When will this shit end?

[Ozanne]

7 hours ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

Again not true, there was all the one metre plus stuff where two metres isn't possible and things like sit next to each other or diagonally etc.. etc.. 

Pubs and restaurants aren't any less safe than dozens of other places if the venue and the patrons are sensible which in my experience most are. 

Only being able to have any sort of social interaction with the two people you live with isn't social interaction and it isn't living - it's terribly bad for all of us, people need their own space people need to interact with others. 

It's incredibly bad for our boy, not seeing his friends not seeing his grandparents his aunties or just other people in general friends of ours. All of those interacts and influences make the future him - and do you know what's also pretty shit for him? Having parents that can't have any downtime or other social interactions. 

Humans aren't wired to be living like this. So while to you it might be about a distance in a pub or the fact that someone wants to get shit faced in the pub for many others it's far more than that - it's where the go to decompress, chew the fat with their mates, take their son or daughter, meet their parents whatever of course we could go to our local park in the pissing rain and that's gates are locked at dusk.... Or drive several hours to sit in out in our respective families gardens...because yep... That's right we can't stay over either.

Don't get me wrong there are people far far worse off - but it's not just about going for a pint or a meal out it's a out having a fucking purpose and an escape from the rinse and repeat of life since March. It's been dog shit since March, it's been bearable because of the sun earlier in the year it's been better being able to have some interaction and you know what it's really pretty shit when it's grey and miserable outside before you factor in the weather and this is here for the foreseeable... It's actually pretty soul destroying as there is literally nothing on the horizon to look forward to. There isn't even anything to look forward to about Xmas, because yep you guessed it... Same as every other day - same 4 walls, same people. 

 

We all knew this was coming this winter, so what did you do to prepare for it? I assume as this is having the impact on you that you are saying it does then you would’ve sat down and discussed it with people close to you to put some kind of plan in place?

Yes it’s been hard for everyone but this is a global pandemic it was never going to be easy. This is a virus that is so easily transmitted and one that can cause real damage to people so these actions do need to be taken. I’m sorry it having this impact on you but I really  believe these measures are necessary for all the reasons that have been gone over many times in this thread. Some humans do need that social interaction that is true but I feel if we can all for this short while (in the grand scheme of things) try to adjust, find ways other ways to handle this and different ways to get that human interaction through different social activities then it will help in all regards. 

Of course there’s still things to look forward to especially at Christmas, surely seeing your kid open their presents and having that festive time with them is a wonderful thing to look forward too; after all some don’t have that and will be spending the festive season completely alone with hardly any money to pay the bills let alone get presents. 

Edited October 13, 2020 by Ozanne

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, Ozanne said:

We all knew this was coming this winter, so what did you do to prepare for it? I assume as this is having the impact on you that you are saying it does then you would’ve sat down and discussed it with people close to you to put some kind of plan in place?

I built a bunker in the back yard.

[Ozanne]

Just now, steviewevie said:

I built a bunker in the back yard.

I’m really not trying to be obtuse when I say what did you do to prepare. I just think if you know something potentially difficult is coming down the line then it’s a good idea to be proactive and plan ahead. I’ve tried to do that with my family.

[steviewevie]

Some Tory MPs have set up a Northern Research Group.

[steviewevie]

Just now, Ozanne said:

I’m really not trying to be obtuse when I say what did you do to prepare. I just think if you know something potentially difficult is coming down the line then it’s a good idea to be proactive and plan ahead. I’ve tried to do that with my family.

We were supposed to be having a family get together over the new year for my Mum's 90th. Brother was coming over with his thousands of kids from US. We had hired a big house in some nice countryside place as no one lives anywhere big, my Mum lives in a flat. We realised in early summer that there was a good chance this wouldn't be happening so moved house booking to next summer...hopefully we can do it then! And we all knew early on that none of us would be travelling to visit each other this christmas. And I love going to the pub, but at this moment in my life it isn't a great loss not to meet people there...but if I was a bit younger it would be a major bummer...but that is the reality. We are in the middle of a pandemic. Hopefully next christmas will feel more normal and we can get back to the traditional greed and gluttony.

It is hard for kids though as RobertProswhateverthatis says above...completely understand that. The whole social interaction thing is very important...but it is what it is....and kids are actually very resiliient (saying that I could write a book on what my kid has been through the last few years..).

[steviewevie]

Trump has beaten the china virus.

[squirrelarmy]

7 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Trump has beaten the china virus.

Not even sure he had it. 

