When will this shit end?

[Mellotr0n]

Blimey. Israel aren't messing around - they have vaccinated nearly 10% of their population already.

Smaller, richer countries vaccinating high %s quickly will provide very useful data/guidance on what sort of level is needed to stem spread/hosps/deaths etc.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, zahidf said:

But I was referring to a tweet specifically comparing the UK to China.  Everyone else is trying to widen it out! I'm not saying the UK is the best in the world

 

The morale of this is that you go hard and early to stamp down on the spread of the virus. You take the tough decisions early for longer term gains, the UK was afraid to do this and we are seeing the effects of that now. 

[zahidf]

Just now, Ozanne said:

The morale of this is that you go hard and early to stamp down on the spread of the virus. You take the tough decisions early for longer term gains, the UK was afraid to do this and we are seeing the effects of that now. 

And I'm saying China isn't a country we should be taking lessons from in this regard.

[Matt42]

I used to think China was flubbing the numbers and I reckon there’s still a chance they are - but I’m happy to take a massive L on this. Western countries fucked up big time with this virus. Western exceptionalism and pure arrogance has really caused irreversible damage. 

I think in recent history we’ve had too many examples of viruses abroad causing a massive stir and then somehow not making it here. I honestly think the first problem with this pandemic was that a lot of people thought it was a fuss over nothing, obviously not helped by senior figures in politics echoing these views.

By the time western governments pulled their socks up and tried to do something we were already on the backfoot. South Korea i reckon handled COVID-19 the best out of any country. They are a huge country who had a fast outbreak, but they managed to contain it and deployed their efforts to keep it under control. I think NZ kept it under control because they never really had a ‘gigantic’ outbreak, so I don’t really see it as the same issue. SK in my mind is one of the only countries I can think of which actually recovered from a big outbreak.

[Crazyfool01]

7 minutes ago, zahidf said:

But I was referring to a tweet specifically comparing the UK to China.  Everyone else is trying to widen it out! I'm not saying the UK is the best in the world

 

The tweet initially talked in terms of China ... but broadened out to include the how we compared to others ... so It’s fair if you didn’t read it entirely then that would be a reasonable assumption 

 

 

[zahidf]

Just now, crazyfool1 said:

The tweet initially talked in terms of China ... but broadened out to include the how we compared to others ... so It’s fair if you didn’t read it entirely then that would be a reasonable assumption 

 

 

Oh I agree with that.  I just don't like the ' we should have done what China did ' aspects of this

[Crazyfool01]

Just now, zahidf said:

Oh I agree with that.  I just don't like the ' we should have done what China did ' aspects of this

Do you not think we can learn from some of how China responded ? We need to learn from this going forward and I would think totally dismissing a country with very large populous and there handling completely is not the way we should go ... 

[Ayrshire Chris]

Our response is reactive when it should have been proactive.  Our government seems to wait until the shit hits the fan then they switch it off. The Xmas and new year hols were an ideal time for a lock down.  Schools shut, most workplaces shut apart from the essential places like supermarkets etc.  Instead we have limited gatherings and many have just ignored the instructions.  The time for a big party is when this is all over, now, that will be a real happy  new year! 

[Matt42]

Read this tweet and the replies below.

This is why we are where we are. British ‘exceptionalism’.

 

[Deaf Nobby Burton]

8 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

Do you not think we can learn from some of how China responded ? We need to learn from this going forward and I would think totally dismissing a country with very large populous and there handling completely is not the way we should go ... 

I think when your looking at China you need to consider that they’re ground zero for the pandemic. The virus would’ve been circulating there for a long time before the first doctors noticed the pneumonia cases stacking up, this is evidenced in the antibody figures showing 10% of Wuhan residents had it. Consider how long the virus was here before 10% of us have had, it, I’m not sure we are even there yet even now. They were building massive hospitals even before they’d told the rest of us HTH transmission was possible. Their response was as much about trying to cover up and contain something from the rest of the world as it was anything else. 

Edited December 31, 2020 by Deaf Nobby Burton

[zahidf]

7 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

Do you not think we can learn from some of how China responded ? We need to learn from this going forward and I would think totally dismissing a country with very large populous and there handling completely is not the way we should go ... 

Some of the stuff can be used. But the keeping people locked up in apartments at gunpoint is basically the main way they did it, and cutting down on all reporting on the issues.

[Sasperella]

16 minutes ago, Matt42 said:

Read this tweet and the replies below.

This is why we are where we are. British ‘exceptionalism’.

