Would a ballot be a fairer system?

[JoBalls]

43 minutes ago, billum said:

It looked like that was actually implemented in the Coach sales last Thursday and the Resale yesterday. There was a nice clear 5 minute countdown after entering registrations and hitting Proceed (or maybe 4 mins, hey I was in a rush!). So your wish has been granted!

Oh that's excellent! I think a few people were asking for it after the main sale this year, will be interesting to see if they adopt it for the main sale next October!

[incident]

Just now, Memory Man said:

as interesting as the arguable non sell-out of 2008 was, we are now very much in a completely different era almost a decade on where there is no way in the world glastonbury won't be selling out in 30 minutes. Its barely relevant any more as a repeat is pretty much unthinkable.

Thing is, if you'd posted that same statement - word for word - 10 years ago today, people would have agreed with you, and based on all evidence available at the time would have been right to do so.

The Festival (any Festival actually) is only ever one or two problems away from having serious issues, and those problems can come in many forms. Assuming instant sell-outs will continue in perpetuity would be a huge mistake on behalf of the Festival and not one I think they're likely to make.

 

5 minutes ago, Memory Man said:

In addition we've now got to a place where a shit weather year has been proven not to affect sales for the next year. AND whoever headlines doesn't really have any bearing on whether it will sell out.

We've not had any weather even half as bad as 2007 since though -  the ground conditions came close last year, but that's only a small part of the story. And the headliners may well have a bearing - but since 2008 there's only been one year (2013) where there wasn't any massive names (being to efestivals collective taste is a different story). If that happened twice in a row things might change in terms of perception.

 

[DeanoL]

 

3 hours ago, jparx said:

I still think the festival has just about the fairest possible system for getting tickets. If you're logged on to the site before they go on sale and focus on hitting that sweet F5, you have as much chance as anyone else. No priority sales, no 'golden circle' or any of that nonsense. And it must be the least scalped festival around, or at least one of them.

To be fair the nonsense does exist but it's hidden behind corporate VIP tickets and glamping options.

[maelzoid]

Although it has been in the news recently for all the wrong reasons, I wonder if Glasto do any overbooking. They must have a pretty decent idea about the number of tickets that will not be purchased and go back for resale. Would it not make sense to sell for example 10% more tickets in October, forget the resale and just do secret sales if needed.

Also, I think they should forget the bus ticket deal and simply sell bus transport as a separate option on a different occasion. 

[DeanoL]

1 minute ago, maelzoid said:

Although it has been in the news recently for all the wrong reasons, I wonder if Glasto do any overbooking. They must have a pretty decent idea about the number of tickets that will not be purchased and go back for resale. Would it not make sense to sell for example 10% more tickets in October, forget the resale and just do secret sales if needed.

Also, I think they should forget the bus ticket deal and simply sell bus transport as a separate option on a different occasion. 

They could, but it would be hugely risky if those tickets weren't returned as the license imposes a hard limit on attendee numbers, so there would be the chance, however small, of people having their tickets cancelled.

Likewise the coach packages, there's a restriction that X amount of people have to travel by public transport. So making those optional would probably mean restricting the number of car park passes sold instead.

[incident]

3 minutes ago, maelzoid said:

Also, I think they should forget the bus ticket deal and simply sell bus transport as a separate option on a different occasion. 

The capacity increase in 2007 came with a condition that the extra tickets could only be sold as combined coach/ticket packages so as to minimise extra traffic to the site.

I think there's probably a better way of achieving it than they're doing, but under the licence the Festival does need to ensure that at least 12,000 attendees are required to come by coach.

[Memory Man]

24 minutes ago, incident said:

Thing is, if you'd posted that same statement - word for word - 10 years ago today, people would have agreed with you, and based on all evidence available at the time would have been right to do so.

The Festival (any Festival actually) is only ever one or two problems away from having serious issues, and those problems can come in many forms. Assuming instant sell-outs will continue in perpetuity would be a huge mistake on behalf of the Festival and not one I think they're likely to make.

 

We've not had any weather even half as bad as 2007 since though -  the ground conditions came close last year, but that's only a small part of the story. And the headliners may well have a bearing - but since 2008 there's only been one year (2013) where there wasn't any massive names (being to efestivals collective taste is a different story). If that happened twice in a row things might change in terms of perception.

 

I don't really agree with anything you say apart from that the festival shouldn't be complacent. Back in 2008 Glastonbury was not the undisputed king of the UK festival scene that it is today. The competition has faded into the background. Coverage was big but not as completely blanket that it is today.

What problems would you see that would make it not sell out? The lineup this year not only has deserving and huge headliners (music taste aside) it also has incredible strength in depth. The fallow year will only make people want 2019 tickets more. Think we've got the stage now where there will be no shortage of big names wanting to headline so an unpopular headliner year now seems very unlikely.

Ticket prices have gone up massively and it has had zero effect on demand. Parking has gone up, travel has gone up. Nothing.

The ground conditions last year were nearly as bad as 2007, not quite. But yes the weather itself wasn't half bad. It was a big old slog though.

