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When will this shit end?


Chrisp1986

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6 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

Let's start by cancelling Glastonbury permanently... What a huge super spreading environment for covid or other viruses and also a big carbon footprint. Better to bin it..

In all seriousness - if we are now living in a world where the threat of lockdowns or new restrictions is ever present, then Glastonbury is absolutely going to be the first casualty of that.

99% of the infrastructure needs to be put in place from scratch, with the build* starting about 7 weeks before gates open and so the contracts needing to be signed and in place quite a while before that.. A festival of that scale or complexity needs to be planned far enough out that there won't be any real picture of what the situation is going to be like when it takes place. So if restrictions are still an option, that'll mean no insurance is possible and the Eavii are unlikely to be able to take the risk.

But I guess we should live with the potential for restrictions, because we can adapt right?

*build start time is fuzzy, with some of prep work done by Worthy Farm employees before May - I'm saying 7 weeks because that's when the first externals that stay on site tend to arrive.

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8 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

I’m sympathetic to the views of climate change scientists but I also think they really ought to spend more time coming up with ways to adapt to our new climate rather than trying to warn about climate change.

Its statements like this which highlight you are probably pretty naive on the subject.

The whole point is that we are likely not going to be able to 'adapt' at some point. And we have basically fucked ourselves and most other species to oblivion.

It's the attitude you highlighted in the post which really puts a microscope on the problems I have with large parts of society. #'I can't be fucked changing' in a nushell.

This week there have been temperatures recorded in Canda of 49 degrees this week, we cannot 'adapt' to this at the click of a finger.

Edited by MrBarry465
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1 minute ago, crazyfool1 said:

if thats not it its similar enough 🙂 thanks 

I do retract my comment re the carbon footprint to an extent so apolgies for that.

I do feel the article stretches things. Like saying travelling artists footprint is small cause they are just hopping over as part of a bigger tour. Doesn't really make it better, they are still doing dozens of flights around the world some of which in private planes I imagine.

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3 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

Its statements like this which highlight you are probably pretty naive on the subject.

The whole point is that we are likely not going to be able to 'adapt' at some point. And we have basically fucked ourselves and most other species.

Ah well, life is what you make of it! Sure you'll be grand

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3 minutes ago, incident said:

In all seriousness - if we are now living in a world where the threat of lockdowns or new restrictions is ever present, then Glastonbury is absolutely going to be the first casualty of that.

99% of the infrastructure needs to be put in place from scratch, with the build* starting about 7 weeks before gates open and so the contracts needing to be signed and in place quite a while before that.. A festival of that scale or complexity needs to be planned far enough out that there won't be any real picture of what the situation is going to be like when it takes place. So if restrictions are still an option, that'll mean no insurance is possible and the Eavii are unlikely to be able to take the risk.

But I guess we should live with the potential for restrictions, because we can adapt right?

*build start time is fuzzy, with some of prep work done by Worthy Farm employees before May - I'm saying 7 weeks because that's when the first externals that stay on site tend to arrive.

100% this.

If you settle for a future where we are in constant fear of lockdowns and restrictions the ability to plan events with infrastructure above a certain size becomes extremely difficult and from the outside looking in dare I say impossible.

I'm not sure how some sectors can adapt and I'd include festivals the size of glastonbury within this.

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12 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

Its statements like this which highlight you are probably pretty naive on the subject.

The whole point is that we are likely not going to be able to 'adapt' at some point. And we have basically fucked ourselves and most other species to oblivion.

It's the attitude you highlighted in the post which really puts a microscope on the problems I have with large parts of society. #'I can't be fucked changing' in a nushell.

This week there have been temperatures recorded in Canda of 49 degrees this week, we cannot 'adapt' to this at the click of a finger.

isn't the problem with the climate thing that would spiral out of control once go beyond a certain point...loopback systems breaking down etc. We basically need to stop using fossil fuels, eat less meat, and have fewer children (or stop saving people's lives from deadly viruses)...we can do all these things through ingenuity, but we haven't got a lot of time.

