When will this shit end?

[stuartbert two hats]

51 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

I don’t wanna start an argument but he’s doing what you’re asking. He’s called for another lockdown, what else can he do?

Call for the schools to shut, the part the rest of the country is asking for. Is it not the role of the leader of the opposition to put the alternative case to the government? To speak for those being let down by the government?  Not just make some meaningless statement asking for action that will make little difference whilst supporting inaction in the one area that could save lives.

 

Utterly, utterly useless intervention.

Edited January 3, 2021 by stuartbert two hats

[ace56blaa]

45 minutes ago, Matt42 said:

Tallied it up today. Six friends of mine in ldn have either positive results or have been exposed to a family member or flatmate which has recently tested positive.

Pretty scary stuff. Feels like there is definitely a more infectious strain going around!

Yeah same situation here, literally knew no one personally with the virus until xmas when 4 or 5 people i know got it and then family members of others

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, stuartbert two hats said:

Call for the schools to shut, the part the rest of the country asking for. Is it not the role of the leader of the opposition to put the alternative case to the government? To speak for those being let down by the government?  Not just make some meaningless statement asking for action that will make little difference whilst supporting inaction in the one area that could save lives.

 

Utterly, utterly useless intervention.

He could genuinely think schools should stay open a bit longer or he’s not calling for them to fully shut as there isn’t a plan in place for remote learning. 
 

As crass as it might sound he also has to be aware how Johnson/the Tories will spin it. Johnson can say he’s held hostage by the Unions and just wants schools to shut. So by waiting a bit longer if Johnson does it then he owns the situation.

Personally I think he should call for schools to shut but I can see why he wouldn’t. Calling for another national lockdown is putting more pressure on Johnson to do that and will probably move the situation on a bit quicker. 

[steviewevie]

Feel a bit on my ownsome with this but still kind of feel they should keep schools open just to avoid further inequality brought about by the home schooling thing and the fact that all this missed education could lead to life long damage.

[Gingerfish79]

Exactly this. In my view, Starmer has just passed up another golden opportunity to show the country that he can lead. 

[stuartbert two hats]

Just now, Gingerfish79 said:

Exactly this. In my view, Starmer has just passed up another golden opportunity to show the country that he can lead. 

Yeah, he's really shown an inability to react to events or read the mood of the country.

Plus, people will die.

[Dark Star]

28 minutes ago, stuartbert two hats said:

Call for the schools to shut, the part the rest of the country is asking for. Is it not the role of the leader of the opposition to put the alternative case to the government? To speak for those being let down by the government?  Not just make some meaningless statement asking for action that will make little difference whilst supporting inaction in the one area that could save lives.

 

Utterly, utterly useless intervention.

Yes, that's exactly what he should have done. 

[Crazyfool01]

14 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Feel a bit on my ownsome with this but still kind of feel they should keep schools open just to avoid further inequality brought about by the home schooling thing and the fact that all this missed education could lead to life long damage.

but doesnt that inequality exist already by schools having to shut off years / classes regularly now anyway ....?

[Matt42]

1 hour ago, zahidf said:

Yeah know more people than March who have been infected.

 

1 hour ago, Ozanne said:

Me too. Just heard today a friend has tested positive along with members of his family and also another friends wife has family members that have tested positive. 

Anecdotal but it seems like this strain hops around quicker and people can catch it from a very short exposure window. One friend of mine caught it from a very short conversation they had on their doorstep outside with an infected friend (they think).

[Brownie30]

19 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Feel a bit on my ownsome with this but still kind of feel they should keep schools open just to avoid further inequality brought about by the home schooling thing and the fact that all this missed education could lead to life long damage.

If that snivelling, lying bag of shite excuse for an Education Secretary had done what he promised and sent enough laptops for schools to give to the poorest students AND the equipment required for students and teachers to be Covid safe in schools then we would be able to deal with inequality. Instead they just continue to lie about whether they've done any of this or not. The inequalities being caused by the pandemic are ones that have existed for years as a result of Tory governance - they're just being highlighted and worsened for all to see. If they'd cared one jot for teachers and young people from the start then we wouldn't need to discuss this trade-off between public health / inequalities.

[Matt42]

11 minutes ago, Gingerfish79 said:

Exactly this. In my view, Starmer has just passed up another golden opportunity to show the country that he can lead. 

Starmers strategy is to win Tory voters off Boris. He’s trying to avoid the “look what you stupid people voted for” approach as that didn’t exactly do Corbyn much good.

Either way - shut the schools

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

4 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Feel a bit on my ownsome with this but still kind of feel they should keep schools open just to avoid further inequality brought about by the home schooling thing and the fact that all this missed education could lead to life long damage.

I would rather schools stay open as long as possible. 

If schools close despite it making mine and my partners life a total nightmare we can make it work - we did last school year despite at the time both being key workers we felt he didn't need to go to school and the space would be better used by other parents who couldn't manage the situation. My concern with it is a couple of hours work a day which is what it was taking to get through the work isn't the same as a full day at school. 

The boy has regressed a little in that time especially his maths which is his weakest subject at school, it's hard for us to get him into a routine of mental arithmetic tests every day when we have to work our own jobs too - not all children have parents in such fortunate positions. Equally be really misses the other things they do at school which we can't really do at home, science art, etc.. etc.. that's before you factor in seeing his friends, his teachers etc.. etc.. at least with our lad he doesn't live near school and his school friends anyway so he isn't asking if he can go to his little mates house to play at the moment. 

