When will this shit end?

[Punksnotdead]

5 hours ago, eFestivals said:

I've sat on my arse as requested/required. Do I get a clap? 😛 

You can have a clap from me. You're a hero for running a forum that keeps (most of) us sane! 🙂

[squirrelarmy]

Yorkshire is only the largest county and contains the second largest city counted by metropolitan population. Can’t see why they would need their own mass testing centre. 
 

[xxialac]

2 minutes ago, zahidf said:

On the target: I dont mind a 'high' target as it means they'll be working hard to meet it. They are better failing to meet 14 million but getting say 11 million, instead of aiming for and meeting 7 million by Feb.

I don't understand this argument.

Why on earth do they need additional motivation to a) do their jobs and more importantly b) prevent the loss of life of 1,000s of people and the livelihoods of 100,000s (if not millions)? 

Literally what could possibly be more motivating?

You'd have to be a sociopath not to try and deliver as many vaccinations as possible.

Having an impossible target could even be counter-productive, as will be demoralising to be so far off it.

[steviewevie]

1 hour ago, JoeyT said:

Just off the phone to track & trace.

Didn’t ask me for any details of people I had been in contact with bar who I live with. Therefore my Wife and Daughter.

Asked where I’d been between 25th Dec & 29th Dec but not the 48 hours before symptoms started which is what I thought they’d be most interested in?

All in all found it a bit vague.

Did at least confirm I can come out of isolation as of 00:01 on Tuesday. This conflicts with what my app says but I’d expect nothing less from our government!

world beating

[Copperface]

8 minutes ago, incident said:

Technically this one is being operated by NHT rather than NUH. Haven't seen a number quoted for the site but from what they've put in place so far, somewhere between 500 and 1,000 per day would sound about right in the short term and so it wouldn't come under the "mass" designation.

They're only predicting up to 1000 per day at the actual mass vaccination hub.........

[DeanoL]

3 hours ago, stuartbert two hats said:

Is it fuck.  That moment has passed, no matter what the woman that had the idea last year thinks.

I thought it was cringeworthy and silly at the time, but actually now think it was pretty important, and it should never have stopped. I was shocked by how quickly people stopped giving a shit about NHS workers as soon as this stopped. It shouldn't have had that sort of impact, but it did. 

There's something about getting people to spend 2 minutes thinking about how this effects other people (and having a chance to be performative about it) that I think really makes a difference. It stopping is one of the reasons I think lockdown compliance started to fall.

12 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

I think we can now safely say that allowing the Christmas relaxation was a massive mistake. Johnson and his government will have to answer for that eventually, that mistake was solely of their making due to massive levels of incompetence and a chasm of leadership. 

I don't think the relaxation is what's caused this. The relaxation was for one day and nearly half the country weren't included anyway. Anyone in tier 4, anyone who had family in tier 4, anyone who couldn't drive, anyone who lived more than a few hour's drive from family... in all honesty I don't actually know a single person who mixed within the rules on Christmas day. Most either gave up on it entirely or decided to fuck off the rules entirely and go with their original plan. And that latter group would have done that regardless of if the rules were relaxed or not.

Now, the last minute changing of the rules is what drove a lot of that latter behaviour, and that's on the government. But I genuinely think those mixing within the rules of at open schools for one day yesterday will have resulted in far more infections that those mixing within the rules on Christmas Day did. 

[steviewevie]

33 minutes ago, xxialac said:

If it goes up at the same rate we'll be at almost 100,000 within two weeks.

Doubt it will quite get to that level but there's much more pain to come and the government has completely failed us all.

hopefully lockdown will prevent it getting that high.

[squirrelarmy]

2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

hopefully lockdown will prevent it getting that high.

The figures we’re seeing now are from pre xmas mixing. The xmas and NYE numbers will start to show soon. We won’t see the effect of lockdown for a couple of weeks yet. 

Edited January 6, 2021 by squirrelarmy

[efcfanwirral]

 

4 minutes ago, xxialac said:

I don't understand this argument.

