When will this shit end?

[Crazyfool01]

8 minutes ago, Simsy said:

Do we all get a go on it?

Probably get quite a few on there whilst social distancing  

[Zoo Music Girl]

28 minutes ago, gigpusher said:

Although there cases were much more regional to begin with and far less widespread than here and having colleagues in Spain I can tell you being able to go out and exercise vs not being able to is quite a big difference!!

Yes 100%. My aunt lives there, there were police checking where you were going. Their lockdown was a different world to ours. And my sister is in Sri Lanka where they couldn't even buy groceries for weeks. Not saying I'd love to live under these measures, but our lockdown has been a weird halfway house from the start.

Just watched that Dispatches doc. When you see it all laid out like that it's crazy.

[Ozanne]

9 minutes ago, Zoo Music Girl said:

Yes 100%. My aunt lives there, there were police checking where you were going. Their lockdown was a different world to ours. And my sister is in Sri Lanka where they couldn't even buy groceries for weeks. Not saying I'd love to live under these measures, but our lockdown has been a weird halfway house from the start.

Just watched that Dispatches doc. When you see it all laid out like that it's crazy.

I’m watching it right now, half way through. It’s mind blowing, more so than ever I believe it’s criminal negligence on behalf of the government. 

[shoptildrop]

3 hours ago, efcfanwirral said:

I suppose that makes sense. I can't believe how much worse we are though - other countries giving them out at the entrance to their public transport. I imagine we'll just be using t shirts

This tweet made me lol about the UK situation and masks 

 

[shoptildrop]

4 hours ago, efcfanwirral said:

Do you think he's playing herd immunity with Parliament? With an assumption the older and at risk/shielding will stay away, so they can all catch it and then do away with the silly rules that apply to the little people (and get a full crowd behind Boris)? The weeks of isolation would be a good way to tick down some time ahead of Brexit, and we know they believe in survival of the fittest.

This about sums up the "example" they clearly want to set to the rest of us...

 

I have no idea what they are thinking!!

I also don't believe Alok is negative either, but we'll see if he is off work for a week (away from parliament anyway)

[shoptildrop]

2 hours ago, dotdash79 said:

So official death total will go over 40,000 tomorrow, what do we think the government will "announce" to distract? Hair dressers and barbers to open from the 15th?

Yeah I really do and reckon it will be announced when Boris does his weekly turn up for work press conference next week  

[Ozanne]

Everyone should watch Dispatches, my word it’s staggering. It’ll all hinge on when the advise given at Sage was passed onto Ministers. If they can show it was delayed then that will be there get out. 

[shoptildrop]

10 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Everyone should watch Dispatches, my word it’s staggering. It’ll all hinge on when the advise given at Sage was passed onto Ministers. If they can show it was delayed then that will be there get out. 

It's unreal isn't it?? We watched both Dispatches and Newsnight last night and it really was depressing viewing tbh 

[Ozanne]

3 minutes ago, shoptildrop said:

It's unreal isn't it?? We watched both Dispatches and Newsnight last night and it really was depressing viewing tbh 

It’s astonishing. I wonder what would have happened without Macrons intervention!?

[Ryan1984]

25 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Everyone should watch Dispatches, my word it’s staggering. It’ll all hinge on when the advise given at Sage was passed onto Ministers. If they can show it was delayed then that will be there get out. 

Take it this is last night’s Channel 4 show? Shocking and already had a Tory - who hasn’t seen it - kicking off that ‘Channel 4 is as bad as the Guardian and can’t be trusted.

[Ozanne]

2 minutes ago, Ryan1984 said:

Take it this is last night’s Channel 4 show? Shocking and already had a Tory - who hasn’t seen it - kicking off that ‘Channel 4 is as bad as the Guardian and can’t be trusted.

It is. I honestly don’t know how anyone can defend them. Just look at everything that’s happened! 

[Mr.Tease]

This is an example of how awful and servile the bbc's main coverage has been, from the as ever ****e bbc news website.

 

The Guardian runs a piece entitled

 

"NHS test-and-trace system 'not fully operational until September", and reports:

. 

Quote

 

The NHS coronavirus test-and-trace system designed to prevent a second deadly wave is not expected to work at full speed until September or October, the Guardian has learned.