[Ozanne]

15 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

We were supposed to be having a family get together over the new year for my Mum's 90th. Brother was coming over with his thousands of kids from US. We had hired a big house in some nice countryside place as no one lives anywhere big, my Mum lives in a flat. We realised in early summer that there was a good chance this wouldn't be happening so moved house booking to next summer...hopefully we can do it then! And we all knew early on that none of us would be travelling to visit each other this christmas. And I love going to the pub, but at this moment in my life it isn't a great loss not to meet people there...but if I was a bit younger it would be a major bummer...but that is the reality. We are in the middle of a pandemic. Hopefully next christmas will feel more normal and we can get back to the traditional greed and gluttony.

It is hard for kids though as RobertProswhateverthatis says above...completely understand that. The whole social interaction thing is very important...but it is what it is....and kids are actually very resiliient (saying that I could write a book on what my kid has been through the last few years..).

Yeah man it’s really tough, my nephews haven’t really had much interaction with other kids and they are both under 3. But they are resilient and will adapt like we all have. We are in the best time for social distancing with the internet and connectivity; which that isn’t to downplay our current situation but imagine if this happened even a decade ago!

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

30 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

We all knew this was coming this winter, so what did you do to prepare for it? I assume as this is having the impact on you that you are saying it does then you would’ve sat down and discussed it with people close to you to put some kind of plan in place?

Yes it’s been hard for everyone but this is a global pandemic it was never going to be easy. This is a virus that is so easily transmitted and one that can cause real damage to people so these actions do need to be taken. I’m sorry it having this impact on you but I really  believe these measures are necessary for all the reasons that have been gone over many times in this thread. Some humans do need that social interaction that is true but I feel if we can all for this short while (in the grand scheme of things) try to adjust, find ways other ways to handle this and different ways to get that human interaction through different social activities then it will help in all regards. 

Of course there’s still things to look forward to especially at Christmas, surely seeing your kid open their presents and having that festive time with them is a wonderful thing to look forward too; after all some don’t have that and will be spending the festive season completely alone with hardly any money to pay the bills let alone get presents. 

So just how do you prepare for an indefinite period of time not being able to meet anyone inside during winter in the north of England? 

[steviewevie]

Just now, Ozanne said:

Yeah man it’s really tough, my nephews haven’t really had much interaction with other kids and they are both under 3. But they are resilient and will adapt like we all have. We are in the best time for social distancing with the internet and connectivity; which that isn’t to downplay our current situation but imagine if this happened even a decade ago!

Yeah, was thinking about that...what would have been like in the 70s/80s when I was a kid. Would have been easier for government to get message across as there were only 3 then 4 tv channels...and no social media or festival forums where everyone has an opinion. I guess to keep in touch people would just be phoning each other a lot, and even doing something called write a letter...but can't go do the group chat thing.

Did they tell people to stay home etc during the 1918 flu pandemic?

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

So just how do you prepare for an indefinite period of time not being able to meet anyone inside during winter in the north of England? 

You just tell yourself you're not going to meet anyone inside during the winter...grab a beer and put on the tv. That's what I am doing.

[steviewevie]

All over the news this morning on how sage advised the circuit break lockdown thing...but looks like government ignoring that advise, for now.

[Ozanne]

11 minutes ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

So just how do you prepare for an indefinite period of time not being able to meet anyone inside during winter in the north of England? 

There’s 2 areas mentally and socially. I think if you can prepare yourself mentally for it that’s part of the battle, so for me I knew this was coming as the virus was never going to go away so always had in my mind that we could go back into lockdown through the winter. I try to look at the positives in that which whilst hard does help, ie no going out means saving money, invest on something I’d like at home etc. 

Then the other part as I said is about discussing it with loved ones close to you saying how you are feeling, being honest and then trying to put together what you would do with these people if the various different stages of lockdown came. So if pubs shut, how would we socialise etc. It’s not idea I know (and there’s of course loads of other things) but there are ways we can help ourselves and others close to us.

Maybe it would help you if you kept a list everyday for 2 weeks of everything positive or good that’s happened to you? You might be surprised how much positive is happening!

Equally don’t be afraid to speak to someone professional too, it sounds like you are struggling so a counsellor of some kind might be ideal for you as we go through the winter.

There are plenty of things to do to prepare yourself for this winter and there’s still time now. I don’t mean to be all preachy at all but I genuinely think if people can prepare in advance it would help for the coming weeks and months. 

[Wellyboot]

2 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Maybe it would help you if you kept a list everyday for 2 weeks of everything positive or good that’s happened to you? You might be surprised how much positive is happening!

that is a really good idea, im going to try this!! Thank you

[WestCountryGirl]

5 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

 

Maybe it would help you if you kept a list everyday for 2 weeks of everything positive or good that’s happened to you? You might be surprised how much positive is happening!

 

 

3 minutes ago, Wellyboot said:

that is a really good idea, im going to try this!! Thank you

I actually did this even before first lockdown. Around mid-February I was very afraid, I was really feeling like "there is no real joy in anything until this is over, even when I have a happy moment, I remember and it's gone" and I realised that was a really really unhealthy way to be thinking. So I started just writing down something good about each day (entry 1 was "bought delicious banana scented shampoo and conditioner"). 