Why on earth do they need additional motivation to a) do their jobs and more importantly b) prevent the loss of life of 1,000s of people and the livelihoods of 100,000s (if not millions)? 

Literally what could possibly be more motivating?

You'd have to be a sociopath not to try and deliver as many vaccinations as possible.

Having an impossible target could even be counter-productive, as will be demoralising to be so far off it.

Are some of those at the top going to personally benefit from some kind of delay? A different vaccine that they are invested in? Some kind of mass testing scheme? private healthcare by the NHS being unable to cope and staff leaving because of the PTSD they'll be left with after all this?

The Feb target could just be to get people to comply, then there'll be another target after that. 

[Ozanne]

1 minute ago, DeanoL said:

I thought it was cringeworthy and silly at the time, but actually now think it was pretty important, and it should never have stopped. I was shocked by how quickly people stopped giving a shit about NHS workers as soon as this stopped. It shouldn't have had that sort of impact, but it did. 

There's something about getting people to spend 2 minutes thinking about how this effects other people (and having a chance to be performative about it) that I think really makes a difference. It stopping is one of the reasons I think lockdown compliance started to fall.

I don't think the relaxation is what's caused this. The relaxation was for one day and nearly half the country weren't included anyway. Anyone in tier 4, anyone who had family in tier 4, anyone who couldn't drive, anyone who lived more than a few hour's drive from family... in all honesty I don't actually know a single person who mixed within the rules on Christmas day. Most either gave up on it entirely or decided to fuck off the rules entirely and go with their original plan. And that latter group would have done that regardless of if the rules were relaxed or not.

Now, the last minute changing of the rules is what drove a lot of that latter behaviour, and that's on the government. But I genuinely think those mixing within the rules of at open schools for one day yesterday will have resulted in far more infections that those mixing within the rules on Christmas Day did. 

I think we can say that Christmas did and has had an impact, you just have to look at the figures to see the evidence of that. It doesn’t matter if it was 1 day or 5 that was initially allowed, household mixing will have spread the virus (and new variant) to different households which combined with being in winter means we have this perfect storm.

Schools haven’t been open for 2 weeks yet we still have the numbers we do. This government should never be forgiven for this colossal mistake. 

[gigpusher]

4 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

I thought it was cringeworthy and silly at the time, but actually now think it was pretty important, and it should never have stopped. I was shocked by how quickly people stopped giving a shit about NHS workers as soon as this stopped. It shouldn't have had that sort of impact, but it did. 

There's something about getting people to spend 2 minutes thinking about how this effects other people (and having a chance to be performative about it) that I think really makes a difference. It stopping is one of the reasons I think lockdown compliance started to fall.

I don't think the relaxation is what's caused this. The relaxation was for one day and nearly half the country weren't included anyway. Anyone in tier 4, anyone who had family in tier 4, anyone who couldn't drive, anyone who lived more than a few hour's drive from family... in all honesty I don't actually know a single person who mixed within the rules on Christmas day. Most either gave up on it entirely or decided to fuck off the rules entirely and go with their original plan. And that latter group would have done that regardless of if the rules were relaxed or not.

Now, the last minute changing of the rules is what drove a lot of that latter behaviour, and that's on the government. But I genuinely think those mixing within the rules of at open schools for one day yesterday will have resulted in far more infections that those mixing within the rules on Christmas Day did. 

However because people believed they would be seeing family or friends etc for those days they will have been out in shops in greater numbers buying presents etc in the weeks leading up to it so I do think it is a contributing factor. If people had been told to plan for a Christmas without seeing family people would have shopped differently etc in the run up to it. 

[DeanoL]

Just now, Ozanne said:

I think we can say that Christmas did and has had an impact, you just have to look at the figures to see the evidence of that. It doesn’t matter if it was 1 day or 5 that was initially allowed, household mixing will have spread the virus (and new variant) to different households which combined with being in winter means we have this perfect storm.

Christmas was always going to have an impact, because people were always going to ignore the rules and mix. If you think the one day of mixing on Christmas day that most people couldn't even do is the driver behind this then I don't agree.

