Are Tories welcome at Glastonbury

[David756]

I've been going for a little while. It's fine.

[glastolover19]

1 hour ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

I go for a whole range of reasons, when I can get a ticket ? I wouldn’t feel right for leaving on Monday morning having spent no time engaged in that side of the fest though, no.

Just outta curiosity,did you get a ticket?

[RichardWaller]

5 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

You gave a binary non-nuanced statement of blame in one direction only.

And then decried those who made binary non-nuanced statements.

You said both of those things, and I pointed out the inconsistency.

I expanded things about Grenfell to show why your binary statement of blame was well off the mark.

Maybe if this was a thread about Grenfell we could've gone into more depth, but it's not. The comment the OP made about Grenfell did jump out to me, thought it came across a bit odd. I don't know, how does someone who starting a thread called  "Are Tories welcome at Glastonbury" talking about "practically blaming rich evil Tories for killing everyone at Grenfell" come across to you? I don't know their thoughts on where the blame for Grenfell lies, or any proportion of it for that matter. Doesn't sound like they think much if any blame lies with the Tories, to me. Course, without reading the last 25 pages, if they've even elaborated on that, I'm not going to know.

3 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

when I'm defending the tories from blame, that's nothing of what is working me.

The only bias I'm working to is the one where the facts inform the comment.  

If I'd said the Tories were solely to blame, fair enough. Equally, by defending them I don't assume you're saying the Tories are blameless? You can't just go around the internet putting your words into other people's mouths. I don't know, do you just enjoy being antagonistic?

[arcade fireman]

I've got no problems with Tories going - Glasto should be open to all, and if it opens their eyes and ears to ideas outside their usual circle then all the better.

What really, really pisses me off though is the Tory pricks who say there's "too much politics" at the festival. Or how when left wing politics get aired they claim that Glasto "isn't the place for it".

I'm hardly the biggest Corbyn fan though I have exclusively voted Labour, and tbh I did find the hero worship a bit cringe. But at the same time that moment did embody a lot of what the festival was about and the roots from where it came - and for whatever JC's faults may be, he does share a lot of the ideals that make Glastonbury great. 

Tories who come to Glastonbury should, however grudgingly, acknowledge the place wouldn't be what it is without its left wing roots. I might be left wing but I still believe in a mixed economy and I can accept capitalism has helped make all sorts of great things possible over the years. 

[Rose-Colored Boy]

15 minutes ago, glastolover19 said:

Just outta curiosity,did you get a ticket?

Not this time, and my work’s a pain in the arse about annual leave so trying in the resales isn’t an option for me unfortunately. But I shall be back with bells on in 2020, fingers crossed  

[Berniethebolt]

For me, I like to leave politics at the door and despite Glastonburys red roots I feel it has moved on and has become about whats right in the world and also trying to support the voice of change on more serious global issues like environment, world aid, which is evident in the support of Oxfam/Wateraid/GreenPeace/Shelter to name a few of many. 

I actually find it a real turn off when politics is bought into the equation, I'm there for the care free spirit of the festival and its people and couldn't care less if you are Tory or Labour or anything else. As long as you are a decent person, respect each other despite whatever their views are and try and add your voice to bigger global issues, you get my vote!

 

  

 

 

[henry bear]

20 minutes ago, glastolover19 said:

But then again would you actually listen or just shout them down for not agreeing with you?

I think you’re making assumptions now.

I’d ask the guy second from right what it is about Trump that he admires so much. I’d also ask him why he had a bindi drawn on him, and why he smudged it out before the photo was taken.

I’d ask the guy he’s clinging onto why he felt happy to have ‘fuck the NHS’ written on his shirt. 

I’d ask the guy far left (sic) what message does he think his wearing a drawn on Hitler moustache give out. 

The picture is of Plymouth University Conservatives and was taken recently.

[glastolover19]

13 minutes ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

Not this time, and my work’s a pain in the arse about annual leave so trying in the resales isn’t an option for me unfortunately. But I shall be back with bells on in 2020, fingers crossed  

I'm sorry for you but awesome attitude to have about it,these things happen. I will keep my fingers crossed for 2020 for you,I'll happily buy you a cider,just no politics?

[glastolover19]

14 minutes ago, henry bear said:

I think you’re making assumptions now.

I’d ask the guy second from right what it is about Trump that he admires so much. I’d also ask him why he had a bindi drawn on him, and why he smudged it out before the photo was taken.

I’d ask the guy he’s clinging onto why he felt happy to have ‘fuck the NHS’ written on his shirt. 

