Arcade Fire

[gizmoman]

3 hours ago, Alex DeLarge said:

It's alright if you want to seperate the art from the artist, but pretending there's nothing wrong with a man well into his forties messaging 18/19 year old girls is okay is bizarre. Not to mention showing up at women's houses when they asked him not to.

I know this forum loves the band and leans fairly male heavy, but we can recognise that Win sending pictures of his knob to girls young enough to be in sixth form is worth condemning. Sort it out lads. If it was your mate you'd probably disown them.

He wasn't well into his forties,

"All three women were devoted Arcade Fire fans between the ages of 18 and 23 at the start of their interactions with Butler, which took place during overlapping periods from 2016 to 2020, when he was between 36 and 39."

He was pushing 40 and your post is spot on regarding the morality of it, no one so far has pointed out that since these girls were fans they presumably knew he was married before "interacting" with him, pretty low conduct from them all I guess.

[Porcelina]

There is one simple thread that runs through all of these things.

Just because a girl/woman wants to talk to you, doesn't mean she wants to sleep with you. Most women do not approach men like most men approach women.

It's that simple. The guy is a creep at best and a serial offender if you take everything the women have said at largely face value (who are anonymous with no reason to lie?). I've seen them 11x since 2007 and will be letting my tickets die for Thursday and hoping most of London does the same.

[kingcrawler]

I’ve never seen so many tickets listed in Twickets for a tour before. Fair play to the people still putting theirs up at face value when there’s unsold ones at 70% off.

[Suprefan]

2 hours ago, kingcrawler said:

I’ve never seen so many tickets listed in Twickets for a tour before. Fair play to the people still putting theirs up at face value when there’s unsold ones at 70% off.

Good. But I want to know if the people selling them are not going to attend if they dont sell. Thats going to be bigger than the ticket listings.

[zzzfest]

Surprise surprise, Glasgow was 90 % full. The poor turnout is a fake news.

Again, a great show. After attending two nights, though, now I’m starting to feel the same as another poster comments — I prefer the last tour, too. By unfortunate luck of rotation, I couldn’t hear some of their big tunes they played in Dublin and Manchester, e.g. Neighborhood #1 (Tunnels) and No Cars Go, which adds to personal disappointment.

My image about them is certainly spoilt by Win’s disgrace, but the brilliance of their music and musicianship remains unchanged.
 

[clarkete]

9 hours ago, gizmoman said:

... no one so far has pointed out that since these girls were fans they presumably knew he was married before "interacting" with him, pretty low conduct from them all I guess.

If you take their statements as given then most if not all of the girls have not done anything at all that could be described as "low"

https://pitchfork.com/news/arcade-fires-win-butler-accused-of-sexual-misconduct-by-multiple-women-frontman-responds/

[clarkete]

31 minutes ago, zzzfest said:

Surprise surprise, Glasgow was 90 % full. The poor turnout is a fake news.

It's a band with a huge following and you can easily find tickets for most of their gigs between 20% and 45% off, so surely it's not that great a surprise that some folks snap them up? 

[zzzfest]

7 hours ago, clarkete said:

It's a band with a huge following and you can easily find tickets for most of their gigs between 20% and 45% off, so surely it's not that great a surprise that some folks snap them up? 

You can’t overestimate “some folks”.

For example, at the time of writing this post, 54 sellers offer 112 tickets in total for tomorrow’s London O2 Arena show (including face value) on Twicket. From the viewpoint of the venue’s capacity of 20,000, and especially considering floor standing in AF’s case, they are a tiny fraction on the whole.

[gigpusher]

4 minutes ago, zzzfest said:

You can’t overestimate “some folks”.

For example, at the time of writing this post, 54 sellers offer 112 tickets in total for tomorrow’s London O2 Arena show (including face value) on Twicket. From the viewpoint of the venue’s capacity of 20,000, and especially considering floor standing in AF’s case, they are a tiny fraction on the whole.

At Manchester I'd say it was between 70-80% full. I know 2 people who took the decision just not to go and didn't even attempt to sell their tickets. I personally didn't feel I could justify wasting the £170 approx that we had paid for the tickets but me going didn't mean that I am ok with his actions. I have said he'll never get another penny from me again and had I been able to get a refund I certainly would have chosen that option but during a cost of living crisis to expect people to give up expensive tickets is quite a privileged position. The true test will be how people react if a new tour were to be announced or if they release new material. 

