When will this shit end?

[Ozanne]

2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

The hospitalisation and death rates should start to drop over the next few weeks and months, and then they'll have to work out how much is due to lockdown, and how much is due to vaccines....I guess the only way to find out is lift lockdown restrictions and see what happens?!

Patrick Vallance has said this morning that the vaccination programme was not yet ‘anywhere near’ the point it would bring the spread of the virus under control. So I think they’ll do as you say but slowly loosen restrictions and monitor the effects. 

[MrBarry465]

2 hours ago, zahidf said:

Govt has to take the economy into account. If Vaccines reduces the R rate enough, theyll open up

What good is the economy if loads of people are getting sick? 

At this point the government might as well just get as close to elimination as possible, we have a vaccine- sick of all the fucking around. I see 0 point in all these half measures now.

[JoeyT]

How "loose" did the restrictions actually get during the summer?

I don't know if my memory is going or I've just removed 2020 but I can't really remember.

Pubs opened but table service only wasn't it?

Were there limits on numbers outdoors?

[DeanoL]

  

13 hours ago, zahidf said:

Yup... surely you can hang out with your vaccinated mates once you're vaccinated!

 

 

If you don't see anyone else that isn't vaccinated, sure. As you can still catch it and pass it on. In the same way that if my household and my mates' household all work from home, get food delivered, don't go shopping, we can safely visit each other at home. It's still against the rules though. 

But if you're vaccinated and can still transmit it, and you need to interact with non-vaccinated people, then it's somewhat unfair to start socialising. 

12 hours ago, Ozanne said:

How weird, we’ve just been talking about something similar. I wonder how they’ll go about doing it

They'll have companies bid for getting their employees done.

12 hours ago, dotdash79 said:

I know it sounds a lot but a day rate of £1000 isn’t a lot, especially as that going to a company. But 900 at that rate is silly. 

The day rate isn't massive for people who are terrific at the job, but it's massive for what they've delivered. A single superstar developer on that rate could have knocked up the app in the time it took them, another one or two for testing and deployment.

[ace56blaa]

1 minute ago, JoeyT said:

How "loose" did the restrictions actually get during the summer?

I don't know if my memory is going or I've just removed 2020 but I can't really remember.

Pubs opened but table service only wasn't it?

Were there limits on numbers outdoors?

Lol. alot of pubs abandoned table service very quickly. 

They had to reinstate as a measure when putting places in tiers

[MrBarry465]

21 minutes ago, zahidf said:

THe govt arent going to wait for everyone to be vaccinated to lift restrictions. No govt will be

Some restrictions will get lifted, but it's clear that the messaging at the moment is they want to get people vaccinated and do this properly.

Why are you so desperate for them to rush stuff through? This is a really critical moment in the pandemic.

[zahidf]

2 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

Some restrictions will get lifted, but it's clear that the messaging at the moment is they want to get people vaccinated and do this properly.

Why are you so desperate for them to rush stuff through? This is a really critical moment in the pandemic.

I didn't say i was desperate. I'm just saying Govts aren't going to wait for 70% of the population to be vaccinated before opening up to a large degree.

Edited January 20, 2021 by zahidf

[Homer]

4 minutes ago, JoeyT said:

How "loose" did the restrictions actually get during the summer?

I don't know if my memory is going or I've just removed 2020 but I can't really remember.

Pubs opened but table service only wasn't it?

Were there limits on numbers outdoors?

You could go to the pub and there were some indoor gigs and comedy.

[MrBarry465]

1 minute ago, zahidf said:

I didn't say i was desperate. I'm just saying Govts aren't going to wait for 70% of the population to be vaccinated before opening up to a large degree.

I disagree, the best way out of this properly now is through herd immunity. It will be best for both the economy and peoples health.

 

 

[DeanoL]

 

15 hours ago, HalfAnIdiot said:

I seem to remember folk on here decrying any attempt to compare the strong UK vaccination roll-out performance compared to the rest of the world. Meanwhile there is a race to dig up as many negative covid related comparisons as possible.

It seems to be 'good' to point out where we fall behind, but 'bad' to point out where we are ahead.

This thread is mostly just janother example of the sad world of heavily polarised, over simplified, confirmation-biased & entrenched 'political' views that we now live in.

 

Simple explanation: they're different "folk". This thread isn't something produced by one or two people. There's loads on here, probably about 50, with at least 20-odd regular contributors. There's certainly no consensus, indeed, there are regular arguments.

When you're behind a screen it's easy to look at something like this and see it as "other" with you on the opposing side. But it's not. It's loads of different others, all with different viewpoints and lived experiences. Are some of those people acting a bit like you point out? One or two maybe. And is the mood here prevailingly negative? Well yes. 1000+ people are dying every day, we can't leave our homes, our hospital infrastructure is close to being overwhelmed. The positive is that "it might end soon". But it's hard to celebrate that as "soon" probably still means 30,000+ more people dying. So yeah it's not going to be all that jolly.

But I'd suggest instead of seeing it as a "thread", see it as a collection of people, all trying to find a way through this mess, as best they can, and sharing ideas, thoughts and feelings that may or may not reflect your own, but are genuinely what they feel, in the moment.

[Fuzzy Afro]

2 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

I disagree, the best way out of this properly now is through herd immunity. It will be best for both the economy and peoples health.

