When will this shit end?

[hodgey123]

21 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

they definitely are the way out of this...it's just going to be gradual. Maybe there is a bit of underpromising going on here too.

Yeah, I think I touched on the under-promising in a different post last night. It is what they did with the first vaccine target and the current phase targets have been dismissed as quite unambitious by some commentators so perhaps this is their new approach. 

[zahidf]

4 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

Why do people keep saying 'goal posts are shifting'. At no point during this pandemic has anyone ever provided me with goalposts on what I should expect, goalposts are rarely provided in life if ever.

We are moving into a rapidly changing world, on many levels, it's about time the general public get with the program.

Why? the public is just about going along with it for now, but post death reductions and mass vaccinations, that could very well change.

[stuartbert two hats]

Just now, zahidf said:

Why? the public is just about going along with it for now, but post death reductions and mass vaccinations, that could very well change.

When do you think we should open up?  We're going round in circles at the moment.

[MrBarry465]

Just now, zahidf said:

Why? the public is just about going along with it for now, but post death reductions and mass vaccinations, that could very well change.

I'd say have a look at some of the news coming out about mutant variants.

We have a long way to go mate and we do not want this getting into something more lethal.

[zahidf]

2 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

This is specifically the reason why we shouldn't rush to open up before vaccines kick in.

 

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2268014-exclusive-two-variants-have-merged-into-heavily-mutated-coronavirus/?utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=echobox&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1613495701 

"Most of the time, these don’t confer any advantage to the virus, but occasionally they do."

 

yeah, not staying locked up on the off chance of that

[efcfanwirral]

1 minute ago, MrBarry465 said:

This is specifically the reason why we shouldn't rush to open up before vaccines kick in.

 

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2268014-exclusive-two-variants-have-merged-into-heavily-mutated-coronavirus/?utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=echobox&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1613495701 

This will keep happening then - once vaccines are done we'll need another round of vaccinations before we can reopen. By which time there is another one from somewhere else and we'll need to do it all again. I don't think this talk of normality is realistic

[MrBarry465]

Just now, zahidf said:

"Most of the time, these don’t confer any advantage to the virus, but occasionally they do."

 

yeah, not staying locked up on the off chance of that

Good luck to you.

I say batten down the hatches this year, she's gonna be bumpy. 

[MrBarry465]

1 minute ago, efcfanwirral said:

This will keep happening then - once vaccines are done we'll need another round of vaccinations before we can reopen. By which time there is another one from somewhere else and we'll need to do it all again. I don't think this talk of normality is realistic

My suggestion to most people is to strap in for another weird 12 months ahead. If it gets better great, if it gets worse then at least you are prepared. 

[Copperface]

3 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

Why do people keep saying 'goal posts are shifting'. At no point during this pandemic has anyone ever provided me with goalposts on what I should expect, goalposts are rarely provided in life if ever.

We are moving into a rapidly changing world, on many levels, it's about time the general public get with the program.

They haven't shifted at all. It's always been out there that case and infection rates were equally as important as hospitalisation and death rates. Vaccines were also never seen as the sole way out of this - it's always been about a combination of vaccines plus improved treatments and non therapeutic measures. Getting to the 70% odd was always a key metric being circulated but generally ignored. Full opening after 'vaccinating the vulnerable' was always unlikely, up there with all restrictions will be dropped after March because the Coronavirus Act 'lapses'.

It's simply that people concentrate on the bits they want to be true and tend to disregard the rest. 

[zahidf]

Just now, stuartbert two hats said:

When do you think we should open up?  We're going round in circles at the moment.

oh, i think i posted it above. March schools, Easter shops/hospitality, End of May/middle of June everything except for hotel quarantine ( which im willing to keep in places for a little longer for everyone to catch up with our vaccinations)

 

Once groups 1-9 have had doses, and 1-4 two doses, we should have substantial reductions in restrictions. 

[zahidf]

5 minutes ago, efcfanwirral said:

This will keep happening then - once vaccines are done we'll need another round of vaccinations before we can reopen. By which time there is another one from somewhere else and we'll need to do it all again. I don't think this talk of normality is realistic

I think its the other way around. If the nerds say we have to lockdown again for booster shots, people wont do it. Household mixing will be even more unenforceable. 

[zahidf]

5 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

Good luck to you.

I say batten down the hatches this year, she's gonna be bumpy. 

Hey if individual people want to do that, up to them. 

[efcfanwirral]

4 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

My suggestion to most people is to strap in for another weird 12 months ahead. If it gets better great, if it gets worse then at least you are prepared. 

If it gets more deadly I'll be on board with the engineered by someone conspiracies. Everything I've read makes it sound like these viruses usually mutate to become more infectious but less deadly

[MrBarry465]

3 minutes ago, Copperface said:

They haven't shifted at all. It's always been out there that case and infection rates were equally as important as hospitalisation and death rates. Vaccines were also never seen as the sole way out of this - it's always been about a combination of vaccines plus improved treatments and non therapeutic measures. Getting to the 70% odd was always a key metric being circulated but generally ignored. Full opening after 'vaccinating the vulnerable' was always unlikely, up there with all restrictions will be dropped after March because the Coronavirus Act 'lapses'.