The mistake was the point you made before: giving people hope, rather than prepping them for something different well in advance. I don't think the numbers today would be much different if mixing hadn't been allowed in some areas in some circumstances on Xmas day.

[zahidf]

10 minutes ago, xxialac said:

I don't understand this argument.

Why on earth do they need additional motivation to a) do their jobs and more importantly b) prevent the loss of life of 1,000s of people and the livelihoods of 100,000s (if not millions)? 

Literally what could possibly be more motivating?

You'd have to be a sociopath not to try and deliver as many vaccinations as possible.

Having an impossible target could even be counter-productive, as will be demoralising to be so far off it.

That's how targets work though. I agree with you in theory, but practically, they will work towards that target a LOT harder.

Its not an impossible target either. Its a difficult one. There is a difference!

[incident]

Just now, Copperface said:

They're only predicting up to 1000 per day at the actual mass vaccination hub.........

I don't know what the actual plans are - all I can say is that the way the space has been set up then during a 12 hour day and assuming sufficient staffing and supply, somewhere around 500 daily would feel like the space was being underutilised.

I still think that for the first couple months at least supply is going to be the single biggest constraint.

[zahidf]

6 minutes ago, efcfanwirral said:

 

Are some of those at the top going to personally benefit from some kind of delay? A different vaccine that they are invested in? Some kind of mass testing scheme? private healthcare by the NHS being unable to cope and staff leaving because of the PTSD they'll be left with after all this?

The Feb target could just be to get people to comply, then there'll be another target after that. 

I... don't think the govt wants to draw it out.

[xxialac]

A tale of two island masses:

Australia deaths in 300 days - 909

UK deaths in 1 day - 1041 

[DeanoL]

1 minute ago, gigpusher said:

However because people believed they would be seeing family or friends etc for those days they will have been out in shops in greater numbers buying presents etc in the weeks leading up to it so I do think it is a contributing factor. If people had been told to plan for a Christmas without seeing family people would have shopped differently etc in the run up to it. 

Oh yeah, the government's handling of Christmas overall is to blame. The government not extending the tier 4 mixing ban to everyone on Christmas day is just a drop in the ocean though.

[steviewevie]

London

[Deaf Nobby Burton]

I thought xmas mixing was pretty much banned, I spent Xmas day and NY on my own at home as a result. The government completely fucked up with their flip flopping but ultimately if xmas mixing is an issue then it’s because people ignored the rules.

[zahidf]

London is beginning to level off thankfully

 

[squirrelarmy]

2 minutes ago, xxialac said:

A tale of two island masses:

Australia deaths in 300 days - 909

UK deaths in 1 day - 1041 

We have fucked up very badly but we’re two very different islands. 
 

UK is a major international hub, Australia is far more isolated. 
 

The climates are vastly different as well as massively different population densities. 
 

It doesn’t mean the government isn’t to blame though for completely going about this the wrong way but it’s certainly not fair to compare us to Australia. 

[xxialac]

Johnson said that cancelling Christmas would be "inhuman". 

But 62,000 cases and rising and 1,000 deaths/day and rising - oh look I'm in fancy dress pretending to be a scientist on play day!

[steviewevie]

Just now, squirrelarmy said:

We have fucked up very badly but we’re two very different islands. 
 

UK is a major international hub, Australia is far more isolated. 
 

The climates are vastly different as well as massively different population densities. 
 

It doesn’t mean the government isn’t to blame though for completely going about this the wrong way but it’s certainly not fair to compare us to Australia. 

and their animals have pouches.

[gigpusher]

3 minutes ago, Deaf Nobby Burton said:

I thought xmas mixing was pretty much banned, I spent Xmas day and NY on my own at home as a result. The government completely fucked up with their flip flopping but ultimately if xmas mixing is an issue then it’s because people ignored the rules.

But families were allowed to mix in every area other than tier 4 and those in tier 4 thought they would be until a week before so If you think you'll be seeing your Mum, Dad and Gran you might go out and buy them a present whereas if you don't think you'll be seeing them you pop online and arrange a delivery. The behaviour change happens before the day itself and will be partly responsible for the situation. 

[steviewevie]