Or we just let it go and adapt and will be like waterworld.

Edited by steviewevie
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3 hours ago, swede said:

My theory is you and Barry Fish are the same guy with two accounts arguing with yourself for some self indulgent amusement 

This thought had crossed my mind! 
 

And now there is a fake @Ozanne account giving downvotes. 

It’s really time for furlough to end and these people to get back to work! 

Edited by stuie
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2 minutes ago, stuie said:

This thought had crossed my mind! 
 

And now there is a faze @Ozanne account giving downvotes. 

It’s really time for furlough to end and these people to get back to work! 

thats Stu M Stu E 

Edited by crazyfool1
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1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

isn't the problem with the climate thing that would be spiral out of control once go beyond a certain point...loopback systems breaking down etc. We basically need to stop using fossil fuels, eat less meat, and have fewer children (or stop saving people's lives from deadly viruses)...we can do all these things through ingenuity, but we haven't got a lot of time.

Or we just let it go and adapt and will be like waterworld.

Going to be sad growing up as a child going forward.

Absolutely fuck all biodiversity or animals everywhere, aside from annoying slobs.

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3 minutes ago, JoeyT said:

100% this.

If you settle for a future where we are in constant fear of lockdowns and restrictions the ability to plan events with infrastructure above a certain size becomes extremely difficult and from the outside looking in dare I say impossible.

I'm not sure how some sectors can adapt and I'd include festivals the size of glastonbury within this.

trouble is...we're still at the stage where it's all a bit uncertain...hopefully will be just like flu and just be some shit some people have to deal with....

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1 hour ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

If you think what we’ve gone through in the past 15 months constitutes “minor changes” then I don’t know what to say to you. We’ve literally been legally banned from leaving our homes, with exceptions for a few essential activities, for half of the last 15 months. For the other half (roughly last summer and early autumn, early December to early January, and from late March this year onwards) we’ve not been formally locked down but have been living under varying degrees of incredibly tight restrictions such as indoor mixing bans, the rule of 6 etc.

 

It’s quite absurd to refer to that as “minor lifestyle changes” 

Minor compared to what is likely to come, and what has gone before. Generations before you had to deal with fighting in actual war, wars that lasted more than 15 months. God knows I'd take a month of lockdown every year over having to go fight in China or dealing with the possibility of my house having a bomb dropped on it. Lockdown is easy mode compared to that. 

If I live to 70-odd and this pandemic turns out to be the biggest challenge we've had to face in that time, and the biggest negative change to my life then I'll be over the fucking moon. I just think it's vanishingly unlikely that'll be the case. We've had an exceptional period of global stability over the past 70 years to the point that people are starting to take it for granted and think it normal, because there's been an entire one generation that's not had to deal with any massive, global life-changing event.

47 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

Also you just know all the ones on here predicting the end of days and climate disaster in the coming years are also the same ones who fly on holiday about 4 times a year 😅 

Haven't in the past but will be now. Because I sure as shit won't be able to do it when I retire! Or indeed in twenty, possibly ten years' time. I want to see the world while we still can. Is that selfish? Totally. But on the other hand I'm not having kids so don't have to worry about them and that's also the biggest thing you can do to reduce your carbon footprint.

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1 minute ago, fraybentos1 said:

Is there any vision for the future people on here have which is... alright? 

Maybe things will be fine..

Maybe they will.

But all educated guesses point to probably one of the most challenging periods in human civilization.

Whether we survive it is anyones guess.

 

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24 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

I’m sympathetic to the views of climate change scientists but I also think they really ought to spend more time coming up with ways to adapt to our new climate rather than trying to warn about climate change. There just isn’t the appetite, particularly in the western world, to change our lifestyles as fundamentally as we’d need to in order to reverse climate change.

investment in more environmentally friendly modes of overseas travel. For example, is there any reason why we couldn’t build a bullet train that will get you to Barcelona in 4-5 hours? Is there any reason why Tesla can’t come up with an electric aeroplane that can carry hundreds of people around the world? 
 