Furthermore festivals have now become a staple of summer for young people. The problems of the Glastonbury audience becoming older in 2008-9 have now been placed firmly in the rear view mirror as swathes of youth have come in to replace those who decide they are not going any more. Mainly based on the attraction of the SE corner and blandness of other main festivals.

Glastonbury's main competition is now events like primavera and other overseas behemoths and not Reading/Leeds, V and Bestival. Boutique and middle sized events are very popular and on the rise but can never compete line up wise.

Edited April 24, 2017 by Memory Man

[Deaf Nobby Burton]

2 minutes ago, Memory Man said:

I don't really agree with anything you say apart from that the festival shouldn't be complacent. Back in 2008 Glastonbury was not the undisputed king of the UK festival scene that it is today. The competition has faded into the background. Coverage was big but not as completely blanket that it is today.

What problems would you see that would make it not sell out? The lineup this year not only has deserving and huge headliners (music taste aside) it also has incredible strength in depth. The fallow year will only make people want 2019 tickets more. Think we've got the stage now where there will be no shortage of big names wanting to headline so an unpopular headliner year now seems very unlikely.

Ticket prices have gone up massively and it has had zero effect on demand. Parking has gone up, travel has gone up. Nothing.

The ground conditions last year were nearly as bad as 2007, not quite. But yes the weather itself wasn't half bad. It was a big old slog though.

 

But what has made the competition fade into the background? And what would make Glastonbury completely immune from this?

[Memory Man]

6 minutes ago, Deaf Nobby Burton said:

But what has made the competition fade into the background? And what would make Glastonbury completely immune from this?

Shit lineups from Reading / Leeds and them focusing on their core market of 16-24 year olds

Bestival was huge and won best large festival at a few awards back at the time but now it has reduced in popularity and has become a much smaller player.

Glastonbury is pretty much immune unless the lineups go seriously south, and i mean SERIOUSLY bad. But they seem to get stronger every year with this year being a prime example. No other UK festival comes close to matching up.

It would take multiple years of Verve/ The Who /  insert rock dinosaur Level poor quality headliners combined with multiple years of absolutely awful weather to seriously affect demand I would say. Even then the strength in depth would keep most engaged. Bands obviously want the coverage & kudos of playing.

The BBC pulling the plug would make things different but do you really see them doing that?

Edited April 24, 2017 by Memory Man

[Hawros]

The biggest mystery for me is how I'm ALWAYS camping next to a group of about 20 scousers...

[russycarps]

9 minutes ago, Memory Man said:

I don't really agree with anything you say apart from that the festival shouldn't be complacent. Back in 2008 Glastonbury was not the undisputed king of the UK festival scene that it is today. The competition has faded into the background. Coverage was big but not as completely blanket that it is today.

What problems would you see that would make it not sell out? The lineup this year not only has deserving and huge headliners (music taste aside) it also has incredible strength in depth. The fallow year will only make people want 2019 tickets more. Think we've got the stage now where there will be no shortage of big names wanting to headline so an unpopular headliner year now seems very unlikely.

Ticket prices have gone up massively and it has had zero effect on demand. Parking has gone up, travel has gone up. Nothing.

The ground conditions last year were nearly as bad as 2007, not quite. But yes the weather itself wasn't half bad. It was a big old slog though.

Furthermore festivals have now become a staple of summer for young people. The problems of the Glastonbury audience becoming older in 2008-9 have now been placed firmly in the rear view mirror as swathes of youth have come in to replace those who decide they are not going any more. Mainly based on the attraction of the SE corner and blandness of other main festivals.

Glastonbury's main competition is now events like primavera and other overseas behemoths and not Reading/Leeds, V and Bestival. Boutique and middle sized events are very popular and on the rise but can never compete line up wise.

All it will take is for festivals to no longer to be the in thing to do, and they'll go out of fashion rapidly. Peoples attention span in this day and age are incredibly short. Something will come along to replace festivals soon enough.

 

[incident]

4 minutes ago, Memory Man said:

What problems would you see that would make it not sell out?

Anything similar to 2007s weather would be an obvious one.. Especially if it happened twice in consecutive years.

Last year just can't be compared - while at times moving around was nearly as hard, the site wasn't quite as blanketed in mud (the high ground didn't cut up nearly as much) and most importantly there wasn't the constant misery of rain every waking moment for 4 days (and during the evacuation on the Monday) - and as the sun was shining most of the time, ultimately the TV pictures looked great so someone watching at home would have thought "that looks great, I think I might do that".

That's part of it. While there's definitely a good core of people (just about everyone on here for example) who'll be looking to go every year regardless, I think there's a huge number who'll go because it's the thing to do.. and that's something that can change almost overnight.

[Deaf Nobby Burton]

Just now, Memory Man said:

Shit lineups from Reading / Leeds and them focusing on their core market of 16-24 year olds

Bestival was huge and won best large festival at a few awards back at the time but now it has reduced in popularity and has become a much smaller player.

Glastonbury is pretty much immune unless the lineups go seriously south, and i mean SERIOUSLY bad. But they seem to get stronger every year with this year being a prime example. No other UK festival comes close to matching up.