Tony Prestedge, the chief operating officer of the NHS scheme, admitted in a webinar to staff that the programme would be “imperfect” at launch, adding that he hoped it would be operational at a world-class level within three to four months.

It comes as a leaked email from the chief executive of Serco – one of the main companies contracted to deliver the service – revealed how he doubted the scheme would evolve smoothly but said he wanted it to “cement the position of the private sector” in the NHS supply chain. ...

...

Justin Madders, a shadow health ministers, said the idea that the system may be months away from being fully operational was “deeply concerning”. 

In a webinar for staff, Prestedge, a senior banker drafted in to help run the programme to trace infected people, said: “I am sure when Dido [Harding, chief executive of scheme] announces this service later she will make clear that it is an imperfect service at launch that we will improve over time and make it world-class by the time that we are moving towards the September or October time.”

 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/jun/04/nhs-track-and-trace-system-not-expected-to-be-operating-fully-until-september-coronavirus

 

The BBC writes this up chiefly from the Governments direct claims, entitling the article: 

 

"Cornoavirus: NHS Contract Tracing App in place by end of month, says minister" (they always seem to have Government claims or counter claims as the main headline)

 

Quote

 

A new NHS coronavirus contact-tracing app should be in place by the end of the month, a minister has said.

Business minister Nadhim Zahawi said the app - which was trialled in the Isle of Wight - will "be running as soon as we think it is robust".

Last week new test and trace systems were launched in England and Scotland - but without the app due to delays.

The Guardian reported a senior NHS boss said the system would be imperfect at first but "world-class" by the autumn.

The paper said the chief operating officer of the test and trace scheme said the scheme should be fully working by September or October.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52931232

(How many times do we have to hear we're the best in the world at tackling this contrary to every single piece of evidence). Also completely avoids the mention of the main intent in launching a **** unfinished service is simply to cement the private sectors role in the NHS's supply chain)

[Deaf Nobby Burton]

BBC have just said ONS say 0.1% of the population are currently infected.

So however much we distrust the government logic dictates Sharma doesn’t have it. 

[Crazyfool01]

I will give an example on inept management of a covid test centre ... the army were performing tests at the local test centre in plastic aprons and paper masks ... the local traffic wardens ( including my friend ) were doing traffic management with no Ppe ... day before yesterday one of them is hospitalised with a positive Covid test .... people who he had contact with have been tested and should be isolating but the private parking company have said they should turn up for work and be wait for contact tracers to be in contact before they isolate ... the guy in hospital has all the numbers of people ready but hasn’t been contacted by anyone .. they closed the office for a deep clean but still asked everyone to attend work today and meet outside ... and waited untill yesterday to do a risk assessment on the covid centre .. I’m raging on my friends behalf today !! That company are not only putting lives of the public at risk but my best friend to... as he may not in fact have it !! 

Edited June 5, 2020 by crazyfool1

[Deaf Nobby Burton]

 

Cosistent downward trend in infections, at least until the end of May 

Edited June 5, 2020 by Deaf Nobby Burton

[Chef]

Some interesting reading from Bristol University about whether infections were dropping before lock down was imposed.

I have seen some (wild) theories that this was some kind of second wave and the 10x average number of 'flu' cases the nhs dealt with at the beginning of the year was not actually flu. I do remember in January a disproportionate amount of people were off work with flu/ cold/ chest infection like symptoms. I know unlikely but who knows, could be positive for the future if there is something in it. 

Usual caveats that there are a number of things that can blow holes in this and the research is not peer reviewed but an interesting discussion piece none the less. @Toilet Duckdoes this seem anything close to feasible to you? 

https://www.bristol.ac.uk/maths/news/2020/peak-lockdown.html  

[Deaf Nobby Burton]

8 minutes ago, Chef said:

Some interesting reading from Bristol University about whether infections were dropping before lock down was imposed.

I have seen some (wild) theories that this was some kind of second wave and the 10x average number of 'flu' cases the nhs dealt with at the beginning of the year was not actually flu. I do remember in January a disproportionate amount of people were off work with flu/ cold/ chest infection like symptoms. I know unlikely but who knows, could be positive for the future if there is something in it. 

