Are Tories welcome at Glastonbury

[glastolover19]

3 minutes ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

Congratulations on being stupid enough to be conned by Boris Johnson and Nigel Farage, I can absolutely understand why that is something you’d want to brag about and you should definitely fly over to Northern Ireland and shout about it in a loud voice, it would end really well for you.

Look I want to make it clear I don't know you but from our brief exchanges you seem like a relatively level headed person but you shouldn't call people stupid for not agreeing with you,I think your probably more intelligent than that

[glastolover19]

1 minute ago, henry bear said:

Glastonbury is all about diversity. Apart from bigots. They’d not be very welcome.

It should be and used to be about diversity but based on the comments in this section I'm not sure? Bearing in mind we are posting in a thread titled "are Tories welcome at Glastonbury"  which in itself suggests they are not,that's not diversity

[Rose-Colored Boy]

21 minutes ago, glastolover19 said:

Look I want to make it clear I don't know you but from our brief exchanges you seem like a relatively level headed person but you shouldn't call people stupid for not agreeing with you,I think your probably more intelligent than that

‘Stupid’, ‘monumentally thick bellend with no grasp of 20th Century history’, ‘naive turkey voting for Christmas’, ‘braindead sheep voluntarily following his work colleagues and/or the Daily Mail into the slaughterhouse’, he can choose whatever descriptor he likes and fuck off. Unless he’s rich enough to be insulated against the consequences of Brexit, in which case he’s just a selfish prick who can fuck off even more. Doesn’t bother me either way.

Edited October 10, 2018 by Rose-Colored Boy

[henry bear]

6 minutes ago, glastolover19 said:

It should be and used to be about diversity but based on the comments in this section I'm not sure? Bearing in mind we are posting in a thread titled "are Tories welcome at Glastonbury"  which in itself suggests they are not,that's not diversity

In all the years I’ve been going to GF, I’ve never seen anybody made unwelcome because they support the Conservatives.

The bottom line though; the festival is what it is. Michael can choose whoever he likes to speak. If people find it all too left wing then obviously it isn’t for them.

[glastolover19]

1 minute ago, henry bear said:

In all the years I’ve been going to GF, I’ve never seen anybody made unwelcome because they support the Conservatives.

The bottom line though; the festival is what it is. Michael can choose whoever he likes to speak. If people find it all too left wing then obviously it isn’t for them.

That's what I'm finding quite funny reading these posts,I've been going for a very long time now and I've never witnessed the level of bile and hatred at the festival itself as what has been written here. Is does make you wonder how many of the commenters on here are genuine with genuine beliefs or pointless trolls.

[glastolover19]

12 minutes ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

‘Stupid’, ‘monumentally thick bellend with no grasp of 20th Century history’, ‘turkey voting for Christmas’, ‘braindead sheep voluntarily following his work colleagues and/or the Daily Mail into the slaughterhouse’, he can choose whatever descriptor he likes and fuck off. Unless he’s rich enough to be insulated against the consequences of Brexit, in which case he’s just a selfish prick who can fuck off even more. Doesn’t bother me either way.

I should probably tell you I didn't vote in brexit so I'm assume to you I'm also a bell end or a braindead sheep because I didn't do what you did?

[Mardy]

I reckon if you’d walked round on the Friday of 2016 with an ‘i voted Brexit’ tshirt, you’d have got some grief.

[DeanoL]

13 hours ago, glastolover19 said:

Fair play we all deal with things differently. And I don't want you to think I condone their actions,I try to stay neutral my point is surely it's better to find out why they feel that way? Or to share your pov with them in a calm discussion in the hope they perhaps see things differently. I don't think it's a bad thing to try and educate anyone and potentially they might realize that the ideas are not necessarily right

While that's a lovely sentiment I would urge you to think about your position of privilege in making a statement like that. If we're treating this as an intellectual exercise you're totally right, but for a lot of people, it's a lot more real than that. It's literally life and death in some cases. I'm in the same relatively privileged position as you, in fact Tory policy is probably beneficial for me.

But you have to understand there are people out there that:

• Can't get the medical treatment they need because of government NHS costs
• Are now sleeping on the streets because of government policy (homelessness in the UK has gone through the roof in the past five years)
• Have had benefits cut because the government have judged them fit for work when they're not. There's evidence this policy has literally caused deaths

The list goes on. Try and bear in mind that if you're one of those people, or you know people in a situation like that, this isn't just some meeting of ideas and lively debate. This is very, very real for a large number of people.

