Reusable pint glasses

[glasto-worker]

29 minutes ago, stuartbert two hats said:

250,000 doesn't sound like enough to me.  That's roughly 1 cup for everyone on site.  Accepting that not everyone is drinking, it still doesn't seem like very many unless they're going to be very fast at getting them off-site, cleaned and back again.

I fully agree - now I have no information on how this is being implemented but it looks as if it may be very close to the system the WBC use at Latitude.

I doubt any will be washed onsite - that was looked into but it was rejected by Health and Safety - they all have to be sterilised which is near impossible to do onsite.

its a big Operation and it takes up a enormous amount of space just to keep the clean cups away from the Dirty Cups and of course at some point the Dirty Cups have to be transported to a holding area
where they are shipped out.

The system the wbc have used for over ten years ' No washed cup was ever returned while Latitude was on ' - its not set up for a quick turnaround 

sure a  quick turnaround  could be done but that would add to the cost.

I am sure that some people imagine that there is Pub glass washer working away in a tent somewhere.

If they show up with 250,000 cups that will run out in a few days as people will be collecting them.

In fact its the same dilemma the WBC had when they introduced it at Latitude as it was impossible to predict how many would be kept and how many was required to cover them for the whole weekend.

its taken them years using previous demand to get it close so that nearly no paper cups end up being used.

It will be interesting to see how they manage it.

I reckon there will be a fair amount of paper cups still in use.

[stuartbert two hats]

6 minutes ago, glasto-worker said:

I fully agree - now I have no information on how this is being implemented but it looks as if it may be very close to the system the WBC use at Latitude.

I doubt any will be washed onsite - that was looked into but it was rejected by Health and Safety - they all have to be sterilised which is near impossible to do onsite.

its a big Operation and it takes up a enormous amount of space just to keep the clean cups away from the Dirty Cups and of course at some point the Dirty Cups have to be transported to a holding area
where they are shipped out.

The system the wbc have used for over ten years ' No washed cup was ever returned while Latitude was on ' - its not set up for a quick turnaround 

sure a  quick turnaround  could be done but that would add to the cost.

I am sure that some people imagine that there is Pub glass washer working away in a tent somewhere.

If they show up with 250,000 cups that will run out in a few days as people will be collecting them.

In fact its the same dilemma the WBC had when they introduced it at Latitude as it was impossible to predict how many would be kept and how many was required to cover them for the whole weekend.

its taken them years using previous demand to get it close so that nearly no paper cups end up being used.

It will be interesting to see how they manage it.

I reckon there will be a fair amount of paper cups still in use.

What's the total number of cups for Latitude?  I really can't imagine 250,000 lasting long into Thursday if they're not being cleaned within the timeframe of the festival.

Could steel be easier to clean, so that's the reason plastic cups aren't being used?  I agree, it'll be mainly paper cups by Friday.

[Sawdusty surfer]

On 14/04/2016 at 10:17 AM, pie_and_a_pint said:

 

As a drinker, it's also good news - they'll keep a drink colder for longer and (unlike the paper ones) they won't leak out of the bottom if you don't neck your pint!

Can't see how a steel cup will keep beer colder for longer.....cardboard is a much better insulator than steel.

[incident]

31 minutes ago, glasto-worker said:

I am sure that some people imagine that there is Pub glass washer working away in a tent somewhere.

I wasn't thinking that.. But I was thinking that given most of the Festival site is used for Dairy Farming, it's very likely that Worthy Farm and/or the extremely large Dairy Unit near Gate D would have some form of commercial grade sterilisation capabilities, and that it may be possible to use those in part.

[glasto-worker]

17 minutes ago, stuartbert two hats said:

What's the total number of cups for Latitude?  I really can't imagine 250,000 lasting long into Thursday if they're not being cleaned within the timeframe of the festival.

Could steel be easier to clean, so that's the reason plastic cups aren't being used?  I agree, it'll be mainly paper cups by Friday.

would not have a clue as the WBC sold the Reusable cup Company to a French Company a few years ago.

Their job is to get the new cups in place and then collect the used ones - get them cleaned ' in France ' and they arrive back the year later .

its like a large factory with specialized equipment where they wash them. 

The Reusable plastic cups are designed to be sterilized ' at least 90 times '

sure steel may be easier to clean but you have to think of the volume - even if they built a wash plant next to the farm its still a massive operation.

I am not sure this has been thought though - the demand could run into the millions.

time will tell how they get on

[stuartbert two hats]

Overview from the beeb.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-36081818

2 minutes ago, glasto-worker said:

I am not sure this has been thought though - the demand could run into the millions.

time will tell how they get on

Since it's just from 10 bars, I'm guessing it's meant as a pilot rather than a full replacement for paper cups.  On that basis even if they run out quickly that doesn't necessarily mean it's a failure or hasn't been thought through, they're probably just trying to get some experience running it at a reasonable scale.