I’d ask the guy far left (sic) what message does he think his wearing a drawn on Hitler moustache give out. 

The picture is of Plymouth University Conservatives and was taken recently.

How am I possibly making assumptions? I'm asking would you give them the opportunity to actually answer your questions and would you listen and consider their response before branding them bell-ends? 

[henry bear]

Just now, glastolover19 said:

How am I possibly making assumptions? I'm asking would you give them the opportunity to actually answer your questions and would you listen and consider their response before branding them bell-ends? 

I would hope you that most people looking at that photo, even other Tories, would come to a similar conclusion. And yes, I would love to have a debate with them, and no, I wouldn’t shout them down - not my style. 

So what do you think when you look at that photo? 

[glastolover19]

1 minute ago, henry bear said:

I would hope you that most people looking at that photo, even other Tories, would come to a similar conclusion. And yes, I would love to have a debate with them, and no, I wouldn’t shout them down - not my style. 

So what do you think when you look at that photo? 

Don't get wrong mate if what is written on those shirts are a true reflections of their own opinions then no I don't agree with them however I respect that we don't all think the same and have different opinions. Just because I don't agree with something doesn't mean I should name call someone who does. That's why I think we should have "cross party talks" like this and get an understanding of both sides then draw conclusions. It's like right now I don't necessarily agree with you but I'd like to hear your side and maybe I might go "hey you know what that guy was right"  like I said it's important to discuss these things but it's also probably more important to listen and try to understand. It just seems there is very much a them and us mentality when it comes to this.

[Rose-Colored Boy]

I’d be willing to sit and interrogate Mr ‘Thinks It’s Funny To Go Out Wearing A Hitler Moustache’ just to feel good about my own moral standing in the world when he inevitably failed to defend himself. Other than that though, being willing to give the people in that picture ‘the benefit of the doubt’ fits into what I was saying earlier - as leftists we certainly should listen to opposing ideas and debate them honestly, but just look where refusing to outright condemn people who parade around like that has got us in recent years.

We on the left are just far too open to the idea of giving right-wingers an honest hearing when they would never do the same for us. It’s incredibly difficult, and indeed we’re seeing the fruits of that difficulty being borne out in the left’s own reactionary ‘shout you down’ mobs on both sides of the Atlantic.

53 minutes ago, glastolover19 said:

I'm sorry for you but awesome attitude to have about it,these things happen. I will keep my fingers crossed for 2020 for you,I'll happily buy you a cider,just no politics?

Thank you, appreciate that  

Edited October 9, 2018 by Rose-Colored Boy

[Xeph1995]

Nah fuck them, I have no time for torries or those who vote from them. If you get ticket fine but don't expect a music festival to be free from left politics. Far to many disgusting things have happened at the hands of torry policies for me to give a scrap of understanding to why one would vote that way.

Edited October 9, 2018 by Xeph1995

[Amy Lawn]

59 minutes ago, arcade fireman said:

I'm hardly the biggest Corbyn fan though I have exclusively voted Labour, and tbh I did find the hero worship a bit cringe. But at the same time that moment did embody a lot of what the festival was about and the roots from where it came - and for whatever JC's faults may be, he does share a lot of the ideals that make Glastonbury great. 

Whatever you think of JC, I think when you see a crowd of under 30s, who otherwise never voted until he came along, chanting his name, you've got to feel a little bit glad that they are enthusiastic about politics.

[Rose-Colored Boy]

Just now, GETOFFAMYLAWN said:

Whatever you think of JC, I think when you see a crowd of under 30s, who otherwise never voted until he came along, chanting his name, you've got to feel a little bit glad that they are enthusiastic about politics.

On a basic level, sure. I do worry about how their politics will hold up in the future if Project Corbyn doesn’t work out, though - they’ll either be those grim ‘all or nothing’ leftists who refuse to vote unless a candidate is deemed by them to be perfect in every way, or they’ll fulfil the horseshoe theory and end up as UKIPy sorts. Don’t see the majority of them ever becoming pragmatic centrists.

[UEF]

25 minutes ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

 

 

We on the left are just far too open to the idea of giving right-wingers an honest hearing when they would never do the same for us.

My sides.

[UEF]

2 hours ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

Almost all of the worst people I know identify as ‘Young Conservatives’, I’d sooner hang out with Vladimir Putin.

I think we can agree that party activists of all ages and political stripes are fucking weird.

[Rose-Colored Boy]

8 minutes ago, UEF said:

My sides.