And that's also the fundamental difference here. The most extreme left-wingers basically want the richest people to lose all their money and have everyone on a level playing field, where we are all getting by or whatever. That's their endgame. Obviously hugely off-putting for the rich and successful but if they get their way, those people will still have decent lives. The most extreme right-wingers just want the poor, refugees and immigrants to just go away and die. Literally, they would deny hospital treatment to those that can't afford it. That's not hyperbole. It's already happening to some extent with current Tory policy (again, these cuts are killing people - not many, but it's happening).

Again, not saying you're wrong, in theory, in a perfect world, you're right. It's just in practice it's just really hard for a homeless person to find out why people voted for and supported policies that make them homeless, y'know?

[sime]

6 minutes ago, glastolover19 said:

I should probably tell you I didn't vote in brexit so I'm assume to you I'm also a bell end or a braindead sheep because I didn't do what you did?

Not voting is as bad as voting to leave...

 

Unless you were considering voting to leave, in which case you not voting was a genius move.

Edited October 10, 2018 by sime

[glastolover19]

4 minutes ago, Mardy said:

I reckon if you’d walked round on the Friday of 2016 with an ‘i voted Brexit’ tshirt, you’d have got some grief.

I'm not too sure I think most people there were respectful to each others decisions. We heard people amicably discussing the pros and cons in a civil manner

[glastolover19]

3 minutes ago, sime said:

Not voting is as bad as voting to leave...

 

Unless you were considering voting to leave, in which case you not voting was a genius move.

Its called being impartial and to me it was better not to vote based on the fact that I trusted neither side at that time.

[Rose-Colored Boy]

15 minutes ago, glastolover19 said:

I should probably tell you I didn't vote in brexit so I'm assume to you I'm also a bell end or a braindead sheep because I didn't do what you did?

Depends why? If it was because you assumed Remain would win comfortably and didn’t want to feel like you were giving David Cameron a vote of confidence as Prime Minister then that’s forgivable, a lot of people made that mistake. If you didn’t vote because you couldn’t see that Leave was a destructive cause being promoted by tax haven-seeking charlatans lying through their teeth, I’m afraid it doesn’t reflect well on your sense of judgement.

Edited October 10, 2018 by Rose-Colored Boy

[samblur1]

27 minutes ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

‘Stupid’, ‘monumentally thick bellend with no grasp of 20th Century history’, ‘naive turkey voting for Christmas’, ‘braindead sheep voluntarily following his work colleagues and/or the Daily Mail into the slaughterhouse’, he can choose whatever descriptor he likes and fuck off. Unless he’s rich enough to be insulated against the consequences of Brexit, in which case he’s just a selfish prick who can fuck off even more. Doesn’t bother me either way.

The tolerant left haha you must realise that Glastonbury is very diverse and full of people that don’t agree with you...that’s why it’s great. I know more people who have gone to Glastonbury who are Tories or right of politics than anything else

[glastolover19]

7 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

While that's a lovely sentiment I would urge you to think about your position of privilege in making a statement like that. If we're treating this as an intellectual exercise you're totally right, but for a lot of people, it's a lot more real than that. It's literally life and death in some cases. I'm in the same relatively privileged position as you, in fact Tory policy is probably beneficial for me.

But you have to understand there are people out there that:

• Can't get the medical treatment they need because of government NHS costs
• Are now sleeping on the streets because of government policy (homelessness in the UK has gone through the roof in the past five years)
• Have had benefits cut because the government have judged them fit for work when they're not. There's evidence this policy has literally caused deaths

The list goes on. Try and bear in mind that if you're one of those people, or you know people in a situation like that, this isn't just some meeting of ideas and lively debate. This is very, very real for a large number of people.

And that's also the fundamental difference here. The most extreme left-wingers basically want the richest people to lose all their money and have everyone on a level playing field, where we are all getting by or whatever. That's their endgame. Obviously hugely off-putting for the rich and successful but if they get their way, those people will still have decent lives. The most extreme right-wingers just want the poor, refugees and immigrants to just go away and die. Literally, they would deny hospital treatment to those that can't afford it. That's not hyperbole. It's already happening to some extent with current Tory policy (again, these cuts are killing people - not many, but it's happening).

Again, not saying you're wrong, in theory, in a perfect world, you're right. It's just in practice it's just really hard for a homeless person to find out why people voted for and supported policies that make them homeless, y'know?