Undoubtedly there were people in the audience cheering from the start who probably wouldn't care what he did but I don't think I was alone in feeling like I had been extorted to be part of the audience and I'd be very surprised if they are able to perform in a venue that big again for quite some time to come. Not unless they ditch Win Butler anyway. 

[gizmoman]

8 hours ago, clarkete said:

If you take their statements as given then most if not all of the girls have not done anything at all that could be described as "low"

https://pitchfork.com/news/arcade-fires-win-butler-accused-of-sexual-misconduct-by-multiple-women-frontman-responds/

O.K. Maybe they were just incredibly naive, meeting up alone with a married man twice your age, isn't very smart. If they really believed it was for purely platontic reasons they would have been better off taking someone with them or asking if Win's wife could come along too. None of this excuses Win, they were much younger and maybe starstruck, if these people put themselves in a vunerable position and he exploited them that is entirely his fault and he deserves the consequences.

[GeezLouise]

31 minutes ago, gizmoman said:

O.K. Maybe they were just incredibly naive, meeting up alone with a married man twice your age, isn't very smart. If they really believed it was for purely platontic reasons they would have been better off taking someone with them or asking if Win's wife could come along too. None of this excuses Win, they were much younger and maybe starstruck, if these people put themselves in a vunerable position and he exploited them that is entirely his fault and he deserves the consequences.

Young'uns tend to be like that. 

[Simsy]

32 minutes ago, gizmoman said:

O.K. Maybe they were just incredibly naive, meeting up alone with a married man twice your age, isn't very smart. If they really believed it was for purely platontic reasons they would have been better off taking someone with them or asking if Win's wife could come along too. None of this excuses Win, they were much younger and maybe starstruck, if these people put themselves in a vunerable position and he exploited them that is entirely his fault and he deserves the consequences.

Who's to blame? Oh, of course, it's the victims.

[stuie]

9 minutes ago, Simsy said:

Who's to blame? Oh, of course, it's the victims.

 

42 minutes ago, gizmoman said:

None of this excuses Win, they were much younger and maybe starstruck, if these people put themselves in a vunerable position and he exploited them that is entirely his fault and he deserves the consequences.

People are still trying to cause arguments in this thread then I see. 

[The Other Steve]

1 hour ago, gigpusher said:

At Manchester I'd say it was between 70-80% full.

I agree with that. 5 mins before stage time you could still walk to the front and be a metre from the stage.  When they came on stage in the middle of the arena everyone just wandered over to the middle no problem and then back to the front when they moved back to the main stage.  Again, for the encore when they moved to the middle you could just wander over and there was loads of space on the floor.  The crowd was predominantly excited and well into it.  Myself, though, I just couldn't enjoy it at all and just stood there for the whole gig.  In hindsight I shouldn't have gone and this was my worst arena gig as opposed to the greatest which was Arcade Fire in 2018.  

[Porcelina]

Loads of free tickets were given away on Tickets For Good (lol) and Blue Lights.

They might have faces in the crowds but the venues don't have the revenue to match it.

[chazwwe]

1 hour ago, gizmoman said:

O.K. Maybe they were just incredibly naive, meeting up alone with a married man twice your age, isn't very smart. If they really believed it was for purely platontic reasons they would have been better off taking someone with them or asking if Win's wife could come along too. None of this excuses Win, they were much younger and maybe starstruck, if these people put themselves in a vunerable position and he exploited them that is entirely his fault and he deserves the consequences.

And blocked. You victim blaming POS.

[Comfy Bean]

10 hours ago, zzzfest said:

Surprise surprise, Glasgow was 90 % full. The poor turnout is a fake news..
 

Agree with this. I was expecting a much smaller Monday night crowd. Queues at the bars and the merch were huge. 
Band were on top form but I doubt we’ll see them again for a long time.

[gizmoman]

41 minutes ago, Simsy said:

Who's to blame? Oh, of course, it's the victims.

I made it clear Win's to blame for his abusive actions, suggesting young girls shouldn't go alone to meet older married men doesn't mean I blame them for what happened, in an ideal world women would be safe in any situation, but we are not there yet, would you be happy to let your teenage daughter go alone to meet a married 36 year old? I wouldn't, I'd be advising her not to go alone, that doesn't mean I think male aggression is right or ever justified but I wouldn't want her to be put in a possibly risky situation.