It's simply that people concentrate on the bits they want to be true and tend to disregard the rest. 

It's just the level of silliness that people are going to. 'Oh we can have nighclubs with thounsands of people opened up this year, as long as rapid testing (which currently has 40% accuracy) is done on the door'.

Meanwhile we still don't even have kids back at schools yet. It's just pie in the sky nonsense at this point. 

[stuie]

7 minutes ago, MrBarry465 said:

My suggestion to most people is to strap in for another weird 12 months ahead. If it gets better great, if it gets worse then at least you are prepared. 

Another 12 months of this is unimaginable for a lot of people whether that is due to loneliness, financial, business or mental health reasons.

We will unlock when the vaccination strategy reaches a certain point and accept the consequences.  The consequences of opening up are about to be dwarfed by the consequences of not. 

Edited February 17, 2021 by stuie

[MrBarry465]

Just now, efcfanwirral said:

If it gets more deadly I'll be on board with the engineered by someone conspiracies. Everything I've read makes it sound like these viruses usually mutate to become more infectious but less deadly

More infectious / more resistant to vaccines is by design more deadly. Yes it may not be more lethal, but a virus that spreads easily isn't good.

 

[efcfanwirral]

1 minute ago, zahidf said:

I think its the other way around. If the nerds say we have to lockdown again for booster shots, people wont do it. Household mixing will be even more unenforceable. 

It's unenforceable now, but businesses closing and people's jobs disappearing is the problem with ongoing restrictions that can't be dealt with by a bit of rebellion. People can meet up all they want but they won't have jobs to go to, and furlough can't last forever

[MrBarry465]

Just now, efcfanwirral said:

It's unenforceable now, but businesses closing and people's jobs disappearing is the problem with ongoing restrictions that can't be dealt with by a bit of rebellion. People can meet up all they want but they won't have jobs to go to, and furlough can't last forever

They need to introduce a UBI at this point, otherwise I can see shit hitting the fan in 12 - 18 months.

[MrBarry465]

2 minutes ago, stuie said:

Another 12 months of this is unimaginable for a lot of people whether that is due to loneliness, financial, business or mental health reasons.

We will unlock when the vaccination strategy reaches a certain point and accept the consequences.  The consequences or opening up are about to be dwarfed by the consequences of not. 

We won't be in 12 months of lockdown, again your being hyperbolic. This will be the final lockdown, of that I am confident. 

But not expecting restrictions to be in place (however severe) is also head in the sand naivety. 

Edited February 17, 2021 by MrBarry465

[efcfanwirral]

1 minute ago, MrBarry465 said:

They need to introduce a UBI at this point, otherwise I can see shit hitting the fan in 12 - 18 months.

Presumably an optional one for those without jobs? Not being owned by the government in that way unless I absolutely have to be 

Edited February 17, 2021 by efcfanwirral

[MrBarry465]

Just now, efcfanwirral said:

Presumably an optional one for those without jobs? Not being owned by the government in that that unless I absolutely have to be 

Yes.

[fraybentos1]

8 minutes ago, Copperface said:

They haven't shifted at all. It's always been out there that case and infection rates were equally as important as hospitalisation and death rates. Vaccines were also never seen as the sole way out of this - it's always been about a combination of vaccines plus improved treatments and non therapeutic measures. Getting to the 70% odd was always a key metric being circulated but generally ignored. Full opening after 'vaccinating the vulnerable' was always unlikely, up there with all restrictions will be dropped after March because the Coronavirus Act 'lapses'.

It's simply that people concentrate on the bits they want to be true and tend to disregard the rest. 

Like when you claimed about a hundred times that we would not reach our mid-feb vax target which you have been strangely quiet about since... 

[Copperface]

4 minutes ago, stuie said:

Another 12 months of this is unimaginable for a lot of people whether that is due to loneliness, financial, business or mental health reasons.

We will unlock when the vaccination strategy reaches a certain point and accept the consequences.  The consequences or opening up are about to be dwarfed by the consequences of not. 

Have to be specific that lockdowns are very different from restrictions of some sort being introduced or staying in place. 

[Copperface]

1 minute ago, fraybentos1 said:

Like when you claimed about a hundred times that we would not reach our mid-feb vax target which you have been strangely quiet about since... 

Fuck me are you still here?

Go and do some studying on Hindus and alcohol. 

[fraybentos1]

2 minutes ago, efcfanwirral said:

Presumably an optional one for those without jobs? Not being owned by the government in that way unless I absolutely have to be 

The very nature of a UBI would mean not optional and everyone would get it. Think your paranoia has reached new levels if you consider a UBI being 'owned by the gov'. It's irrelevant anyway cause no way a tory gov is implementing a UBI