Can I just clarify what you mean by my position of privilege before I answer.

[glastolover19]

2 minutes ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

Depends why? If it was because you assumed Remain would win comfortably or didn’t want to feel like you were giving David Cameron a vote of confidence as Prime Minister then that’s forgivable, a lot of people made that mistake. If you didn’t vote because you couldn’t see that Leave was a destructive cause being promoted by tax haven-seeking charlatans lying through their teeth, I’m afraid it doesn’t provide a ringing endorsement of your sense of judgement.

I didn't vote based on not believing/trusting either side

[samblur1]

Can we all just agree that we will be leaving the EU very soon 

[DeanoL]

1 minute ago, glastolover19 said:

Can I just clarify what you mean by my position of privilege before I answer.

That your life isn't being destroyed by current Conservative policy (and is not likely to be in the future). 

[Rose-Colored Boy]

Just now, glastolover19 said:

I didn't vote based on not believing/trusting either side

It wouldn’t have been difficult to do enough research to find out that it was a far bigger issue than that, but fair enough, I can understand why people felt that way.

[Mardy]

@DeanoL is right, it's all very well talking about being amicable and cicvilised but if these people are fucking over your family, leaving people in horrific circumstances and causing real, tangible damage to people you know and care about, it ceases to be an intellectual exercise and becomes a lot more personal and visceral.

 

If somebody punches me/ a member of my family in the face, am I supposed to sit down with them and reasonably explain why I disagree with them and their actions. Not sure most of us would do that. 

[glastolover19]

1 minute ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

It wouldn’t have been difficult to do enough research to find out that it was a far bigger issue than that, but fair enough, I can understand why people felt that way.

I did do my research and that's what drew me to that conclusion. Surely its better not to vote then to vote for something you don't fully believe. Don't forget there was b.s and scaremongering on both sides

[Alex DeLarge]

Remember that massive tantrum the Tory press threw about Corbyn on the Pyramid? And they have the nerve to complain we’re uncivil.

[Havors]

I don't think its about Conservatives not being welcome. It is more that probably 95-99% of conservative voters do not hold the same beliefs or values that Glastonbury is renowned for. So they would likely feel very out of place. 

I think Glastonbury has an intolerance for intolerance ironically. Which is what most Conservatives tend to be.... intolerant. 

I am very left wing myself, but some of the ultra left can be very nasty and all irony is lost on them when they attack people verbally (sometimes physically).

All should be welcome at Glastonbury as long as you are not an arsehole.  How they let Kanye in is beyond me  

[Tranquility of Solitude]

8 minutes ago, Havors said:

All should be welcome at Glastonbury as long as you are not an arsehole.  How they let Kanye in is beyond me  

They also let the Dalai Lama in that year. Unbelievable. 

[glastolover19]

34 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

That your life isn't being destroyed by current Conservative policy (and is not likely to be in the future). 

I can say my life is definitely effected by this government that's the reason I'm lucky I get to see kids once a week is because I'm having to work 60-70hours a week on minimum wage to cover living costs. It also affected my family 3years ago when they decided to stop my mother's cancer treatment then refused to help with home help whilst she died so yeah i do have an understanding of what this government is like. I also know what the government was like nearly 20 years ago when I was made homeless for 2 years after my landlord sold his property and the government wouldn't help because I was a single male. Then you loose your job after being spotted sleeping rough but then you can't get new job because you have no address. So yeah I have seen the shit side of it. You seem to mistake what I've previously said as me agreeing with them which I don't,I'm just saying that we should be open to discussions with the hope of finding a middle ground that benefits everyone.

[Rose-Colored Boy]

47 minutes ago, glastolover19 said:

 Surely its better not to vote then to vote for something you don't fully believe. 

No, absolutely not.

 

47 minutes ago, glastolover19 said:

 Don't forget there was b.s and scaremongering on both sides

There was, and it’s understandable why this drove people into not getting involved at all.

But at the same time it was obvious that the Remain camp’s ‘scaremongering’ was almost-entirely because nobody had a concrete idea of what Brexit would mean. Which, when you consider that that therefore meant that those championing the Leave cause were also doing so without a clue what it honestly meant - or, at least, not one which they were willing to publish and take out on the doorsteps - it should’ve been a massive glaring blazing warning sign that it was not a good idea that had been thought through. But of course in the heat of a referendum campaign nobody thinks as logically as that.

Edited October 10, 2018 by Rose-Colored Boy