Kneecap

[Olshansky]

i have never been so upset to be out of reputation to pass around 🙂 

 

 

[steviewevie]

7 minutes ago, FKA SOSOTWS said:

 

Glasto certainly won't live down the "middle class festival for Guardian readers" allegations if they do cancel them.

That's their fanbase right there.

[itschris]

4 hours ago, kaosmark2 said:

Just another reminder to keep things civil. We're trying to err on the side of allowing discussion but it's (understandably) getting a bit tetchy. 

 

The thread is staying on pre-moderated content for now, and posts that blur the lines will probably get delayed to be checked by 2-3 moderators whether or not they get eventually allowed.

 

Just wanted to say that you're doing a great job, there aren't many other places on the internet we would get  a conversation on this topic 13 pages deep without sh*t slinging from all parties

[Gejonimo]

Everyone here arguing about a war in the Middle-East and I'm here blasting Rhino Ket and having a lovely time.

[Mark E. Spliff]

27 minutes ago, she bangs the drums said:

There is no reason for them not to play. They have also raised the profile of a very important topic where there are two very different sides and opinions. 

 

Glastonbury, a festival that believes in free speech would do more harm than good by following the cancel culture. 

 

Glastonbury Festival has a shameful track record of folding early, rather than facing down dodgy claims of antisemitism.  In 2023, they cancelled the screening of the documentary exposing the underhand machinations which led to the ridiculous accusations against Corbyn.  In 2024, they cancelled the cabaret/comedy regular Paul Currie, for defamatory antisemitism claims made about him by the Soho Theatre and repeated by the usual suspects: Daily Mail, Jewish Chronicle et al.  (Mods to note: 'defamatory' is not my opinion here - it's a preliminary High Court ruling from his ongoing legal action against the Soho Theatre.  The preliminary findings are publically available and show Glastonbury's action against him to be cowardly and unjust.)

 

It doesn't matter what Kneecap have said.  If the populist winds appear to be blowing against Kneecap, Glastonbury will cancel them.  If they're not, they won't.

[Blisterpack]

2 hours ago, HotChipWillBreakYourLegs said:

 

You were, and still are being incredibly evasive.  It's taken you three attempts to answer a very basic question and instead of directly saying you think a Palestinian has a right to self defence, you equivocate by referring to "everybody".

 

Yet when talking about the rights of Israel you are happy to be explicit about it.

 

It is prejudice to the Palestinians to allow one and not the other.

Okay let me be more equivocal: I believe every Palestinian has a right to self defence. I also believe that any Palestinian who attacks Israel or provides willing succour to those who do make themselves legitimate targets in a war. Fair enough? 

[Olshansky]

11 minutes ago, Mark E. Spliff said:

 

It doesn't matter what Kneecap have said.  If the populist winds appear to be blowing against Kneecap, Glastonbury will cancel them.  If they're not, they won't.

 

I dont want you to be right but I know that you are.  
I wish the BBC didn't broadcast the festival, tbh.  Can't help but wonder how many of these types of decisions are made under their thumb vs personal ethos. 

[efcfanwirral]

27 minutes ago, itschris said:

 

Just wanted to say that you're doing a great job, there aren't many other places on the internet we would get  a conversation on this topic 13 pages deep without sh*t slinging from all parties

Yeah I agree with that, one thing that really annoys me at the moment (in life in general) is debate being shut down based on there being a 100% right stance and 100% wrong one. 

 

And before anyone jumps on that, I'd be willing to bet that nuances are disagreed on even between people who broadly agree so stand by debate being a good thing

Edited April 29, 2025 by efcfanwirral

[Skip997]

10 minutes ago, Olshansky said:

 

I dont want you to be right but I know that you are.  
I wish the BBC didn't broadcast the festival, tbh.  Can't help but wonder how many of these types of decisions are made under their thumb vs personal ethos. 

Allowing anyone to broadcast Glastonbury was the worst decision GFL have ever made. It’s almost exclusively responsible for all the (IMO) negative changes.

[itschris]

36 minutes ago, Gejonimo said:

Everyone here arguing about a war in the Middle-East and I'm here blasting Rhino Ket and having a lovely time.

so Parful

[Skip997]

17 minutes ago, Blisterpack said:

Okay let me be more equivocal: I believe every Palestinian has a right to self defence. I also believe that any Palestinian who attacks Israel or provides willing succour to those who do make themselves legitimate targets in a war. Fair enough? 

Is, in your opinion, Israeli attacking Palestine self defence?