We should also be investing in infrastructure to mitigate the increased risk of natural disasters, IMO. 

If you're interested in that sort of thing I cannot recommend enough The Ministry For The Future by Kim Stanley Robinson - it's sci-fi that starts now and traces a possible future where we actually manage to save the environment. It's got some properly fascinating ideas in it, but one that stuck with me and seems really relevant now, especially, is now remote working impacts travel. 

Because if I can work anywhere, I don't need to fly to the US for my holiday. Because I don't need to get to the US in 8 hours and get back in the same because I only have so much paid annual leave. I can book on an ocean liner, one that's been developed for remote workers, with it's own office space, and I can spent a pleasant week at sea, working but also being catered for, sort of a nice pre-holiday. Then do the same on the way back. If you do that at scale, it's not as expensive as it is now either. 

Inland is more difficult but the same logic applies, start fitting trains out as pleasant environments for people to work in and you change the whole thing - urgency of travel mostly goes away so slower but more environmentally friendly methods become superior.

Also: airships.

Book here if it's intrigued anyone: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ministry-Future-Kim-Stanley-Robinson-ebook/dp/B08C5DWVRK/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=ministry+of+the+future&qid=1625063176&sr=8-1

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9 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

Maybe they will.

But all educated guesses point to probably one of the most challenging periods in human civilization.

Whether we survive it is anyones guess.

 

Proper ray of sunshine you are, aren't you. Good god, how do you even find the energy to get up in the morning?

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5 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

Is there any vision for the future people on here have which is... alright? 

Maybe things will be fine..

I think they will be alright, but we will need to adapt. And we can, and have. At least everyone here is still here, you got through the pandemic, you got through lockdown, you can adapt, you know that now. It's hard to say if your life will be objectively better or worse (are we better or worse for having the internet?) but it'll be different.

If 20 years ago someone had said to you that you'd voluntarily spend your spare time typing to other people on a computer to argue things that would probably have sounded dystopian too. 

I'm definitely not saying "life is going to get loads worse" just that "life will be loads different". Some of your favourite things will go away - modes of entertainment that were popular in even the 70s, 80s and 90s have gone away - I'm sure they include things that some people will say were their favourite thing. But you find other favourite things. You usually decide they're not as good as the things you used to do, but that's because you were 20 years younger then so of course life was better!

But things are not going to be the same forever. At least, if you're lucky they won't be, as that means you're alive to see what's coming next.

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15 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

Haven't in the past but will be now. Because I sure as shit won't be able to do it when I retire! Or indeed in twenty, possibly ten years' time. I want to see the world while we still can. Is that selfish? Totally. But on the other hand I'm not having kids so don't have to worry about them and that's also the biggest thing you can do to reduce your carbon footprint.

So your solution is for you to make hay while the sun shines and then warn everyone else of the end of days on a festival forum? Seems a bit mad to me.

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4 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

Proper ray of sunshine you are, aren't you. Good god, how do you even find the energy to get up in the morning?

Cos theres music to listen, birds to date, drugs to take and crypto to trade!

 

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2 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

So your solution is for you to make hay while the sun shines and then warn everyone else of the end of days on a festival forum? Seems a bit mad to me.

Maybe I am a bit mad. But yeah, I don't think collectively we as a human race have the will to want to sort climate change. I feel like we're going to go extinct in a few hundred years because of it. And I'm sort of okay with that? Maybe that is a bit mad. But is it? Is it mad not to care for continuing a species that I won't be a part of any more by then anyway? Should perpetuating the human race be a personal goal for me in my life? Any more than should I care if England win the footie or not? (I don't)

(These are all genuine questions I ask myself when feeling philosophical by the way!)

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