Unless of course those 10 bars end up running out of paper cups, in which case it's not been thought through!  Time will tell, for sure.

[glasto-worker]

1 hour ago, stuartbert two hats said:

Overview from the beeb.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-36081818

Since it's just from 10 bars, I'm guessing it's meant as a pilot rather than a full replacement for paper cups.  On that basis even if they run out quickly that doesn't necessarily mean it's a failure or hasn't been thought through, they're probably just trying to get some experience running it at a reasonable scale.

Unless of course those 10 bars end up running out of paper cups, in which case it's not been thought through!  Time will tell, for sure.

well spotted - so its either Avalon or the WBC although have not heard anything about it ' from people who should know ' and all the ones in the office are dealing with allocation just now so I am not going to ask them 

I suspect it may be Avalon.

They will for sure ' not run out of paper cups '

[buddiepaul]

The article at the beginning of the thread indicates they are sent to a place near Wells for washing.  I have been wondering for the last week whether 250,000 is enough, and I can't decide.  Not everyone will want a beer, but say 75K people have 3 beers each day that gets you to 225,000.  I assume there would have to be a number of shuttles of cups to the washing facility during the day.  The logistics for this, and then getting them back to the bars will require some organisation in itself.    

[barcelonista1899]

Could it be that 10 bars in question could be a mixture of hospitality and worker's bars? They had the plastic cups last year so maybe they are trialling them there this year?

...Although being so public about it would go against that thought, and it also mentions in that BBC article about it being the 'main' bars. 

Edited April 19, 2016 by barcelonista1899

[glasto-worker]

15 hours ago, buddiepaul said:

The article at the beginning of the thread indicates they are sent to a place near Wells for washing.  I have been wondering for the last week whether 250,000 is enough, and I can't decide.  Not everyone will want a beer, but say 75K people have 3 beers each day that gets you to 225,000.  I assume there would have to be a number of shuttles of cups to the washing facility during the day.  The logistics for this, and then getting them back to the bars will require some organisation in itself.    

The devil in in the detail - if they are at 10 Public Bars then there is still a problem moving the dirty cups from the bar to a shipping area - many of these bars don't have a fast exit point { but if it is the WBC then there is two that connect up to the Interstage area }

Now I am sure they will ship some - just to prove that is possible but I cant see them shipping tens of thousands to be sterilized each night.

Even moving new ones is going to be a right pain - I have lifted a standard paper cup box and its heavy - they are moved into place using a JCB { many days before the festival starts }

when you factor up the extra weight - those boxes will be heavy { be they clean or dirty }

at some point a bar will run out and a few boxes will be dropped off late at night { as they cant operate when there is many people about }

 image shows the 'standard paper cup boxes on a pallet'  

Time will tell how they manage it.Give it a day or two and I bet there is a shortage and it will be back to paper cups.

[stuartbert two hats]

11 minutes ago, glasto-worker said:

The devil in in the detail - if they are at 10 Public Bars then there is still a problem moving the dirty cups from the bar to a shipping area - many of these bars don't have a fast exit point { but if it is the WBC then there is two that connect up to the Interstage area }

Now I am sure they will ship some - just to prove that is possible but I cant see them shipping tens of thousands to be sterilized each night.

Even moving new ones is going to be a right pain - I have lifted a standard paper cup box and its heavy - they are moved into place using a JCB { many days before the festival starts }

when you factor up the extra weight - those boxes will be heavy { be they clean or dirty }

at some point a bar will run out and a few boxes will be dropped off late at night { as they cant operate when there is many people about }

 image shows the 'standard paper cup boxes on a pallet'  

Time will tell how they manage it.Give it a day or two and I bet there is a shortage and it will be back to paper cups.

That's not necessarily a failure though, whoever is planning this knows how many paper cups they normally use, and roughly how many they expect to clean over the festival.  From what I can tell, these numbers suggest that they expect to fall back to paper cups at some point.  This screams learning exercise rather than attempt to replace paper cups.  At least for now.

[the fluorescent adolescent]

What about a system where pint is poured passed to you and you decant in your steel pint pot?

[Memory Man]

44 minutes ago, the fluorescent adolescent said:

What about a system where pint is poured passed to you and you decant in your steel pint pot?

doesnt make any sense though does it as you still have the useage of the paper cup and waste. Granted they could take the cup back off you to save it going into a bin or on the floor around the site but its still going into a bin on site whether it be front or back of house.

[Sawdusty surfer]

I've got a few of the prototypes, exactly the same except they have the Glastonbury logo etched on. 

