks you. 

[st dan]

4 minutes ago, Zoo Music Girl said:

The pubs she goes to sound fucking horrendous!

Sounds more like a strip club than a pub to me! 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, DeanoL said:

Without a comprehensive protection package though furlough alone wouldn't be enough to save most businesses anyway - there are other fixed costs and even if you had zero payroll costs, 12 months with zero trading is going to leave most organisations in trouble. The big one of course being rent for properties. And there's no-way a Tory government is going enforce rent holidays for businesses with premises that aren't allowed to open. 

Of course, the unemployment issue wouldn't be so bad if we had proper unemployment protection in place, with a proper regular payout for those that lose jobs that is actually enough to keep up rent/mortgage payments.

Trust me I agree with you completely. There should be these measures in place to protect people’s jobs until a vaccine is with us (in the short term). Of course the Tories won’t do that in the longer term but that doesn’t mean they shouldn’t put it in place. 
It surely can’t be a surprise to anyone that a society built upon money and profit will nearly fall apart when a serious crises come along. That’s why serious is needed in this world.

 

6 minutes ago, Ryan1984 said:

Is this his first apology since the pandemic began?

I think it might be.

[steviewevie]

One million coronavirus deaths: how did we get here?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/ng-interactive/2020/sep/29/one-million-coronavirus-deaths-how-did-we-get-here-covid

[Chef]

21 minutes ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

It is the number 2, and that is part of the reason also a lot of commercial premises e.g. pubs are on corners so it will be Red Lion, High Street. 

I believe the officially addressed lowest numbered house is -2. 

What about the highest number? There was a 1081 on a road near where I used to live in Tooting, SW London

[Crazyfool01]

3 minutes ago, Chef said:

What about the highest number? There was a 1081 on a road near where I used to live in Tooting, SW London

lightweights .... 2679 for a house in Solihull 

[Crazyfool01]

I downloaded an app yesterday for my watch for hand washing .... I thought I was quite good at it ... in terms of length of time and frequency ... turns out I need to improve ..... for those without an app just try timing your usual hand wash .... Its an eyeopener ... and a learning experience for me .... hands  30 seconds , Face , Space everyone  

[Copperface]

28 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

There should be these measures in place to protect people’s jobs until a vaccine is with us (in the short term). Of course the Tories won’t do that in the longer term but that doesn’t mean they shouldn’t put it in place.

Not defending the shysters at all, but the key point is that, despite everyone's optimism, nobody has a clue when a vaccine might be available and deployed. 

The govts view is that if they started supporting these jobs, they would then be left supporting them potentially on an open ended basis, on the undefined availability date of a vaccine. It might be early next year, it might be end 2021, it might be in two years, it might be never.

Without a fixed end point what time scale would you put in place?

Edited September 29, 2020 by Copperface

[priest17]

 

 

[stuartbert two hats]

Just now, Copperface said:

Not defending the shysters at all, but the key point is that, despite everyone's optimism, nobody has a clue when a vaccine might be available and deployed. 

Thee govts view is that if they started supporting these jobs, they would then be left supporting them potentially on an open ended basis, on the undefined availability date of a vaccine. It might be early next year, it might be end 2021, it might be in two years, it might be never.

Without a fixed end point what time scale would you put in place?

I think you're getting the phrase "nobody has a firm idea" with "nobody has a clue".  We have very, very many clues that vaccine roll out is likely for Q1 of 2021.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Copperface said:

Not defending the shysters at all, but the key point is that, despite everyone's optimism, nobody has a clue when a vaccine might be available and deployed. 

The govts view is that if they started supporting these jobs, they would then be left supporting them potentially on an open ended basis, on the undefined availability date of a vaccine. It might be early next year, it might be end 2021, it might be in two years, it might be never.

Without a fixed end point what time scale would you put in place?

Why does there have to be an end point for the help? If the Government really cared then they would keep support going for as long as the pandemic is around. I’m not talking wholesale support to every industry, aim it at the ones that need it and are still not open.

Obviously if it looked a vaccine was never going to come then we would have to look at living with the virus and that stage we probably wouldn’t have tough restrictions in place anyway. But at the moment it looks like we will get a vaccine so keep the support in place at least through till the Spring, then review the situation. 

Edited September 29, 2020 by Ozanne

[Copperface]

8 minutes ago, stuartbert two hats said:

I think you're getting the phrase "nobody has a firm idea" with "nobody has a clue".  We have very, very many clues that vaccine roll out is likely for Q1 of 2021.

I actually wrote 'available and deployed'.

There may be a roll out, but nothing is certain and all the encouraging news comes with a load of caveats. Even if a vaccine is efficacious and is approved, the actual deployment and implementation of a programme will take many months, even years. Add to that the logistical challenges with shortages of refrigerated trucks, suitable storage units and glass medical vials,  a vaccine approval is only the first baby step towards a semblance of normality. 

