When will this shit end?

[Fuzzy Afro]

30 minutes ago, Zoo Music Girl said:

I'm hoping to travel at the end of the year, but I feel a lot more comfortable doing so now there is a vaccine. Will depend on quarantine rules and etc though. I don't mind sacrificing international travel for another year if things get more back to normal domestically.

Yeah spot on. I’ll travel if I can but I’d also be fine with the government clamping down on international travel to ensure domestic normality. 

[Fuzzy Afro]

7 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

 

If people are allowed to visit literal care homes then we should be allowed to visit family and friends. Fucking ridiculous if not. 

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

3 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

If people are allowed to visit literal care homes then we should be allowed to visit family and friends. Fucking ridiculous if not. 

I suppose the rationale is that people in the care homes are 'protected' visiting people in their homes might not be e.g. a chance they catch it and get poorly, hospital, die.

This would probably support the idea if domestic normality or near normality once everyone (who wants one) has been vaccinated would it not? 

Edited February 18, 2021 by RobertProsineckisLighter

[Zoo Music Girl]

35 minutes ago, xxialac said:

Playing devil's advocate, if the law said you can fly for any reason and you fly, what is wrong with that? Is it not the law that is wrong?

I wasn't critical of the people meeting over Christmas for exactly the same reason.

Don't think I said it was wrong? Was just saying I know people who did.

[st dan]

3 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

If people are allowed to visit literal care homes then we should be allowed to visit family and friends. Fucking ridiculous if not. 

Yeah, when it’s put like that it’s ridiculous and quite frankly unacceptable to not allow people to see their friends and family (especially if they too have been vaccinated) if they are letting people visit those most vulnerable, in an indoor setting. 

[JoeyT]

Just now, Fuzzy Afro said:

If people are allowed to visit literal care homes then we should be allowed to visit family and friends. Fucking ridiculous if not. 

I was going to write something similar.

You'd assume this would be done with testing prior to the visit as well.

Are we heading into murky waters with this ramping up / availability of the rapid tests?

For instance if my workplace require me to do them (my wife is already doing them as a teacher twice a week) and both tests are negative then seeing my parents / her parents / Grandparents who have all been vaccinated shouldn't be frowned upon or against any guidelines should it?

It's as safe as we're going to get prior to being vaccinated ourselves which even then isn't 100% safety for everyone?

[zahidf]

8 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

If people are allowed to visit literal care homes then we should be allowed to visit family and friends. Fucking ridiculous if not. 

Im assuming once the oldsters are vaccinated, people will go visit them, regardless of the law. The govt may as well stop having it as a law

[Guest]

It’s been one of the major complaints that people haven’t been able to see older family members in care homes some for nearly a year. Those elderly people have had 1 dose of the vaccine and sufficient time has passed so they can look at relaxing that rule because of that.

It’s worth remembering that some of these elderly residents haven’t seen family members in quite some times, whereas it’s different with friends.

They can’t just relax all of that in one go, they have to go slowly and this seems fair due to strains it put on elderly family members. 

[JoeyT]

3 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

It’s been one of the major complaints that people haven’t been able to see older family members in care homes some for nearly a year. Those elderly people have had 1 dose of the vaccine and sufficient time has passed so they can look at relaxing that rule because of that.

It’s worth remembering that some of these elderly residents haven’t seen family members in quite some times, whereas it’s different with friends.

They can’t just relax all of that in one go, they have to go slowly and this seems fair due to strains it put on elderly family members. 

I see your point however just because for instance my Nan (87) who has also been vaccinated doesn't live in a care home should I not be allowed to see her purely because she lives in her own house?

Edited February 18, 2021 by JoeyT

[Mr.Tease]

7 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

If people are allowed to visit literal care homes then we should be allowed to visit family and friends. Fucking ridiculous if not. 

I wish they'd hurry up with the data on vaccinated people being able to transmit the virus or not (and the extent), but even without that I don't see people not visiting friends and family who have been vaccinated, because they'll be thinking "if not now, then when?".

The problem with visiting family and friends indoors is that it seems to be one of the highest sources of transmission, and has little to no economic benefit, which is why it always gets put to the bottom of the list of priorities, despite being pretty much at the top of most peoples priorities (it's definitely mine). 

[steviewevie]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/18/wildly-unfair-un-says-130-countries-have-not-received-a-single-covid-vaccine-dose

[BobWillis]

1 minute ago, JoeyT said:

I see your point however just because for instance my Nan (87) who has also been vaccinated doesn't live in a care home should I not be allowed to see her purely because she lives in her own house?

Who is stopping you going round and seeing her? There isn’t police on every street corner. 

[steviewevie]

 

[Guest]

Just now, JoeyT said:

I see your point however just because my for instance my Nan (87) who has also been vaccinated doesn't live in a care home should I not be allowed to see her purely because she lives in her own house?

No but where do they draw a line with it? You never know they might say that’s ok but that stuff will come in time. They are trying to ensure some of the most isolated from their families will be able to see people which will be a big help to many and shouldn’t be looked at as a bad thing.

