When will this shit end?

[JoeyT]

6 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

Contact tracing pubs and restaurants is optional. It also doesn’t even work. I know for a fact I’ve been in a pub where a fellow customer tested positive, and the only reason I knew to self isolate is because the guy rang me and told be. Test & trace didn’t bother contacting everyone who’d been in any of the pubs that the guy had visited. 

Similar happened in a pub local to me.

Quote from the landlord who did his bit but pretty damning of the system...

Quote

 

Martin said that he first heard rumours yesterday ( August 19) at around 2.30 pm that one of his customers had tested positive for Covid-19. That customer had been in the pub at the weekend.

" So I contacted them directly. I did that as a responsible landlord, so when I heard that yes, they had tested positive, I immediately contacted the licensing authority. But I couldn't get hold of anyone because they can only be contacted by email, so then I tried to get hold of Public Health England. Again they only had a helpline and I was told it was up to me as to what steps I took about closing. Again no one contacted me from track and trace."

 

 

Edited September 7, 2020 by JoeyT

[Leyrulion]

34 minutes ago, FestivalJamie said:

If cases keep rising, what do we think are the next government u-turns?

Face coverings mandatory in all secondary school corridors?

Airport testing rather than blanket quarantine?

Mandatory contact tracing for pubs and restaurants?

Face coverings compulsory for shop workers as well as customers?

Do we think Bolton might go into a proper lockdown?

There's something about the general focus on U turns that worries me. They're always portrayed in the media as a negative thing which could stop the government doing them when they should to avoid bad press ( see Portugal quarantine). 

Changes in policy based on the evidence should be a good thing! Let's see lots more of it.

 

[FestivalJamie]

1 minute ago, Leyrulion said:

There's something about the general focus on U turns that worries me. They're always portrayed in the media as a negative thing which could stop the government doing them when they should to avoid bad press ( see Portugal quarantine). 

Changes in policy based on the evidence should be a good thing! Let's see lots more of it.

 

Agreed. I was shocked that Portugal wasn’t added to the quarantine list last week, when they really should have been.

[JoeyT]

6 minutes ago, Leyrulion said:

There's something about the general focus on U turns that worries me. They're always portrayed in the media as a negative thing which could stop the government doing them when they should to avoid bad press ( see Portugal quarantine). 

Changes in policy based on the evidence should be a good thing! Let's see lots more of it.

I think one of the main issues with the u-turns is the time it takes our government to make them.

I completely agree that changes based on evidence are a good thing but do something as soon as the evidence is there not in 2-3 weeks time when we are in a situation where that can have grave consequence.

That's my take on it anyway..

Edited September 7, 2020 by JoeyT

[Fuzzy Afro]

My in laws are going to Portugal for two weeks on Thursday so I’m keeping an eye on the decision. They’re retired so quite happy to quarantine if need be. Only difference if that I might need to leave food shopping on their doorstep. 

[FestivalJamie]

25 minutes ago, JoeyT said:

Personally I don't think face coverings for shop workers is something i'd support. If everyone entering the shop is wearing a mask then the shop workers are protected aren't they? I thought that was the idea behind masks - protects others if you have the virus but not you from catching it?

Doesn’t stop outbreaks between the staff though. In most european countries face coverings are compulsory for all staff in shops, restaurants, bars etc. Notably Germany and Italy, and they are performing much better than we are at the moment.

But that won’t be just due to their more extensive use of face coverings, it will also be due to things like mandatory contact tracing and better test and trace system, use of a phone app, airport testing rather than unmonitored quarantine etc. These are all factors UK needs to dramatically improve on across the whole of the uk to stop a major second wave this winter.

Its all very well and good just being reactive to areas with current higher rates, but constantly being reactive and one step behind is what leads to uncontrollable growth. Being proactive is what will stop a national spike. Rather than being reactive and just focus on areas with high rates, tighten up measures across the whole country to prevent those places with lower rates from spiking.

edit: when I say tighten up measures across the whole country, I don’t mean ban people from seeing each other or shut things down, I mean improve on the smaller things like use and enforcement of face coverings and mandate contact tracing etc. Small things which can make a wider positive difference to our situation over the next weeks.