 

[Fuzzy Afro]

6 minutes ago, Copperface said:

I actually wrote 'available and deployed'.

There may be a roll out, but nothing is certain and all the encouraging news comes with a load of caveats. Even if a vaccine is efficacious and is approved, the actual deployment and implementation of a programme will take many months, even years. Add to that the logistical challenges with shortages of refrigerated trucks, suitable storage units and glass medical vials,  a vaccine approval is only the first baby step towards a semblance of normality. 

 

I mean, you’re correct in saying that vaccine approval isn’t the end game, but OTOH we don’t need every single person to have been vaccinated in order to start getting back to normal. Once the vulnerable have been vaccinated we can allow more personal choice in how people want to behave. 

[parsonjack]

3 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

I mean, you’re correct in saying that vaccine approval isn’t the end game, but OTOH we don’t need every single person to have been vaccinated in order to start getting back to normal. Once the vulnerable have been vaccinated we can allow more personal choice in how people want to behave. 

Quite.....and every single person vaccinated progressively reduces the risk to everyone else.

[stuie]

The idiots are getting restless! 
 

[Copperface]

5 minutes ago, parsonjack said:

Quite.....and every single person vaccinated progressively reduces the risk to everyone else.

Absolutely agree, but we have digressed -  the point I was making is how long would you expect this government to commit to supporting jobs where there are no firm end dates?

[mcshed]

27 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Why does there have to be an end point for the help? If the Government really cared then they would keep support going for as long as the pandemic is around. I’m not talking wholesale support to every industry, aim it at the ones that need it and are still not open

The thing is I think it is perfectly reasonable for the Government to say things are going to be different for a long time so those who can find other work should do so. Those who can't find work should obviously have an expanded safety net rather than our miserly benefit system but they don't necessarily need the full 80% they are currently getting. So long as the businesses are protected so that there are "proper" jobs to go back to. In fact it could be argued that a lot of the furlough money would have been better spent supporting the industries worst effected and I say that as someone who is currently on furlough.

[Copperface]

"the team behind the Oxford University vaccine does not expect doses to be available on a nationwide scale until late next year at the earliest."

"a government medical adviser who sits on the Scientific Pandemic Influenza Group on Modelling, has suggested the majority of people in the UK could be waiting for two years to access the vaccine."

"The first vaccine doses are set to be administered to frontline healthcare workers and vulnerable groups, such as the elderly and sick. It is widely expected that this stage of vaccination will start taking place in the first half of next year."

Some interesting bits in this article...whether true or not.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-mass-rollout-uk-vaccine-could-be-delayed-years-b666108.html

 

 

[fraybentos1]

Just now, Copperface said:

"the team behind the Oxford University vaccine does not expect doses to be available on a nationwide scale until late next year at the earliest."

"a government medical adviser who sits on the Scientific Pandemic Influenza Group on Modelling, has suggested the majority of people in the UK could be waiting for two years to access the vaccine."

"The first vaccine doses are set to be administered to frontline healthcare workers and vulnerable groups, such as the elderly and sick. It is widely expected that this stage of vaccination will start taking place in the first half of next year."

Some interesting bits in this article...whether true or not.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-mass-rollout-uk-vaccine-could-be-delayed-years-b666108.html

 

 

You don't need everyone to be vaccinated though. I think there's a decent chance speaking as a 24 year old that I never get the vaccine, just as I have never had the flu vaccine. Doesn't mean things can't get back to normal if the most needy are vaccinated. 

[gizmoman]

2 hours ago, squirrelarmy said:

Just had an interesting conversation with a mate from Bradford. She’s mixed race so supposedly in a higher risk group and this is the typical behaviour in Bradford pubs right now. 
 

Am i the only one who had to google "motorboating"? If so I must be the oldest one on here!

[Fuzzy Afro]

2 minutes ago, Copperface said:

"the team behind the Oxford University vaccine does not expect doses to be available on a nationwide scale until late next year at the earliest."

"a government medical adviser who sits on the Scientific Pandemic Influenza Group on Modelling, has suggested the majority of people in the UK could be waiting for two years to access the vaccine."

"The first vaccine doses are set to be administered to frontline healthcare workers and vulnerable groups, such as the elderly and sick. It is widely expected that this stage of vaccination will start taking place in the first half of next year."

Some interesting bits in this article...whether true or not.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-mass-rollout-uk-vaccine-could-be-delayed-years-b666108.html

 

 

Ouch  that article has knocked me for six 

[squirrelarmy]

3 minutes ago, gizmoman said:

Am i the only one who had to google "motorboating"? If so I must be the oldest one on here!

Hope you didn’t google it on a work computer 😂