When will this shit end?

[efcfanwirral]

Presumably the government's tactic of assuming something won't happen just because they say it won't happen isn't quite working as planned....

[xxialac]

Yes. The practical way to have done this I feel would be;

SOCIAL HOURS  - 8am to 8pm - most vulnerable and shielding, 75+ (GP CLINICS AND OTHER SAFE/CONVENIENT VENUES, APPOINTMENTS)

SOCIAL HOURS - 8am to 8pm - 55-75 y/s (MEGACENTRES, APPOINTMENTS)

ANTISOCIAL HOURS - 8pm to 5am - under 55s, with different age groups allowed to come at different hours e.g. 18-21 year olds at 4am-5am (MEGACENTRES, WALK-INS)

That way you could use up the 'antisocial' slots efficiently on the people who are most likely to use them and most able to be able to get to the venue.

Is it unfair that some young people will be vaccinated before some older people? No, as they aren't depriving older people of a slot. Plus vaccinating them has the knock on effect of protecting older people.

 

 

Edited January 13, 2021 by xxialac

[Leyrulion]

7 minutes ago, xxialac said:

Yes. The practical way to have done this I feel would be;

SOCIAL HOURS  - 8am to 8pm - most vulnerable and shielding, 75+ (GP CLINICS AND OTHER SAFE/CONVENIENT VENUES, APPOINTMENTS)

SOCIAL HOURS - 8am to 8pm - 55-75 y/s (MEGACENTRES, APPOINTMENTS)

ANTISOCIAL HOURS - 8pm to 5am - under 55s, with different age groups allowed to come at different hours e.g. 18-21 year olds at 4am-5am (MEGACENTRES, WALK-INS)

That way you could use up the 'antisocial' slots efficiently on the people who are most likely to use them and most able to be able to get to the venue.

Is it unfair that some young people will be vaccinated before some older people? No, as they aren't depriving older people of a slot. Plus vaccinating them has the knock on effect of protecting older people.

 

 

Absolutely but it depends on supply of vaccine and people to do it. They're currently training up tens of thousands of volunteer vaccinators (I'll hopefully be one of them) so once enough are trained let's do 24 hours. 

I'd gladly be vaccinating people in the anti social hours shifts, think of it as practice for the overnight volunteer shift at Glasto.

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

7 minutes ago, xxialac said:

Yes. The practical way to have done this I feel would be;

SOCIAL HOURS  - 8am to 8pm - most vulnerable and shielding, 75+ (GP CLINICS AND OTHER SAFE/CONVENIENT VENUES, APPOINTMENTS)

SOCIAL HOURS - 8am to 8pm - 55-75 y/s (MEGACENTRES, APPOINTMENTS)

ANTISOCIAL HOURS - 8pm to 5am - under 55s, with different age groups allowed to come at different hours e.g. 18-21 year olds at 4am-5am (MEGACENTRES, WALK-INS)

That way you could use up the 'antisocial' slots efficiently on the people who are most likely to use them and most able to be able to get to the venue.

Is it unfair that some young people will be vaccinated before some older people? No, as they aren't depriving older people of a slot. Plus vaccinating them has the knock on effect of protecting older people.

 

I don't buy into the need for 24/7 Vaccinations I don't believe the actual demand would be there (not people just saying yeah I'd go at 3am). You'd end up with all the staff sat around doing nowt most of the time. They would be better off taking the vaccines to places where people work nights and injecting them there if there is some sort of desire to see vaccines delivered overnight. 

[xxialac]

6 minutes ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

I don't buy into the need for 24/7 Vaccinations I don't believe the actual demand would be there (not people just saying yeah I'd go at 3am). You'd end up with all the staff sat around doing nowt most of the time. They would be better off taking the vaccines to places where people work nights and injecting them there if there is some sort of desire to see vaccines delivered overnight. 

You don't think young people wouldn't want to go if all they were offered was overnight slots? There's 9 million people in their 20s and another 9 million in their 30s...and yet only 7 megacentres. 

I think they'd be heaving (but socially distanced heaving) with people fed up with it all and seeing a jab as a route to freedom and there's be staff injecting through the night.

Edited January 13, 2021 by xxialac

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

4 minutes ago, xxialac said:

You don't think young people wouldn't want to go if all they were offered was overnight slots? There's 9 million people in their 20s and another 9 million in their 30s...and yet only 7 megacentres. 

I think they'd be heaving (but socially distanced heaving) with people fed up with it all and seeing a jab as a route to freedom and there's be staff injecting through the night.

No I don't think there would be the actual demand for it - it's not like your already out and about so you could just nip in for a jab. Its a dedicated journey you would have to make. 

Equally at the moment there isn't the vaccine to be being 'wasted' on people who have such a small risk of hospitalisation or death. 

The time may come when some operate for longer hours, maybe even a few centres doing 24 hours but I just don't see that being for a good while, certainly not in winter.

[Ozanne]

5 hours ago, xxialac said:

Yes. The practical way to have done this I feel would be;

SOCIAL HOURS  - 8am to 8pm - most vulnerable and shielding, 75+ (GP CLINICS AND OTHER SAFE/CONVENIENT VENUES, APPOINTMENTS)

SOCIAL HOURS - 8am to 8pm - 55-75 y/s (MEGACENTRES, APPOINTMENTS)

ANTISOCIAL HOURS - 8pm to 5am - under 55s, with different age groups allowed to come at different hours e.g. 18-21 year olds at 4am-5am (MEGACENTRES, WALK-INS)

That way you could use up the 'antisocial' slots efficiently on the people who are most likely to use them and most able to be able to get to the venue.