[zahidf]

Health minister Helen Whately said visitors to care homes would still be expected to wear PPE to protect residents even if visiting rules are relaxed (see here for earlier comments).

Speaking to BBC Breakfast, Whately said:

There is still a way to go to see, for instance, whether the vaccine stops people from being infectious and how it plays through. Visiting will be taken step by step and we will, for instance, when people come back to more normal visiting, still be asking people to use PPE and follow those kinds of procedures.

[JoeyT]

Just now, BobWillis said:

Who is stopping you going round and seeing her? There isn’t police on every street corner. 

True and in reality I will do soon anyway however I'm more making the point that the rules shouldn't be different depending on where you live.

[zahidf]

3 minutes ago, Mr.Tease said:

I wish they'd hurry up with the data on vaccinated people being able to transmit the virus or not (and the extent), but even without that I don't see people not visiting friends and family who have been vaccinated, because they'll be thinking "if not now, then when?".

The problem with visiting family and friends indoors is that it seems to be one of the highest sources of transmission, and has little to no economic benefit, which is why it always gets put to the bottom of the list of priorities, despite being pretty much at the top of most peoples priorities (it's definitely mine). 

But then its completely unenforceable, so most people do it anyway. The govt turns a blind eye and dont see the need to address it

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, zahidf said:

most people do it anyway.

do they?

[Mellotr0n]

7 minutes ago, JoeyT said:

True and in reality I will do soon anyway however I'm more making the point that the rules shouldn't be different depending on where you live.

It's a really tricky one - that so many of us are going to be wrestling with in the coming weeks.

My Dad is 70, and within a week it will be 3 weeks since his jab, which I understand is pretty much the point from which you have as much protection as you are going to get from the first dose.

He's very sociable, and understandably very, very low mentally at the moment as he cannot see anyone, nor does he really have anything to do with himself.

He wants to see his grandchildren, and we are moving rapidly towards a situation where realistically he is statistically very unlikely to be a danger to his grandchildren, nor them to him. Yet it seems the guidance will be nothing indoors for at least another couple of months or so?

What's the answer?

Edited February 18, 2021 by Mellotr0n

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

do they?

I don’t think they do, if they did we wouldn’t see be seeing cases fall like they have done. 

[xxialac]

25 minutes ago, Zoo Music Girl said:

Don't think I said it was wrong? Was just saying I know people who did.

Yeah apologies, was referring more generally to the implication that individuals who travelled last Summer were open to criticism.

[Crazyfool01]

1 minute ago, Mellotr0n said:

It's a tricky one that we're all going to be wrestling with in the coming weeks.

My Dad is 70, and within a week he will be past 3 weeks, which I understand is pretty much the point from which you have as much protection as you are going to get from the first dose. He's very sociable, and understandably very, very low mentally at the moment as he cannot see anyone, nor does he really have anything to do with himself.

He wants to see his grandchildren, and we are moving rapidly towards a situation where realistically he is statistically very unlikely to be a danger to his grandchildren, nor them to him. Yet it seems the guidance will be nothing indoors for at least another couple of months or so?

What's the answer?

I don’t know the answer but if thinking of it what about an outside compromise when it’s less shitty weather obviously ... obviously depends on how near you are too ... it’s so hard .. my mum is starting to show some early signs of dementia ... so I really to weigh this up while she is still ok ... as I know time may become limited ... cos I’m quite local I’ll likely end up going for a walk with them ... maybe before I’m allowed too 

[RobertProsineckisLighter]

14 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

No but where do they draw a line with it? You never know they might say that’s ok but that stuff will come in time. They are trying to ensure some of the most isolated from their families will be able to see people which will be a big help to many and shouldn’t be looked at as a bad thing.

People in care homes are not as isolated as old people living at home alone. They get interaction with others. 

Even if the person living at home has a carer there are no gurentee's it will be the same carer. 

Not everyone lives round corner from their families to form support bubbles and the such with. 

[Stokesy10]

45 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

 

My mom works in a care home. They'd had little to zero cases up until the last 2 months. The staff, plus residents have now all had their first vaccine. Since then their Covid cases went through the roof (including 3 deaths) to the extent that they had to call in agency cover. A conspiracists dream. Things have settled slightly but it's crazy how quickly it changed there, and sods law it was after the first vaccine.

[Fuzzy Afro]

18 minutes ago, Mr.Tease said:

I wish they'd hurry up with the data on vaccinated people being able to transmit the virus or not (and the extent), but even without that I don't see people not visiting friends and family who have been vaccinated, because they'll be thinking "if not now, then when?".

The problem with visiting family and friends indoors is that it seems to be one of the highest sources of transmission, and has little to no economic benefit, which is why it always gets put to the bottom of the list of priorities, despite being pretty much at the top of most peoples priorities (it's definitely mine). 

Spot on. I’d be reluctantly okay with a longer closure of hospitality and tourism but the isolation from family is REALLY getting to me atm. It really grates my carrot the idea that people who are genuinely vulnerable to the virus could be allowed to see loved ones before those of us who are not at risk.