Honestly though. There’s no right-wing equivalent of the “we need to listen to people’s legitimate concerns about immigration” crap that you get from some lefitsts, so why do we bother.

Edited October 9, 2018 by Rose-Colored Boy

[UEF]

14 minutes ago, Rose-Colored Boy said:

Honestly though. There’s no right-wing equivalent of the “we need to listen to people’s legitimate concerns about immigration” crap that you get from some lefitsts, so why do we bother.

There's no right wing equivalent of no-platforming, twitter pitchfork mobs, gobbing on Conservative party members as they walk to Conference, etc...

Or how about on the Guardian where 'difficult' topics have the commenting turned off?

Edited October 9, 2018 by UEF

[Rose-Colored Boy]

18 minutes ago, UEF said:

There's no right wing equivalent of no-platforming, twitter pitchfork mobs, gobbing on Conservative party members as they walk to Conference, etc...

Or how about on the Guardian where 'difficult' topics have the commenting turned off?

There are plenty of right wing twitter pitchfork-carriers, come off it. Arron Banks alone is easily as gobby and disrespectful as all but the very worst offenders on the left. Conservatives may not line the streets outside Labour conference in protest but they certainly don’t mind a good shouty demonstration where any passing leftist would be best advised to keep their head down, take for example the recent ‘protest’ in London which was intended as ‘revenge’ for the anti-Trump marches until Sadiq Khan didn’t care about the shitty balloon.. pretty sure they gather fairly regularly at Hyde Park Corner moaning about ‘the mooslems’ as well.

Dunno about The Guardian comment sections but they did publish an opinion piece by the Prime Minister this weekend, whereas I’m not sure you’ll be seeing Jeremy Corbyn given a column in The Mail on Sunday any time soon.

Edited October 9, 2018 by Rose-Colored Boy

[clarkete]

1 hour ago, UEF said:

There's no right wing equivalent of no-platforming, twitter pitchfork mobs, gobbing on Conservative party members as they walk to Conference, etc...

Or how about on the Guardian where 'difficult' topics have the commenting turned off?

Clearly someone hasn't spent much time in the beeb's HYS comments

Edited October 9, 2018 by clarkete

[mashedonmud]

My heads hurting,

 

[RichardWaller]

7 minutes ago, UEF said:

There's no right wing equivalent of no-platforming, twitter pitchfork mobs, gobbing on Conservative party members as they walk to Conference, etc...

Or how about on the Guardian where 'difficult' topics have the commenting turned off?

Oh hiya, think we kinda know each other from another silly forum.. 

I'd say there is an equivalent to non-platforming, or at least the intention is there. Whenever someone like say Gary Lineker or Lily Allen say anything remotely political online you can guarantee there'll be a load of people telling em to stay out of politics and calling em champagne socialist luvvies or whatever. Remember when The S*n tried to get Gary Lineker sacked by BBC for daring to show a bit of compassion for Syrian refugees? Boycotting works both ways too, people setting fire to Nike trainers for supporting American Footballers taking the knee was quite funny though. Taylor Swift too, this week! People have been right up in arms about her voicing her opinion, Trump likes her music 25% less now than he did this time last week apparently.

Gobbing on Tory party members on their way to conference.. yeah, that shouldn't be happening and it's shameful that it does at all. Don't recall and can't envisage Tory activists protesting at the Labour conference anywhere near the scale that Labour ones do at Tory conferences, never mind gobbing on people or owt like that. Dunno why that is, maybe in part cos Labour supporters may feel like they're proportionally more at threat from a Tory government than Tory supporters will be from a Labour one.

[clarkete]

44 minutes ago, RichardWaller said:

I'd say there is an equivalent to non-platforming, or at least the intention is there. Whenever someone like say Gary Lineker or Lily Allen say anything remotely political online you can guarantee there'll be a load of people telling em to stay out of politics and calling em champagne socialist luvvies or whatever. Remember when The S*n tried to get Gary Lineker sacked by BBC for daring to show a bit of compassion for Syrian refugees?

Indeed, it's disgraceful how many front pages  there have been on various papers in the last two years accusing people of being traitors, whether they are MPs, members of the Lords or whatever.

The amount and ferocity of bile I see from right to left can be pretty overwhelming, especially given what happened to Jo Cox.

Edited October 9, 2018 by clarkete

[Thunderstruck]

I'm sure it is fine. It is obviously a very left wing festival, likely more left wing than most peoples political orientation. so maybe the question should be is it ok to go if you aren't a raging lefty! ?