news & politics:discussion

[kaosmark2]

6 hours ago, Kurosagi said:

Well that's an annoyingly shit article as it doesn't actually say what Streeting (or Labour) are proposing instead.

At the risk of sounding like the 'teenager' in the room, this particular quote incensed me:

"I think it is true to say that if the answer to the NHS challenge in the long-term is only ever increasing amounts of taxpayers’ money into a 20th century model of care, then there isn't going to be an NHS in the future,” he told a King’s Fund conference in London."

I mean we literally have a government using "20th century models" of economics where we exploit finite resources in the pursuit of growth that for decades has only ever delivered profits for a tiny minority of the population, whilst paying pathetic lip service to climate related issues that will ensure, to throw his words back at him, "there isn't going to be a [human race] in the future".

Of course we can still have a properly run NHS that is free at the point of use, it's all about priorities. What is the point of politics when there is no longer a vision to raise people up. Has there ever been a time when the difference between a labour or tory govt would be so woefully cigarette paper thin?

The difference between Tory and Labour is massive. Albeit because of an Overton window shift. Labour right now are a little left of the Gideon/Cameron government, and still left of any election winning version of the US democrats. 

I will happily criticise them for falling for this shift and being baited further right than is needed, but I think it's disingenuous to suggest there's a small gap.

[steviewevie]

48 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

The difference between Tory and Labour is massive. Albeit because of an Overton window shift. Labour right now are a little left of the Gideon/Cameron government, and still left of any election winning version of the US democrats. 

I will happily criticise them for falling for this shift and being baited further right than is needed, but I think it's disingenuous to suggest there's a small gap.

Labour did say they would nationalise the railways and there would be a publicly owned renewable energy company...think that's a bit more than a little to the left of Osborne/Cameron who in terms of economics were quite far to the right.

[hodgey123]

Poll on Twitter on @Leftiestats (I can't paste for some reason) showing Sunak leading Starmer in best leader poll 43% to 37%. Not great but likely to come down when the shit hits the fan economically over the next few months. 

[Guest]

 

[charlierc]

2 hours ago, Ryan1984 said:

Brutella’s latest (expensive) publicity stunt will whip up a certain section of the Tory fan base: 

 

... you can get a 1hr+ UK train journey for less than £12?

[steviewevie]

 

[Guest]

 

[fraybentos1]

Obviously it made it worse but the main reason they have to raise rates is to broadly follow the fed in America otherwise the pound will get tanked even more.

[steviewevie]

Interesting from Brady...saying Johnson did have the numbers, and Truss knew she had to go...

 

[Guest]

It’s the Tories fault. 

[lost]

I do wonder if they’ve thought through this energy thing probably. My bill is £12.50 this month. Chatting to a mate down the pub Wednesday and his is completely free..

[steviewevie]

Bank bloke Bailey saying different scenarios..but we may possibly end up with a long, but mild recession, inflation will drop down to below 2.5 over the next year, interest rates may not need to go as high as some have forecast, and unemployment will increase to 5-6%.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Bank bloke Bailey saying different scenarios..but we may possibly end up with a long, but mild recession, inflation will drop down to below 2.5 over the next year, interest rates may not need to go as high as some have forecast, and unemployment will increase to 5-6%.

It didn’t need to be like this, if we’d had a competent government in place the measures needed wouldn’t be anywhere near as bad. 

[steviewevie]

25 minutes ago, lost said:

I do wonder if they’ve thought through this energy thing probably. My bill is £12.50 this month. Chatting to a mate down the pub Wednesday and his is completely free..

nice...turn your heating up.

[Zoo Music Girl]

39 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

nice...turn your heating up.

We still haven't put ours on so we are also well in credit with the government payment thingy. I suppose can't complain really but is it just delaying the problem until the subsidy ends?

[steviewevie]

9 minutes ago, Zoo Music Girl said:

We still haven't put ours on so we are also well in credit with the government payment thingy. I suppose can't complain really but is it just delaying the problem until the subsidy ends?

it's been a mild autumn so far, but getting colder now, chilly here this morning. Subsidy ends next April, and then will be some sort of means test I guess, so for some of us bills will go up, but weather should be milder so.... What happens next winter who knows?

[steviewevie]

actually looking at forecast still looks pretty mild into November, so this all helps save the govt money too (but it is only start of November).

[Zoo Music Girl]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

it's been a mild autumn so far, but getting colder now, chilly here this morning. Subsidy ends next April, and then will be some sort of means test I guess, so for some of us bills will go up, but weather should be milder so.... What happens next winter who knows?

True, it has been mild. And yeah we'd normally have the heating off again by April.

[Neil]

1 hour ago, Ozanne said:

It didn’t need to be like this, if we’d had a competent government in place the measures needed wouldn’t be anywhere near as bad. 

if the boe had done their 3% INFLATION JOB PROPERLY THINGS WOULD BE BETTER

[lost]

Big Merv was dropping some truth bombs on Laura K.. We could of done with him back at the BOE:

 

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, lost said:

Big Merv was dropping some truth bombs on Laura K.. We could of done with him back at the BOE:

 

Hindsight etc. so what would he have done in reaction to lockdowns? Not do the quantative easing thing? Wouldn't that have potentially led to recessions and businesses going under and unemployment etc? And a lot of inflation also supply side from  west coming out of lockdowns but China doing the zero covid thing and now Russia invasion? And nothing the bank can do about silly govt fiscal policies.

[Guest]

These people never seem to like when the poor have a chance to get more money and will always try to argue against it so that can still enjoy most of the wealth. That’s all it is really, they are livid some people had better access to cheaper money for a small period of time. 

[steviewevie]

2 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

These people never seem to like when the poor have a chance to get more money and will always try to argue against it so that can still enjoy most of the wealth. That’s all it is really, they are livid some people had better access to cheaper money for a small period of time. 

well...err...I don't know, he's probably right, a lot of printing money has led to some of the inflation we're seeing, and that hurts poorer people more...but also there may be a bit of idelogical anti lockdown in there too as there are other factors causing prices to rise...the main one being Russia.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

well...err...I don't know, he's probably right, a lot of printing money has led to some of the inflation we're seeing, and that hurts poorer people more...but also there may be a bit of idelogical anti lockdown in there too as there are other factors causing prices to rise...the main one being Russia.

I don’t know about that. It seems these people are now trying to say ‘we’ve had it too good for too long’ when in actuality living standards have been dropping, wages have been stagnant, public services have declined and poverty has been rising for a decade. Yet now they want us to believe that it hasn’t been that bad, it’s gaslighting. 

[lost]

The poor don't have access to cheap credit. Their domain is the "own this £200 sofa for only 24 payments of £15" Its the rich who love money printing as they have first access to it and can bid up asset prices. Labour vs speculation does a hell of alot better during periods of high interest rates.