 

This tweet is obviously ridiculous, but a lot of the replies have restored my faith in humanity. And they're quite funny. 

[Guest]

24 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Oh I agree with that.  I just don't like the ' we should have done what China did ' aspects of this

No one said that though.

We can learn lessons from parts of how they handle the pandemic. As I’ve said that doesn’t mean we are advocating armed guards at houses or whatever but there certainly are measures other countries can look at and learn from. We can all learn from others.

[Fuzzy Afro]

Just now, Ozanne said:

No one said that though.

We can learn lessons from parts of how they handle the pandemic. As I’ve said that doesn’t mean we are advocating armed guards at houses or whatever but there certainly are measures other countries can look at and learn from. We can all learn from others.

Are you gonna name them or....?

[ShakeyCrash]

You would hope that the English government would learn from other nations (whether it's what they have done right or what they have done wrong), but it's difficult to see when they have done this.  Recent example would be what happened in Wales (numbers soaring after firebreak because restrictions were not tight enough the other side) now being seen in England. 

The other things I think need to be understood is the nature of the British public (we really don't like being told what to do it seems), the state of our health service, and the general health of the nation.  I don't have the answers but really hope that these are being looked into.

My main point is you can take what other nations have done (or haven't), and apply them to your nation if you understand your own individual nuances.  This has not been done from what I can see.  The approach should have been plan for the worst, hope for the best but has actually been plan for the best, hope for the best.  

On the schools thing, I have always maintained they should be kept open largely shaped on personal circumstance (I have two young children in the formative stages of their life) BUT with the vaccine news there was a real opportunity to delay the return.  To those who work in schools, would there have been huge challenges in delaying return by a week or two and merely shortening the summer holidays for example?

[Crazyfool01]

3 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

Are you gonna name them or....?

quite a simple one to start then ... do you agree that the harsher the lockdown the better it is to control the virus and bring down infections ? yes or no ? 

[philipsteak]

If anyone's still looking for something to do for NYE and thinks 2020 hasn't quite been awful enough

[Fuzzy Afro]

9 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

quite a simple one to start then ... do you agree that the harsher the lockdown the better it is to control the virus and bring down infections ? yes or no ? 

Yes. That doesn’t mean that it should necessarily be done though. 

[Crazyfool01]

Just now, Fuzzy Afro said:

Yes. That doesn’t mean that it should necessarily be done though. 

ok so do you think the longer the pandemic continues the more damaging it is for jobs ? economy ? mental health and the NHS ? I say the mental health bit because for me .... im finding things harder now than I was early on .... 

[Deaf Nobby Burton]

2 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

ok so do you think the longer the pandemic continues the more damaging it is for jobs ? economy ? mental health and the NHS ? I say the mental health bit because for me .... im finding things harder now than I was early on .... 

Nobody in Europe has eradicated covid though, so whichever way you slice it we’ll be in and out of lockdowns one way or another, until enough of us are vaccinated.

Edited December 31, 2020 by Deaf Nobby Burton

[zahidf]

 

[Chapple12345]

A nice little thought for the day 🙂

[Crazyfool01]

1 minute ago, Deaf Nobby Burton said:

Nobody in Europe has eradicated covid though, so whichever way you slice it we’ll be in and out of lockdowns one way or another, until enough of us are vaccinated.

yep but the shorter and harder those lockdowns the more effective they are .... look at our case numbers in comparison to europe now .... they introduced curfews  I think it was a little before our pre Christmas lockdown which are a harsher restriction .... I know where I would rather be right now 

[Copperface]

Sacha Lord interviewed on 5 Live this morning, talking about tonight's streaming Hacienda NYE party, Parklife in September next year, and festival/live entertainment prospects in general for 2021. 

Starts at 2:40:09 in...specifically asked about festivals at 2:44:05

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m000qms2

Edited December 31, 2020 by Copperface

[Fuzzy Afro]

8 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

ok so do you think the longer the pandemic continues the more damaging it is for jobs ? economy ? mental health and the NHS ? I say the mental health bit because for me .... im finding things harder now than I was early on .... 

The mental health point is a tricky one because I do agree that a longer pandemic is bad for mental health, but also that a very very strict Wuhan style lockdown would have been disastrous for mental health in itself. I think our original lockdown which still allowed exercise but comfortably got R below 1.0 was probably about right. The problem is that unless you literally eliminate the virus altogether (and close borders), it’ll just rebound when you relax the rules. The original lockdown probably started too late and finished too early, but I don’t agree that it wasn’t strict enough.