I kept it up for 4 months, and then I just stopped. Then I wrote a little note in there to reflect on the fact I'd just stopped and it ended with "Things aren't back to normal. Far from it. But things are still making me smile, and I guess that's the important thing."

[Zoo Music Girl]

My main worry at the moment is the government have just delayed too long before doing anything and what they've done won't be enough to avoid a total shit show in a few weeks. This feels so much like March, ignoring the science, trying to walk the populist path. I'm sure cases and deaths across the country will be though the roof in a few weeks and then everyone will be in tier 3, or more, for who knows how long. When a circuit breaker might have had an impact, who knows. 

Personally I can handle working from home, exercising from home and not seeing people for a while (I'm lucky to be working still, live with my partner and not have kids to worry about). The weather being shit will be tricky as sitting outside or going for a walk was so helpful last time. But my main worry as ever is going to be our parents getting it or my friend's chemo treatment being disrupted (or her getting it god forbid). Added of course to the horrible prospect of tens of thousands more deaths potentially.

It's a grim situation whatever way we look at it, but I do believe a vaccine is coming and this will be the last really shit bit. We just have to find ways to hold on a bit longer.

[eFestivals]

Just now, Zoo Music Girl said:

My main worry at the moment is the government have just delayed too long before doing anything

the delay is laughable.

It's taken them over a week to think up some tiers, and announce them for two days later, with all of this reported as happening from early last week in the press.

Which means they've *chosen* that delay. They've *chosen* to allow the infection rates to double.

[Zoo Music Girl]

2 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

the delay is laughable.

It's taken them over a week to think up some tiers, and announce them for two days later, with all of this reported as happening from early last week in the press.

Which means they've *chosen* that delay. They've *chosen* to allow the infection rates to double.

Basically yeah.

This bit from the BBC story is really damning too:

The newly-released Sage documents also showed advisers said NHS Test and Trace was only having a "marginal impact" and this would "likely decline further" unless the system expanded to keep up with the rise in cases and people were given support to enable them to self-isolate.

A separate document from 17 September stated that Sage believed curfews in bars, pubs, cafes and restaurants were also "likely to have a marginal impact".

Test and trace and curfews having "marginal impact" despite being sold as viable solutions to the public. They're so full of shit.

[Ozanne]

20 minutes ago, Wellyboot said:

that is a really good idea, im going to try this!! Thank you

That’s ok, it’s something I learnt from counselling. It might help some and it might not but it can’t look to try to focus on the positives.

I do find it funny how I put together that post which then has been downvoted. I’m only trying to help. Sorry if it’s annoyed someone. 

[squirrelarmy]

It’s basically genocide through inaction. It’s no coincidence that the people being affected the most are the ones that depend the most on government hand outs. 
 

The elderly in care homes, are no longer contributing income tax so they let the virus rip through them. Liverpool has been a bane on the Tories since the 80s, let them suffer the most.
 

The worse part is that they are not only going to get away with it but they are actually going to make massive personal profits from it. 

[MEGABOWL]

9 minutes ago, Zoo Music Girl said:

My main worry at the moment is the government have just delayed too long before doing anything and what they've done won't be enough to avoid a total shit show in a few weeks. This feels so much like March, ignoring the science, trying to walk the populist path. I'm sure cases and deaths across the country will be though the roof in a few weeks and then everyone will be in tier 3, or more, for who knows how long. When a circuit breaker might have had an impact, who knows. 

Personally I can handle working from home, exercising from home and not seeing people for a while (I'm lucky to be working still, live with my partner and not have kids to worry about). The weather being shit will be tricky as sitting outside or going for a walk was so helpful last time. But my main worry as ever is going to be our parents getting it or my friend's chemo treatment being disrupted (or her getting it god forbid). Added of course to the horrible prospect of tens of thousands more deaths potentially.

It's a grim situation whatever way we look at it, but I do believe a vaccine is coming and this will be the last really shit bit. We just have to find ways to hold on a bit longer.

 

8 hours ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

Again not true, there was all the one metre plus stuff where two metres isn't possible and things like sit next to each other or diagonally etc.. etc.. 

Pubs and restaurants aren't any less safe than dozens of other places if the venue and the patrons are sensible which in my experience most are. 

Only being able to have any sort of social interaction with the two people you live with isn't social interaction and it isn't living - it's terribly bad for all of us, people need their own space people need to interact with others. 

It's incredibly bad for our boy, not seeing his friends not seeing his grandparents his aunties or just other people in general friends of ours. All of those interacts and influences make the future him - and do you know what's also pretty shit for him? Having parents that can't have any downtime or other social interactions. 