Edited September 7, 2020 by FestivalJamie

[JoeyT]

3 minutes ago, FestivalJamie said:

Its all very well and good just being reactive to areas with current higher rates, but constantly being reactive and one step behind is what leads to uncontrollable growth. Being proactive is what will stop a national spike. Rather than being reactive and just focus on areas with high rates, tighten up measures across the whole country to prevent those places with lower rates from spiking.

I can definitely see your point.

I think coming from an area with low case numbers where in reality it's quite possible to avoid going in to any cities or large towns thus putting yourself at any high risk I'd find it difficult to go back to a place where I can't allow my child to be held by her grandparents and so on.

It just doesn't sit right with me.

Not only that but with my wife being a teacher and me working full time we rely on both sets of our parents to look after our daughter during the week. Take that away and I can't work!

[Zoo Music Girl]

1 minute ago, JoeyT said:

I can definitely see your point.

I think coming from an area with low case numbers where in reality it's quite possible to avoid going in to any cities or large towns thus putting yourself at any high risk I'd find it difficult to go back to a place where I can't allow my child to be held by her grandparents and so on.

It just doesn't sit right with me.

Not only that but with my wife being a teacher and me working full time we rely on both sets of our parents to look after our daughter during the week. Take that away and I can't work!

I get what you're saying but there will be plenty of people living in the areas with high case numbers who have been super careful but just happen to live in the wrong area so are subject to greater restrictions. So it sucks for them just as much as it would for you.

I can't see there being a national lockdown again. Their policy right now just seems to be to blame everyone for being naughty.

[zahidf]

any takers?

 

Russia to offer its COVID-19 vaccine to volunteers

Russia will begin offering its COVID-19 vaccine to volunteers this week, Reuters reports, as part of a trial following the vaccine’s registration, the TASS news agency cited Health Minister Mikhail Murashko as saying on Monday.

[squirrelarmy]

2 minutes ago, zahidf said:

any takers?

For those willing to take the test please exit through the door to your left. 
 

Those unwilling to take the test please exit through the window to your right. 

[Ayrshire Chris]

3 minutes ago, Zoo Music Girl said:

I can't see there being a national lockdown again. Their policy right now just seems to be to blame everyone for being naughty.

Agree with that, lockdowns will be local and swift if it seems it’s spreading fast.  Workplaces and educational establishments will not close unless it’s really bad. You get the impression that the government is pushing the agenda that pub culture and the younger generation are to blame for the spread.

[Ayrshire Chris]

6 minutes ago, zahidf said:

any takers?

 

Russia to offer its COVID-19 vaccine to volunteers

Russia will begin offering its COVID-19 vaccine to volunteers this week, Reuters reports, as part of a trial following the vaccine’s registration, the TASS news agency cited Health Minister Mikhail Murashko as saying on Monday.

Don’t know why they need volunteers, all they need is their secret services to walk through a Moscow street and jab passers by with an umbrella tipped with vaccine. They’ve got history in delivering drugs that way. 

[st dan]

Operation herd immunity (predominantly amongst the younger/more generally fit and healthy) is well underway it would seem.
To be fair, I think it’s been a pretty well executed plan, conducted under the radar as to avoid any backlash - the hospital admissions and deaths have remained low which is the dream scenario here. All whilst the economy is starting the long road to recovery.  

[Lycra]

Concerning when Racing industry talks down prospects of Cheltenham festival going ahead at normal crowd capacity. A harbinger for mass gathering events next year 🤔

https://www.racingpost.com/news/latest/its-unlikely-doubts-over-full-capacity-cheltenham-festival-next-march/449452

[steviewevie]

9 minutes ago, st dan said:

Operation herd immunity (predominantly amongst the younger/more generally fit and healthy) is well underway it would seem.
To be fair, I think it’s been a pretty well executed plan, conducted under the radar as to avoid any backlash - the hospital admissions and deaths have remained low which is the dream scenario here. All whilst the economy is starting the long road to recovery.  

Not sure if that's actually the plan at the moment..

[zahidf]

Some bad news for a lot of you guys

[Ayrshire Chris]

2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Not sure if that's actually the plan at the moment..

Baldrick had better plans that Boris and Cummings 

[steviewevie]

4 minutes ago, Ayrshire Chris said:

Baldrick had better plans that Boris and Cummings 

a cumming plan

[Fuzzy Afro]

Hancock Q1 2021 is the most likely vaccine timeframe now, more optimistic than previous estimates. Small chance it could be the tail end of this year but most likely it’ll be Jan/Feb 2021. That’s a good outcome IMO. 