Its easy to suggest that online learning is the answer - it isn't that easy. Our lad does 1 hour a week Spainish on Skype and has done for a few years now, this is something he enjoys and wants to do but sometimes he struggles with that as in his head he is at home not at school. 

I really worry for the less fortunate children what another school closure. I'm a little worried for all the things my own lad misses out on as a result of this - he already says things like we are having to catch up on year 4 work and do year 5 work so we aren't doing as much Art or PE etc.. 

Thats not to say the teachers shouldnt have a right to feel say at school but to have some sort of open ended school closure feels like a step too far for me there needs to be some sort it becomes safe at X point. 

That said he has literally just said he wants to be a stripper when he grows up so maybe my worries are missplaced.

[steviewevie]

9 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

but doesnt that inequality exist already by schools having to shut off years / classes regularly now anyway ....?

yes, probably...just thinking out loud really. Such a shit situation.

[Dark Star]

9 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

but doesnt that inequality exist already by schools having to shut off years / classes regularly now anyway ....?

Or, to "level up", as they like to call things, how about just take the decision to hold everyone back six months/a year if necessary. That way more time is bought for them to either get everyone vaccinated and society functioning as normal, or to find an alternative plan to ensure education is not adversely affected long term. No option is going to be ideal, maybe that is the fairest way? If some need to delay their GCSE's 6 months or others a year, let them. Exams don't have to be taken in June just because that's how it's always been.

[Guest]

Let this not cloud over the fact that there is level of inequality baked into education which has been brought about by a decade of Tory rule. Then on top of that they did nothing in the Autumn to prepare for this crises now. 

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

13 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

but doesnt that inequality exist already by schools having to shut off years / classes regularly now anyway ....?

I'd be interested to see how many school days are actually being lost to this. 

[Brownie30]

Instead of actually making schools safe Boris and his cronies have given them the absolute bare minimum of resources, less than a week to put mass testing programmes into place for over 1000 students and staff with limited instruction, no support and flatly lied in every media publication possible that schools are "safe".

Engaging with a lot of teachers (both personally and through my profession) it is very clear that many schools are definitely NOT safe and the reason for that is a failure on behalf of the government, and not the schools themselves. I can only assume the reason they keep claiming schools are "safe" is so that if (when) they do eventually have to close they can publicly blame teachers and students for not putting safety measures in place, even though they have had resources stripped from them to actually do so, and no genuine instruction. Its a typically Tory way of managing things, and I assume will be followed by more "useless teachers" Daily Mail headlines. Depressingly predictable.

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

Just now, Ozanne said:

Let this not cloud over the fact that there is level of inequality baked into education which has been brought about by a decade of Tory rule. Then on top of that they did nothing in the Autumn to prepare for this crises now. 

Inequality in education goes way further back than that. 

[steviewevie]

Just now, Ozanne said:

Let this not cloud over the fact that there is level of inequality baked into education which has been brought about by a decade of Tory rule. Then on top of that they did nothing in the Autumn to prepare for this crises now. 

yeah, sure...but this amplifies those inequalities.

[steviewevie]

3 minutes ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

I'd be interested to see how many school days are actually being lost to this. 

it was pretty bad here in Manchester in the autumn.

[Crazyfool01]

1 minute ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

I'd be interested to see how many school days are actually being lost to this. 

I would think that some of the deprived areas that have had higher virus rates would link to more teachers and kids  being off ..... and potentially more inequality ? 

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, RobertProsineckisLighter said:

Inequality in education goes way further back than that. 

The last 10 years have certainly added in a great way to that, plus the party that did that are still in power and in charge now.

[Brownie30]

And also just adding on behalf of teachers - schools have never "closed". Teachers have never stopped teaching, never stopped setting lessons, never stopped marking work and never stopped their pastoral responsibilities to their students. Teachers deserve an overwhelming amount of praise for how they have handled the pandemic since March and any failings or lasting inequalities that come out of this period are squarely at the feet of the Government.

[Simsy]

44 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

He could genuinely think schools should stay open a bit longer or he’s not calling for them to fully shut as there isn’t a plan in place for remote learning. 

Or he wants schools to shut and knows the best way to get Boris to close them is to tell him to keep them open.

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

6 minutes ago, Brownie30 said:

Instead of actually making schools safe Boris and his cronies have given them the absolute bare minimum of resources, less than a week to put mass testing programmes into place for over 1000 students and staff with limited instruction, no support and flatly lied in every media publication possible that schools are "safe".

Engaging with a lot of teachers (both personally and through my profession) it is very clear that many schools are definitely NOT safe and the reason for that is a failure on behalf of the government, and not the schools themselves. I can only assume the reason they keep claiming schools are "safe" is so that if (when) they do eventually have to close they can publicly blame teachers and students for not putting safety measures in place, even though they have had resources stripped from them to actually do so, and no genuine instruction. Its a typically Tory way of managing things, and I assume will be followed by more "useless teachers" Daily Mail headlines. Depressingly predictable.

How do you make a school, or anywhere for that matter safe? Short if vaccinate all the teachers before opening schools I just don't see what can be done. What do teacher feel needs to be done?