news & politics:discussion

[steviewevie]

😃

contradicts what Starmer said recently, but whatever.

[Guest]

 

[Neil]

9 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

ok, fair enough...maybe it would make a difference...still not sure, Israel seems to be so far ignoring anything anyone says including US. I expect a change of direction for Israel would need to come internally, in the end it is a nuclear power which seems to mean it can do what the f**k it likes. 

Let's see if anything comes from Cameron's suggestion...

the uk has a unique place in Palestine's past which amplifies it voice to the future.

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, Neil said:

the uk has a unique place in Palestine's past which amplifies it voice to the future.

it really does but because of that, and the fact we're just not that important anymore, means I'm not sure we're that highly regarded. Maybe recognising Palestine as a state would help with that.  If you look at the history we were involved with the whole setting up of Israel, but almost kind of reluctantly, Balfour treaty was political with no real substance, then it was just trying to deal with problems with Jewish immigrants and Arabs fighting in that region, actually trying to restrict Jewish immigration whilst at same time blocking them from coming to UK even when all that Nazi sh*t was going on, and then after WW2 not wanting anything to do with the partition but just letting UN sort it out and then getting the f**k out of there and next day the Arab-Israeli war started. UK even abstained on the original UN resolution recognising Israel.

Anyway, this is what Starmer and Lammy said in Jewish Chronicle, dropping Labour policy of recognising Palestinian statehood from day one if they got into power...arguing it should be part of a peace process agreed with other countries...not T-shirt politics 😀

Keir Starmer drops Corbyn-era policy on Palestinian statehood - The Jewish Chronicle (thejc.com)

[Neil]

Cameron's speech wasn't cleared with number ten 

[kaosmark2]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

ok, fair enough...maybe it would make a difference...still not sure, Israel seems to be so far ignoring anything anyone says including US. I expect a change of direction for Israel would need to come internally, in the end it is a nuclear power which seems to mean it can do what the f**k it likes. 

Let's see if anything comes from Cameron's suggestion...

I think you're also missing that the UK is an official Israeli ally and weapons provider. By recognising Palestine as a legitimate independent state it would declare that alliance at risk if Israel continued its current strategy.

It would be a very big deal and I think both our current and future government are too cowardly to do it.

[Neil]

21 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

I think you're also missing that the UK is an official Israeli ally and weapons provider. By recognising Palestine as a legitimate independent state it would declare that alliance at risk if Israel continued its current strategy.

It would be a very big deal and I think both our current and future government are too cowardly to do it.

the uk is the proposer for the state of israel via the Balfour Declaration

[Neil]

was just considering would Iran be f**king around if trump was us president?

 

probably not, can't predict his response, Biden can be predicted to shy away from war. trump. who knows?

[steviewevie]

6 hours ago, kaosmark2 said:

I think you're also missing that the UK is an official Israeli ally and weapons provider. By recognising Palestine as a legitimate independent state it would declare that alliance at risk if Israel continued its current strategy.

It would be a very big deal and I think both our current and future government are too cowardly to do it.

yeah, ok. I didn't actually realise pretty much everyone except N America/W Europe/Australia recognised Palestinian statehood. So, yes, it would send a strong signal.

Edited January 31, 2024 by steviewevie

[steviewevie]

and then there's this...

they're not going to be able to destroy Hamas, they're just destroying Gaza.

[stuie]

9 hours ago, Neil said:

Cameron's speech wasn't cleared with number ten 

I suppose that’s what you get when you give someone special powers in an underhand way. 

[Neil]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

and then there's this...

they're not going to be able to destroy Hamas, they're just destroying Gaza.

so maybe next time Hamas might think rape and murder is not a great idea.

[steviewevie]

2 minutes ago, Neil said:

so maybe next time Hamas might think rape and murder is not a great idea.

maybe some in Hamas think it's going pretty well.

[steviewevie]

Labour Middle East Council

 

[steviewevie]

 

[Skip997]

11 hours ago, mattiloy said:

 States that recognise palestine 👇 

 

Very interesting, but hardly surprising split.

[steviewevie]

and yet UNRWA gets most of it's funds from western countries it would seem, especially US/EU/Germany....which is why them stopping funds could be devastating.

[lazyred]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

 

 

 

 

[Neil]

sturgeon "trustme i'm a politician". 

(a liar same as johnson).

[steviewevie]

1 hour ago, lazyred said:

 

 

 

 

it's a weird decision..the cap was very popular. Maybe they're trying to woo the all important banker vote.

Edited January 31, 2024 by steviewevie

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

it's a weird decision..the cap is very popular. Maybe they're trying to woo the all important banker vote.

If more bonuses get paid then more tax will be earned on those bonuses.

You can oppose a policy but not want to spend political capital/time to reverse it. 

[Skip997]

1 minute ago, Ozanne said:

If more bonuses get paid then more tax will be earned on those bonuses.

Bankers, not somehow managing to avoid paying more tax?

[fraybentos1]

4 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

If more bonuses get paid then more tax will be earned on those bonuses.

You can oppose a policy but not want to spend political capital/time to reverse it. 

What a pathetic defence. You do realise you do not have to defend every single thing Labour says. You can say 'I do not agree with this'.

More tax generation as a positive on uncapped banker bonuses 🤣 embarrassing

[Guest]

16 minutes ago, Skip997 said:

Bankers, not somehow managing to avoid paying more tax?

Then tighten the tax rules but that’s a separate point. If we want to fund things like the green investment plan (which a lot of people kick off about) then Labour will need money from all sorts of places. Bankers larger bonuses seems like a good place to get some of that funding. 

Edited January 31, 2024 by Ozanne

[steviewevie]

17 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

If more bonuses get paid then more tax will be earned on those bonuses.

You can oppose a policy but not want to spend political capital/time to reverse it. 

one way to look at it.

I guess UK economy still very reliant on financial services, and Labour want to do anything they can to help UK economy and get growth so they can borrow/spend...and show that they're business friendly and aren't going to disrupt anything with scary lefty policies...