[TheDayman]

14 minutes ago, Blisterpack said:

Okay let me be more equivocal: I believe every Palestinian has a right to self defence. I also believe that any Palestinian who attacks Israel or provides willing succour to those who do make themselves legitimate targets in a war. Fair enough? 

Come on, mate. Israel has cut off humanitarian aid, killed children, murdered first responders, journalists, bombed refugee camps, hospitals, and more. 

 

Where does legitimate targets end?

[Skip997]

1 hour ago, FKA SOSOTWS said:

 

Glasto certainly won't live down the "middle class festival for Guardian readers" allegations if they do cancel them.

It’s gone way beyond that already. There are a shocking number of people on here who veer alarmingly to the right 

[Mand3]

Eden Project in Cornwall have cancelled them 😬.

[Alvoram]

42 minutes ago, itschris said:

 

Just wanted to say that you're doing a great job, there aren't many other places on the internet we would get  a conversation on this topic 13 pages deep without sh*t slinging from all parties

To be fair, it's all of you doing a great job. There's been surprisingly little to do in here, considering... Just posts to approve and the odd one to discuss.

For the most part this thread has so far displayed the best of Efests. Debating and discussing a very important, yet divisive topic, whilst keeping it civil, respecting others' views, and not getting personal with people, because you disagree with them. 

[Skip997]

3 hours ago, Blisterpack said:

disarm and seek an alternative Arab administration before Trumpworld  comes real. But they don’t. 

Disarm and let Israel walk straight in, claim the land and make the whole population homeless overnight. 

[Blisterpack]

11 minutes ago, Skip997 said:

Is, in your opinion, Israeli attacking Palestine self defence?

The premise is self defence. I think in the hands of Netanyahu (and Hamas who are clearly loving all this) it gets warped. I do think both sides have had opportunities to de-escalate but have chosen not to. I do also think that Israel will end the war, not hamas. 

[ironmike8]

10 minutes ago, Mand3 said:

Eden Project in Cornwall have cancelled them 😬.

That's so weak of them tbh. Kemi f**king Badenoch leading the charge too, an utter clown who's got a personal grudge against them because they overturned her ruling in court.

[WforWill]

Eden Project have cancelled them, more will likely follow.

[TheDayman]

1 minute ago, Blisterpack said:

The premise is self defence. I think in the hands of Netanyahu (and Hamas who are clearly loving all this) it gets warped. I do think both sides have had opportunities to de-escalate but have chosen not to. I do also think that Israel will end the war, not hamas. 

It warps my brain reading people still consider this self defence. 

And while we’ll talking about Netanyahu, let’s not forget he was happy to prop up Hamas for years - https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/10/world/middleeast/israel-qatar-money-prop-up-hamas.html

 

[Skip997]

4 minutes ago, Blisterpack said:

 I do also think that Israel will end the war, not hamas. 

For once I agree with you on this point. Israel will end the war, but only once all occupants of Gaza are either dead or displaced. 

[CaledonianGonzo]

29 minutes ago, Skip997 said:

Allowing anyone to broadcast Glastonbury was the worst decision GFL have ever made. It’s almost exclusively responsible for all the (IMO) negative changes.

 

Given that the last unbroadcast festival was 1993 (and if you attended that as a 16 year old you'd now be 48) it would seem that only people in their late 40s or even older have experienced a true Glastonbury.

[Colorblindjames]

48 minutes ago, Blisterpack said:

Okay let me be more equivocal: I believe every Palestinian has a right to self defence. I also believe that any Palestinian who attacks Israel or provides willing succour to those who do make themselves legitimate targets in a war. Fair enough? 

“Willing succor is an interesting term. Like the justification the IDF uses for carpet bombing Gaza. It’s likely against international law and it’s impossible to determine who’s giving succor. 

[incident]

2 minutes ago, CaledonianGonzo said:

Given that the last unbroadcast festival was 1993 (and if you attended that as a 16 year old you'd now be 48) it would seem that only people in their late 40s or even older have experienced a true Glastonbury.

 

1992 - the 93 festival was on MTV.

[Blisterpack]

26 minutes ago, TheDayman said:

Come on, mate. Israel has cut off humanitarian aid, killed children, murdered first responders, journalists, bombed refugee camps, hospitals, and more. 

 

Where does legitimate targets end?

Well I’d start with those you listed as being where it ends.  I said anyone who attacked or who supported those attacks. They are legitimate targets, yes? The ratio of legitimate to collateral is estimated at about 50:50 which is a better rate than most wars and particularly difficult to manage when your enemy is not ‘visible’. But kids dying especially is heartbreaking.