[clarkete]

3 minutes ago, gizmoman said:

I made it clear Win's to blame for his abusive actions, suggesting young girls shouldn't go alone to meet older married men doesn't mean I blame them for what happened, in an ideal world women would be safe in any situation, but we are not there yet, would you be happy to let your teenage daughter go alone to meet a married 36 year old? I wouldn't, I'd be advising her not to go alone, that doesn't mean I think male aggression is right or ever justified but I wouldn't want her to be put in a possibly risky situation.

You said 'pretty low conduct" previously, which seemed at the very least a poor choice of words. 

If a person is younger, perhaps an aspiring artist of some type and has the chance to meet someone with wealth and helpful connections they may take it at face value and think it's just a drink, especially if they and he are in relationships and have explicitly said to him they aren't interested in anything further. 

[gizmoman]

2 minutes ago, clarkete said:

You said 'pretty low conduct" previously, which seemed at the very least a poor choice of words. 

If a person is younger, perhaps an aspiring artist of some type and has the chance to meet someone with wealth and helpful connections they may take it at face value and think it's just a drink, especially if they and he are in relationships and have explicitly said to him they aren't interested in anything further. 

Yep, I did, and you may well be right, I may have been a bit unfair, we simply don't know what was in their minds at the time, there are 4 victims, and no doubt 4 different scenarios and motives for meeting him. To clarify once more, his motives are plain to see and there is no doubt he was in the wrong.

[Simsy]

21 minutes ago, gizmoman said:

I made it clear Win's to blame for his abusive actions, suggesting young girls shouldn't go alone to meet older married men doesn't mean I blame them for what happened, in an ideal world women would be safe in any situation, but we are not there yet, would you be happy to let your teenage daughter go alone to meet a married 36 year old? I wouldn't, I'd be advising her not to go alone, that doesn't mean I think male aggression is right or ever justified but I wouldn't want her to be put in a possibly risky situation.

I can't say how I'd feel from a parent's perspective as I don't have kids.

But you said they were naive, not very smart, should've taken someone with them (but it's all Win's fault). This sounds just as much victim blaming as people who say things like "she shouldn't have worn that outfit - but it is the rapist's fault" or "she shouldn't have nagged him so much - but it is the murderer's fault". 

[zzzfest]

50 minutes ago, Porcelina said:

Loads of free tickets were given away on Tickets For Good (lol) and Blue Lights.

Both are for NHS workers (I’m not). I can’t see the upcoming events on Tickets For Gold as it requires sign in, but Blue Light Tickets offers none of Tomorrow’s AF@O2 Arena show as far as I can see.

Edited September 6, 2022 by zzzfest

[Matt42]

23 hours ago, Alex DeLarge said:

It's alright if you want to seperate the art from the artist, but pretending there's nothing wrong with a man well into his forties messaging 18/19 year old girls is okay is bizarre. Not to mention showing up at women's houses when they asked him not to.

I know this forum loves the band and leans fairly male heavy, but we can recognise that Win sending pictures of his knob to girls young enough to be in sixth form is worth condemning. Sort it out lads. If it was your mate you'd probably disown them.

Nah man it’s because he has proper tunes. It can’t be that bad if he has proper tunes.

And I don’t want to stop listening and watching a band who have proper good tunes.

[Hugh Jass II]

24 minutes ago, Matt42 said:

Nah man it’s because he has proper tunes. It can’t be that bad if he has proper tunes.

And I don’t want to stop listening and watching a band who have proper good tunes.

Fucking hell Matt, I know you hate people who like bands but this is the worst kind of point scoring.

[gizmoman]

10 minutes ago, Simsy said:

I can't say how I'd feel from a parent's perspective as I don't have kids.

But you said they were naive, not very smart, should've taken someone with them (but it's all Win's fault). This sounds just as much victim blaming as people who say things like "she shouldn't have worn that outfit - but it is the rapist's fault" or "she shouldn't have nagged him so much - but it is the murderer's fault". 

I do, four grown up daughters, I'm clearly older and have different attitudes to most on here, I'll try once again to explain,

If one of my kids leaves a club late at night and starts to walk home alone and someone attacks them, my reaction would be "why didn't you get a taxi?" that doesn't mean I think it was their fault they got attacked, but pointing out they could have taken a safer option. (leaving aside the fact that even getting into a taxi on your own has it's risks). It's shit that girls have to think this way, they should be able to walk the streets at any time but the reality is that there are a minority of predatory men about. I'm not suggesting girls should live in fear, but be aware of risk.