It was a genuine question that I don't know the answer to, I know with Bestival I went a couple of times when it was on the ascendancy, then last year it didn't sell out and had to scale back, now they have had to move site completely. I can't see a reason for their relative demise other than increased competition from other similar festivals like boomtown etc. Obviously Glastonbury is a unique festival, but you can't take for granted that people's tastes won't change over time regardless of the lineup. For what it's worth just like you, I don't see it myself, but when people are coming up with new systems for buying tickets they have to allow for the fact there is no reason for the festival to put any sort of barriers in the way of people attending.

[billum]

7 minutes ago, Memory Man said:

The BBC pulling the plug would make things different but do you really see them doing that?

Not really, they're giving it bigger coverage every year. But even if they did, Channel 4 would snap up the rights to show it.

[The Nal]

6 minutes ago, incident said:

Anything similar to 2007s weather would be an obvious one.. Especially if it happened twice in consecutive years.

Maybe but don't forget how easier it is these days to get stuff done. In 07 there were still portaloos everywhere. Not nearly as many toilets as they have no and they were fucking filthy. Toilets over the last few years have been very well maintained. Theres a shitload of bank machines now so no more walking up to (what is now) the Park to queue for an hour for some cash. Theres a shitload more food and booze options aswell. Essential, basic stuff that a lot of other festivals don't have. 

The BBC pulling the plug would make things different but do you really see them doing that?

Not when they have 19 million people watching over the weekend. 

Edited April 24, 2017 by The Nal

[joeltg]

As many have already stated, there simply is no fairer system in my honest opinion.

As long as demand far outstrips supply, we are always going to have disappointments but most efesters have thought long and hard about this I am sure.

I do have a ticket this year, but did miss out last year - so worked it, and would do again.

We have a group that is very organised, is ready every ticket day at least an hour early (8am with coffee!) and the successes are far more than the disappointments. Luck of course helps.

If it means alot to go, you will find a way. ticket of no ticket.

 

[jparx]

37 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

 

To be fair the nonsense does exist but it's hidden behind corporate VIP tickets and glamping options.

Sure but as long as it's not dangled in front of me when I'm trying to buy my tickets I'm not too fussed. I hate trying to be upsold stuff.

Edited April 24, 2017 by jparx

[maelzoid]

56 minutes ago, Hawros said:

The biggest mystery for me is how I'm ALWAYS camping next to a group of about 20 scousers...

The number of Scousers in attendance always seems to be statistically high, that I'm convinced that the seetickets server is in Merseyside.

No bad thing of course, they usually add to the value.

[Deaf Nobby Burton]

5 minutes ago, maelzoid said:

The number of Scousers in attendance always seems to be statistically high, that I'm convinced that the seetickets server is in Merseyside.

No bad thing of course, they usually add to the value.

Not wishing to perpetuate any stereotypes, but any scousers I've ever spoken to have always insisted the vast majority of them bunked in.

[Hawros]

1 hour ago, DeanoL said:

They could, but it would be hugely risky if those tickets weren't returned as the license imposes a hard limit on attendee numbers, so there would be the chance, however small, of people having their tickets cancelled.

Likewise the coach packages, there's a restriction that X amount of people have to travel by public transport. So making those optional would probably mean restricting the number of car park passes sold instead.

You're right - I'd go as far as say it's a condition of the licence. (Or conversely, would be a breach of the licence to oversell like this).

Edited April 24, 2017 by Hawros

[russycarps]

23 minutes ago, Deaf Nobby Burton said:

Not wishing to perpetuate any stereotypes, but any scousers I've ever spoken to have always insisted the vast majority of them bunked in.

how many have you spoken to?

[Deaf Nobby Burton]

1 minute ago, russycarps said:

how many have you spoken to?

All of them.

[Memory Man]

3 hours ago, billum said:

Not really, they're giving it bigger coverage every year. But even if they did, Channel 4 would snap up the rights to show it.

exactly. Whilst ever the BBC or a big terrestrial channel is interesting in doing mass coverage the bands and agents will always be queuing up to be featured and goes on to keep the event stable & safe with a constant production line of acts wanting to play for a reasonable or lower fee. Which will keep punters coming, which will lead to it selling out year on year

The only thing that could kill glastonbury is the environmental aspect i.e peeing on the land or some other freak incident that no one would have seen coming, which again is very unlikely. Further and persistent traffic issues could have a serious effect too but that seemed to only be bad last year due to the weather.

All in all, talk of the non sell out in 2008 is pretty much redundant in 2017 and will continue to be as time moves on.

Edited April 24, 2017 by Memory Man

[Roger1]

5 hours ago, billum said:

Interesting idea for a festival! Nobody pays anything for tickets but every attendee works some part of the festival for at least some of the time.... Love it!

Not suggesting everyone works just the people who Glastonbury matters. 

[Wooderson]

4 hours ago, Deaf Nobby Burton said:

Not wishing to perpetuate any stereotypes, but any scousers I've ever spoken to have always insisted the vast majority of them bunked in.

Where are you from