Usual caveats that there are a number of things that can blow holes in this and the research is not peer reviewed but an interesting discussion piece none the less. @Toilet Duckdoes this seem anything close to feasible to you? 

https://www.bristol.ac.uk/maths/news/2020/peak-lockdown.html  

This paragraph is interesting, specifically the bolded part, basically we should’ve been doing the randomised testing we’re doing now before lockdown, but we weren’t:

Taken together the results for England and Wales and for Sweden are strongly suggestive that full lockdown may not have been necessary to avoid health service overload, and more limited measures might have been effective. This sharply emphasises the desirability of statistically well founded direct measurement of epidemic size through randomized testing. Had such testing being carried out leading up to lockdown it would have been clear if the measures preceding lockdown were working, or whether stronger restrictions were needed. Instead management was reliant on a complex modelling synthesis of expert judgement and highly problematic clinical case data. Less statistically problematic reconstruc- tions, like the one presented here, are clearly only possible weeks after the fact

Edited June 5, 2020 by Deaf Nobby Burton

[Cream Soda]

31 minutes ago, Deaf Nobby Burton said:

 

Cosistent downward trend in infections, at least until the end of May 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/05/11/coronavirus-no-longer-epidemic-uk-oxford-study-finds-cases-falling/ May be on a downward trend as this article put the estimation at 136,000 around a week before...we can but hope.  

[Chef]

16 minutes ago, Deaf Nobby Burton said:

This paragraph is interesting, specifically the bolded part, basically we should’ve been doing the randomised testing we’re doing now before lockdown, but we weren’t:

Taken together the results for England and Wales and for Sweden are strongly suggestive that full lockdown may not have been necessary to avoid health service overload, and more limited measures might have been effective. This sharply emphasises the desirability of statistically well founded direct measurement of epidemic size through randomized testing. Had such testing being carried out leading up to lockdown it would have been clear if the measures preceding lockdown were working, or whether stronger restrictions were needed. Instead management was reliant on a complex modelling synthesis of expert judgement and highly problematic clinical case data. Less statistically problematic reconstruc- tions, like the one presented here, are clearly only possible weeks after the fact

I know hindsight is a wonderful thing but it does make complete sense when you read it like that. To scientists it may have even made sense at the time but the circumstances the country was in, for a number of reasons, just didn't allow. I hope the application of such theories going forward though can help in the future. 

[Deaf Nobby Burton]

1 minute ago, Chef said:

I know hindsight is a wonderful thing but it does make complete sense when you read it like that. To scientists it may have even made sense at the time but the circumstances the country was in, for a number of reasons, just didn't allow. I hope the application of such theories going forward though can help in the future. 

Yes absolutely, easy with hindsight. Unfortunately we didn’t have the testing capability at that time and it was a case of fighting fires and just testing those presenting themselves at the hospital. That we didn’t have the testing capability to do this is another question.

[Deaf Nobby Burton]

11 minutes ago, Cream Soda said:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/05/11/coronavirus-no-longer-epidemic-uk-oxford-study-finds-cases-falling/ May be on a downward trend as this article put the estimation at 136,000 around a week before...we can but hope.  

Wasn’t there a bit of hysteria about VE Day party’s causing a spike? We can now put that to bed. Hopefully the trend continues and we can do the same about people visiting beaches. 

[Zoo Music Girl]

The Dispatches doc goes into failure to test at that point a lot. Loads of scientists were calling for it and even offering up capacity which was turned down.

[Cream Soda]

3 minutes ago, Deaf Nobby Burton said:

Wasn’t there a bit of hysteria about VE Day party’s causing a spike? We can now put that to bed. Hopefully the trend continues and we can do the same about people visiting beaches. 

2-3 weeks from the protests will provide an interesting insight too

[efcfanwirral]

 

22 minutes ago, Chef said:

I know hindsight is a wonderful thing but it does make complete sense when you read it like that. To scientists it may have even made sense at the time but the circumstances the country was in, for a number of reasons, just didn't allow. I hope the application of such theories going forward though can help in the future. 

I hope it gets applied to antibody tests when the time is right and they're definitely accurate.

Not necessarily for immunity reasons which everyone seems to be focusing on, but just for knowing how widespread it has been. 

[Ozanne]

21 minutes ago, Zoo Music Girl said:

The Dispatches doc goes into failure to test at that point a lot. Loads of scientists were calling for it and even offering up capacity which was turned down.

Yep it really does cover a lot of that, although I’m guessing they’ll still be excuses given for the government by some. 

Edited June 5, 2020 by Ozanne