Humans aren't wired to be living like this. So while to you it might be about a distance in a pub or the fact that someone wants to get shit faced in the pub for many others it's far more than that - it's where the go to decompress, chew the fat with their mates, take their son or daughter, meet their parents whatever of course we could go to our local park in the pissing rain and that's gates are locked at dusk.... Or drive several hours to sit in out in our respective families gardens...because yep... That's right we can't stay over either.

Don't get me wrong there are people far far worse off - but it's not just about going for a pint or a meal out it's a out having a fucking purpose and an escape from the rinse and repeat of life since March. It's been dog shit since March, it's been bearable because of the sun earlier in the year it's been better being able to have some interaction and you know what it's really pretty shit when it's grey and miserable outside before you factor in the weather and this is here for the foreseeable... It's actually pretty soul destroying as there is literally nothing on the horizon to look forward to. There isn't even anything to look forward to about Xmas, because yep you guessed it... Same as every other day - same 4 walls, same people. 

 

I hope the confidence about a Vaccine is well placed as if it doesn’t happen in the next few months this whole thing collapses. The latter post nails how a lot of people are feeling now and exactly why it isn’t going to last. A situation where people can go to work but not do anything else or see the people they care about is unsustainable (isn’t it, the former East Germany?) because of what it does to their Mental Health. People just aren’t wired to live that way.
 

The situation isn’t helped of course by our Leaders taking the wrong decision at almost every point and destroying widespread trust in their Advice and Regulations. I’d suspect that was deliberate but detecting a Grand Plan gives them more credit than they deserve. It’s almost always just witless incompetence.

[Zoo Music Girl]

1 minute ago, MEGABOWL said:

 

I hope the confidence about a Vaccine is well placed as if it doesn’t happen in the next few months this whole thing collapses. The latter post nails how a lot of people are feeling now and exactly why it isn’t going to last. A situation where people can go to work but not do anything else or see the people they care about is unsustainable (isn’t it, the former East Germany?) because of what it does to their Mental Health. People just aren’t wired to live that way.
 

The situation isn’t helped of course by our Leaders taking the wrong decision at almost every point and destroying widespread trust in their Advice and Regulations. I’d suspect that was deliberate but detecting a Grand Plan gives them more credit than they deserve. It’s almost always just witless incompetence.

I know a vaccine isn't guaranteed at all, but there are reasons to be hopeful. So many now seem to have just decided it's not happening when the trials are still ongoing and we've not been told otherwise.

Trust me, I get the mental health issues and neither me or my loved ones are immune to that too. I honestly don't get what the other options are at this stage, though. Just let it rip through the population and see thousands turned away from hospital, both for Covid and other illnesses? Do people want that?

Government is completely responsible for mishandling this from day one, though. I hope people don't forget that. They dicked around over summer and wasted money on a tracing system that is not fit for purpose. 

[Ozanne]

1 minute ago, Zoo Music Girl said:

I know a vaccine isn't guaranteed at all, but there are reasons to be hopeful. So many now seem to have just decided it's not happening when the trials are still ongoing and we've not been told otherwise.

Trust me, I get the mental health issues and neither me or my loved ones are immune to that too. I honestly don't get what the other options are at this stage, though. Just let it rip through the population and see thousands turned away from hospital, both for Covid and other illnesses? Do people want that?

Government is completely responsible for mishandling this from day one, though. I hope people don't forget that. They dicked around over summer and wasted money on a tracing system that is not fit for purpose. 

The Government are completely responsible for this. They had the time from July to get this all in place but they chose to dick around breaking international law and camping in someone’s garden in Scotland. They need to go. 

[parsonjack]

1 minute ago, Zoo Music Girl said:

I know a vaccine isn't guaranteed at all, but there are reasons to be hopeful. So many now seem to have just decided it's not happening when the trials are still ongoing and we've not been told otherwise.

At other times I'd be very much in the 'no news is good news' camp, at the moment though I feel we really need some news....it's a bit too quiet in recent weeks.

[JoeyT]

5 minutes ago, MEGABOWL said:

I hope the confidence about a Vaccine is well placed as if it doesn’t happen in the next few months this whole thing collapses. The latter post nails how a lot of people are feeling now and exactly why it isn’t going to last. A situation where people can go to work but not do anything else or see the people they care about is unsustainable (isn’t it, the former East Germany?) because of what it does to their Mental Health. People just aren’t wired to live that way.

Careful because anytime the vaccine effort is doubted you get the inevitable "there's so many in development one will definitely work" and "there's never been this much thrown at finding / making a vaccine before" arguments thrown back at you.

Reality is that we've been "weeks away" from a vaccine for about 2 months now and it doesn't feel like the latest feeling that we'll get results back in October will come to fruition either!