 

 

Which will be achieved faster by opening up because you’ll have non-vulnerable people gaining immunity by infection in tandem with vaccination 

[MrBarry465]

Just now, Fuzzy Afro said:

Which will be achieved faster by opening up because you’ll have non-vulnerable people gaining immunity by infection in tandem with vaccination 

Silly approach, throwing people out to the wolves so to speak. 

[Fuzzy Afro]

Just now, MrBarry465 said:

Silly approach, throwing people out to the wolves so to speak. 

The wolves 😂

[FakeEmpire]

9 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

What good is the economy if loads of people are getting sick? 

At this point the government might as well just get as close to elimination as possible, we have a vaccine- sick of all the fucking around. I see 0 point in all these half measures now.

You're absolutely right, of course. Zero covid policy is the best  approach and it's what most of us have wanted since the beginning. We could and should have done it.

I just fear we've missed the boat on that now. It requires a long, hard lockdown and for so many of us, we've been doing that for 10 months already and just don't have the ability to keep doing it for another 6-9 months (which is how long that would probably take).

A long lockdown is probably easier for those who pissed about July-Dec but for those of us who remained cautious throughout, it's really difficult now. It's not so much about pubs and holidays for me, I just want to be able to see a few friends and family.

[fraybentos1]

1 minute ago, MrBarry465 said:

Silly approach, throwing people out to the wolves so to speak. 

So no opening up at all till 70% odd fully vaccinated is your view?

Schools closed till then too surely if that's your view?

[MrBarry465]

Just now, FakeEmpire said:

You're absolutely right, of course. Zero covid policy is the best  approach and it's what most of us have wanted since the beginning. We could and should have done it.

I just fear we've missed the boat on that now. It requires a long, hard lockdown and for so many of us, we've been doing that for 10 months already and just don't have the ability to keep doing it for another 6-9 months (which is how long that would probably take).

A long lockdown is probably easier for those who pissed about July-Dec but for those of us who remained cautious throughout, it's really difficult now. It's not so much about pubs and holidays for me, I just want to be able to see a few friends and family.

I actually don't think it's unachievable for the UK to be honest. They are saying they want everyone jabbed by September, if they control the borders properly - it's easily achievable.

Restrictions can be eased throughout the year.

[Zoo Music Girl]

52 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Thats unduly pessimistic IMO. I can see open air gigs in the summer for sure 

We had gigs in summer and autumn 2020, so can't see why we wouldn't this year with the vaccines added to the mix. They might be socially distanced, though, at least to being with. And open air definitely seems more likely to happen.

[MrBarry465]

2 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

The wolves 😂

Prodding people out with pitchforks to achieve 'herd immunity' when there is already a vaccine in play, is reckless and dangerous.

[MrBarry465]

2 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

So no opening up at all till 70% odd fully vaccinated is your view?

Schools closed till then too surely if that's your view?

Fully support a gradual easing of restrictions, but flicking a switch once the vulnerable have been vaccinated is fucking idiotic yes.

[fraybentos1]

Just now, MrBarry465 said:

Fully support a gradual easing of restrictions, but flicking a switch once the vulnerable have been vaccinated is fucking idiotic yes.

That doesn't really answer my question. How can restrictions be eased prior to herd immunity (e.g opening schools etc) while adopting a 'zero-covid' strategy? Genuinely curious, this is not a dig.

[DeanoL]

17 hours ago, crazyfool1 said:

just watched an article on BBC news about the current state of things in a uk hospital ..... bloody horrendous 😞 

I think there's an understated impact from this... my partner had to go to the hospital yesterday to pick up a relative's belongings.

Essentially, there were close to zero controls in place - people weren't distancing, the one way system was being ignored (presumably as staff *have* to because of resourcing, so then the public do to), she was told to go to the COVID ward to pick up the stuff, where a nurse just went inside and handed it to her. No protocols for disinfecting it, no advice given (maybe wait 3 days before opening it). With the system being overwhelmed, there's no resource for a more sensible approach ("we will clean the items and send them to the bereavement office, where you can collect them in a week").

I don't blame the staff, at all, they have to do what they can. But when you are that close to breaking point, of course you're going to have people going into hospital for other reasons and getting COVID. And it's one thing if it's for life-saving treatment, it's another if it's just to fetch some things.

[Ozanne]

1 minute ago, MrBarry465 said:

Fully support a gradual easing of restrictions, but flicking a switch once the vulnerable have been vaccinated is fucking idiotic yes.

To be fair I think the way you suggest is what will end up happening. The government have sort of said that so far. 

[MrBarry465]

3 minutes ago, Zoo Music Girl said:

We had gigs in summer and autumn 2020

??? I must have missed that one.

[Fuzzy Afro]

3 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

Prodding people out with pitchforks to achieve 'herd immunity' when there is already a vaccine in play, is reckless and dangerous.

Pitchforks 😂 you really do use the weirdest analogies. 

[MrBarry465]

3 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

That doesn't really answer my question. How can restrictions be eased prior to herd immunity (e.g opening schools etc) while adopting a 'zero-covid' strategy? Genuinely curious, this is not a dig.

The zero covid strategy is gradually reached over an extended period, vaccinating consistently, aggresively and with restrictions being eased. It just takes longer to get there. The zero-covid strategy is aspirational, it's not something I am saying will be achieved overnight. It might not even be 'zero-covid' strategy, but just really aggressive supression so that we are not back to square one in 10 months.

It's key that the border restrictions are enforced properly. 

Edited January 20, 2021 by MrBarry465