 

  Just weighed one...  114g. A stack of 8 is surprisingly weighty.

   That means that 250,000 weighs in at a mighty 28.5 tonnes!  That is about the max load on an artic.

Edited April 20, 2016 by Sawdusty Surfer

[the fluorescent adolescent]

33 minutes ago, Memory Man said:

doesnt make any sense though does it as you still have the useage of the paper cup and waste. Granted they could take the cup back off you to save it going into a bin or on the floor around the site but its still going into a bin on site whether it be front or back of house.

What does make sense?

[stuartbert two hats]

1 hour ago, the fluorescent adolescent said:

What about a system where pint is poured passed to you and you decant in your steel pint pot?

What do you see as the advantages in this?

[the fluorescent adolescent]

7 minutes ago, stuartbert two hats said:

What do you see as the advantages in this?

Well i thought the bar staff can't decanter into a unclean pint pot but you can. Then the bar staff recycle the container they used and have control on how its wasted and not some pissed up festival goer who will throw it on the ground

Edited April 20, 2016 by the fluorescent adolescent

[chrislfc]

18 minutes ago, the fluorescent adolescent said:

Well i thought the bar staff can't decanter into a unclean pint pot but you can. Then the bar staff recycle the container they used and have control on how its wasted and not some pissed up festival goer who will throw it on the ground

As long as the steel cups are oversized slightly so that you don't lose half your pint in the pouring technique.

[4AssedMonkey]

I think there is a great deal of merit in this, but the scale of it is far too small.  250,000 won't scratch the surface of demand.  If it's 10 of the largest/main bars around the site, I reckon they could get through 250,000 each and could still run out through the weekend due to the turn around times on sterilisation.  Plus people will be happy to pay £5 for an engraved stainless steel pint pot as a Glasto souvenir so loads will go missing.

[Sawdusty surfer]

26 minutes ago, 4AssedMonkey said:

  Plus people will be happy to pay £5 for an engraved stainless steel pint pot as a Glasto souvenir so loads will go missing.

 

As I understand it, the big batch of them at this year's festival will have NO logo. This could mean that fewer are retained as souvenirs. Only the small batch of prototypes were etched. 

[buddiepaul]

I think we agree that 250,000 is not enough, however Sawdusty Surfer has identified the logistics around this (particularly the weight) even at 250,000 will be a problem, especially with the requirement of multiple movements during the weekend.  With a greater number of cups, would this even be possible, unless a local arrangement could be reached?

 

[Keithy]

2 hours ago, 4AssedMonkey said:

I think there is a great deal of merit in this, but the scale of it is far too small.  250,000 won't scratch the surface of demand.  If it's 10 of the largest/main bars around the site, I reckon they could get through 250,000 each and could still run out through the weekend due to the turn around times on sterilisation.  Plus people will be happy to pay £5 for an engraved stainless steel pint pot as a Glasto souvenir so loads will go missing.

It's just a continuation of the Pilton Party trial though so the demand is irrelevant. Pilton Party was a proof of concept to see on a small scale how well it worked. The next stage of testing is increase it to a larger volume in a controlled environment (the 10 bars) and see how well it goes. So what if they run out? They will go to paper cups. That has no bearing on the success of the trial. They will probably be looking at their turn around times for the off-site and see how many they lose (they are not engraved, that was the Pilton Party ones) and people's feedback to them. I expect the washing will be done over night or maybe an afternoon and night 'wash run'. 150k clean at midday, new 100k batch at 7pm whilst the midday 150k are off site for washing. Main bars close early hours, the 100k go for a wash and the 150k clean ones arrive for the next day.

A good example for comparison is the compost loo's. They had a limited trial in 2013, expanded in 2014 and virtually replaced portaloo's in 2015.

Depending on the success, it'll be a couple of years before paper cups are in the minority.

[goldfishboy]

On 14/04/2016 at 10:17 AM, pie_and_a_pint said:

As a litterpicker, this is music to my ears (and my back muscles!)

As a drinker, it's also good news - they'll keep a drink colder for longer and (unlike the paper ones) they won't leak out of the bottom if you don't neck your pint!

I bet if the sun's out your beer will get lovely and hot in one of these! I'm still in favour though.

[Sawdusty surfer]

Here's a pic of one of the original batch. The logo is only faintly etched on.

 

[Titters]

1 hour ago, Keithy said:

It's just a continuation of the Pilton Party trial though so the demand is irrelevant. Pilton Party was a proof of concept to see on a small scale how well it worked. The next stage of testing is increase it to a larger volume in a controlled environment (the 10 bars) and see how well it goes.

Stop being sensible Keith,

They'll run out, there'll be panic, and people will be selling cans for £20 a pop.