Is it unfair that some young people will be vaccinated before some older people? No, as they aren't depriving older people of a slot. Plus vaccinating them has the knock on effect of protecting older people.

 

 

Makes sense or maybe run a trial in a few places round the country for a week or 2, to see what the demand is like?

[zahidf]

4 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Makes sense or maybe run a trial in a few places round the country for a week or 2, to see what the demand is like?

I believe (according to the telegrahph) that they are trialling a 24 hour centre this week.

[Ozanne]

2 minutes ago, zahidf said:

I believe (according to the telegrahph) that they are trialling a 24 hour centre this week.

Ah cool, there you go then!

[eFestivals]

6 hours ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

not much use, excludes GP surgeries which are the majority of outlets (and huge numbers came online the day after that map's data).

 

 

Edited January 13, 2021 by eFestivals

[Ryan1984]

6 hours ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

I don't buy into the need for 24/7 Vaccinations I don't believe the actual demand would be there (not people just saying yeah I'd go at 3am). You'd end up with all the staff sat around doing nowt most of the time. They would be better off taking the vaccines to places where people work nights and injecting them there if there is some sort of desire to see vaccines delivered overnight. 

But if there was an online booking slot (like they have for blood donations), surely that could help everyone plan?

[steviewevie]

7 hours ago, fraybentos1 said:

No he won’t. Why would he? He has an 80 seat majority- the only way is down.

because he will possibly be riding high in the poles later in the year, and it will be before the economic fallout hits home which could make life more difficult for him in 2024. It's a theory, but I don't think he will either.

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

17 minutes ago, Ryan1984 said:

But if there was an online booking slot (like they have for blood donations), surely that could help everyone plan?

https://www.england.nhs.uk/coronavirus/wp-content/uploads/sites/52/2021/01/Map-showing-the-vaccination-services-across-the-country-11-January-2021-min.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjXpdrespjuAhWCWhUIHVOMBmsQFjAAegQIAhAB&usg=AOvVaw3hgj4HRvLbRRF4arOxhQJrit 

Where it has its uses is showing that 96% of the population of England are already within a crude 10 miles of a vaccination centre. 

That distance should contract for many as more sites are stood up.

 

[steviewevie]

 

[mcshed]

7 hours ago, efcfanwirral said:

If they become normal parts of every day life it isn't a hard sell to change it to something more intrusive. Luckily this country will probably never have such a scenario, but it's not guaranteed

Either way it doesn't matter - its happening. If it's not law I'll definitely be avoiding those places that require it (glastonbury included) but I think it will be law 

Most countries have an ID system they really aren't that scary, yes they can be a tool of an authoritarian regime but that doesn't mean they in themselves are evil.  An authoritarian regime could make terrible use of the police it doesn't mean we shouldn't have a police force. 

[xxialac]

4 minutes ago, mcshed said:

Most countries have an ID system they really aren't that scary, yes they can be a tool of an authoritarian regime but that doesn't mean they in themselves are evil.  An authoritarian regime could make terrible use of the police it doesn't mean we shouldn't have a police force. 

Exactly.

The UK has for a long time been leading the way in the use of CCTV. Third highest penetration in the world. I don't think people think of the UK as an authoritarian type of country.

And all but 3 EEA countries (Denmark, Iceland and Ireland) use ID cards. Similarly I don't think people think of Europe as an authoritarian type of place.

Authoritarianism is more about the checks and balances that stop an autocratic government taking power. You need a good rule of law, good governance and an independent press.

These aspect have been significantly eroded in the UK in the last few years (e.g. threats to judiciary, overreach of the executive, proroguing parliament, attack on the press and lack of independence).

These are the things to worry about, not ID cards or CCTV.

[zahidf]

16 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

 

Makes sense in terms of logistics i guess. Maybe can be expanded when more doses are available.

[CurlyPutz]

This sounds pretty clever, hope it works/helps.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55639096

Quote

Covid: Large trial of new treatment begins in UK

 

Edited January 13, 2021 by CurlyPutz

[incident]

49 minutes ago, Ryan1984 said:

But if there was an online booking slot (like they have for blood donations), surely that could help everyone plan?

There are online bookings. Albeit (and I don't understand why this is) one system for hospitals and the national centres, and then dozens if not hundreds of entirely separate ones for the local hubs. The URLs for many of them can be found if you search around (and if you've got relatives over 80 that haven't been contacted yet, I suggest you do).

What nobody has yet been able to explain to me is how running a 24/7 service is actually going to improve overall capacity at this point.

The bottlenecks, as it stands today, are absolutely not the available space. The biggest one is the supply of the doses, and the next one will be the staffing of people to deliver them. The supply won't be affected no matter what hours you operate, and running 24/7 could actually make the staffing situation worse - if you're asking staff (some of whom are volunteers and many of whom won't be used to shift work) to work midnight to 8am shifts then you risk running them off.

Until there's more supply and more staff/volunteers, then the 24/7 conversation is missing the point.

[Ozanne]

This is horrible 😞

 

[xxialac]

1 minute ago, Ozanne said:

This is horrible 😞

 

Clapping them is fine but when it's instead of giving them the support and tools they need, it becomes insulting.

If we can find £20bn for Track and Trace...  

[shoptildrop]

 

[steviewevie]

11 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

This is horrible 😞

 

yeah, more of that here...

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/jan/13/nhs-icu-staff-ptsd-severe-depression-anxiety

[steviewevie]

Disney vaccines.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/jan/12/california-disneyland-covid-vaccine-distribution-site