[Crazyfool01]

1 hour ago, JoeyT said:

Something clearly needs to be done in the areas which the majority of new cases are coming from. I don't see what enforcing more things on areas that are doing well at the moment will achieve other than to make people irate.

Airport testing you would think has to be introduced.

I thought contact tracing in pubs and restaurants was already mandatory?

Personally I don't think face coverings for shop workers is something i'd support. If everyone entering the shop is wearing a mask then the shop workers are protected aren't they? I thought that was the idea behind masks - protects others if you have the virus but not you from catching it?

so I work in a shop with around 400 colleagues and as you have probably seen I am very much behind the use of face coverings for colleagues for several reasons 

1) The more my colleagues wear them the more customers will also wear them and I won't hear comments like "well they dont want to protect themselves" 

2) minimum wage colleagues where sickness policies mean absence investigation and often unpaid initial sickness ( we dont get paid anything for our first 2 days absence ), will discourage people from isolating with symptoms 

3) social distancing between colleagues doesnt seem to exist and can be very difficult at times 

4) cold environments are perfect settings for covid ... plenty of those exist in supermarkets 

5) The mixture of students and the more retiring type that are vulnerable 

6) Chains of transmission ...  if there were an outbreak between colleagues that could spread elsewhere then  double facemasks increase the protection both ways , so anything to stop those chains developing is surely sensible 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-53996781 an outbreak recently among staff at a supermarket 

Edited September 7, 2020 by crazyfool1

[Crazyfool01]

17 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Some bad news for a lot of you guys

 

10 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

a cumming plan

is there a link ? 

[FestivalJamie]

4 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

so I work in a shop with around 400 colleagues and as you have probably seen I am very much behind the use of face coverings for colleagues for several reasons 

1) The more my colleagues wear them the more customers will also wear them and I won't hear comments like "well they dont want to protect themselves" 

2) minimum wage colleagues where sickness policies mean absence investigation and often unpaid initial sickness ( we dont get paid anything for our first 2 days absence ), will discourage people from isolating with symptoms 

3) social distancing between colleagues doesnt seem to exist and can be very difficult at times 

4) cold environments are perfect settings for covid ... plenty of those exist in supermarkets 

5) The mixture of students and the more retiring type that are vulnerable 

6) Chains of transmission ...  if there were an outbreak between colleagues that could spread elsewhere then  double facemasks increase the protection both ways , so anything to stop those chains developing is surely sensible 

Echo this!

Agree with all of the points, and I have to say over the last few days customer compliance of face coverings in shops has been going down; if staff have to wear them too it will increase overall compliance from the public.

Edited September 7, 2020 by FestivalJamie

[fred quimby]

6 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

 

is there a link ? 

I think @squirrelarmy will be disappointed by this. I think he wanted to pick up more recipe ideas

[steviewevie]

Next big u-turn could be the ending of the furlough scheme...

[JoeyT]

11 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

so I work in a shop with around 400 colleagues and as you have probably seen I am very much behind the use of face coverings for colleagues for several reasons 

1) The more my colleagues wear them the more customers will also wear them and I won't hear comments like "well they dont want to protect themselves" 

2) minimum wage colleagues where sickness policies mean absence investigation and often unpaid initial sickness ( we dont get paid anything for our first 2 days absence ), will discourage people from isolating with symptoms 

3) social distancing between colleagues doesnt seem to exist and can be very difficult at times 

4) cold environments are perfect settings for covid ... plenty of those exist in supermarkets 

5) The mixture of students and the more retiring type that are vulnerable 

6) Chains of transmission ...  if there were an outbreak between colleagues that could spread elsewhere then  double facemasks increase the protection both ways , so anything to stop those chains developing is surely sensible 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-53996781 an outbreak recently among staff at a supermarket 

Valid points however a couple of questions:

I don't see how wearing a mask will encourage customers visiting the store to wear one? If someone goes in to a shop not wearing a mask they already see a visual reminder of 99% of other customers wearing a mask so not sure how staff wearing masks changes this behaviour.

What are the pinch points in regards to social distancing in a shop? When i've been in to my local supermarkets the staff are properly distanced stacking shelves and those on tills are socially distanced from each other. Is there something "behind the scenes" which causes an issue?