news & politics:discussion

[steviewevie]

 

[steviewevie]

 

[Neil]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

 

it would be a terrible mistake for labour to have a policy to try to rejoin the EU. it suggests they reject the democratic vote to leave, 'reject democracy' ,and the deal to go back in won't be as good, so will be a hard sell.

[Gingerfish79]

[Guest]

1 hour ago, mattiloy said:

Fairplay Ozanne. I take it back. You’re a party man through and through and evidently backed JC too, so respect for that. I don’t care about the EU election.

I’m not a party man, I voted Lib Dem in my first ever GE in 2010, like much of the youth vote swept along in clegg mania. They were the left wing ticket. And what damage it did to our faith in politicians. Judge them by their actions not their words. Should have remembered that when Starmer was running for Labour leader. Too late now. We are all shaped by our experiences are we not?

I even voted conservative in a council election in the early 2010s because the Labour dominated borough council relentlessly sold off the green belt to developers in my ward around the time (and in fact still does but nowadays there is an independent councillor to vote for which eases my cognitive dissonance at having to vote Tory).

So that’s the thing. I think most people are fairly pragmatic in politics, rather than party loyalists, now more than ever, as evidenced by the ‘red wall’ seats turning whilst Labour captured the likes of canterbury in 2017.

If you agree that changing direction from Corbynism is needed to attract centrists, you should also accept that you’re going to lose those votes on the left. So whether you think this is a careful calculation to get into office as@stevieweviesays, or you think it’s veering towards an unnecessarily vindictive, petty and personal campaign to stomp on the left which won’t yield the numbers they think it will, like me, you can’t just expect the left to stay in an abusive relationship.

Furthermore, I’d argue that new Labour put reformist and radical left wing politics back 2 generations and was totally detrimental to left wing ambitions thereto.

Like now, Starmer inferring Corbyn was supportive of Russia after Salisbury (which is a lie) means that the smears from the right and the right wing press are reiterated by those who the votership understand to be also on the left. It’s doubly damaging.

And now the right and the right wing press are smearing Starmer about this Savile thing and he doesn’t have a leg to stand on because he’s spent the last 2 years agreeing with them and undermining the erstwhile position of the Corbyn years - that the right wing press are malign organisations that trade in lies and smears. The left needs to be united in calling out this shit, not cheering it on. It’s so damaging in the long run. Blair should have dismantled the right wing press monopoly whilst he had the chance.

Thanks for the nice post. I’ve said it before but Corbyn was the first Labour leader to convince me to vote Labour, I bought in with the whole movement including seeing him at Glastonbury. He was also the best chance at getting rid of the Tories. I’m also lucky that Labour have overtaken the Lib Dems as the 2nd party in my constituency so I can vote for Labour here.

I was the same as you, I voted Lib Dem before and was enamoured by Clegg. I tend to latch onto Politicans that I like and share some of the same beliefs in which is partly why I like Starmer so much but it’s also because I genuinely believe he’ll make the country a better place. 

[Neil]

im not happy that spaffer is putting himself forward as the guy to sort the ukraine issue, if anyone can fuck it up, he can.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Neil said:

im not happy that spaffer is putting himself forward as the guy to sort the ukraine issue, if anyone can fuck it up, he can.

It’s his Chamberlain moment. 

[steviewevie]

42 minutes ago, Neil said:

im not happy that spaffer is putting himself forward as the guy to sort the ukraine issue, if anyone can fuck it up, he can.

Russia aren't going to invade...everyone knows it...this is all to persuade Ukraine president to give in to some of Russia's demands, Russia using it's military, US using it's invasion warnings, and France/Germany using diplomatic meaures.

Unless of course Russia invades on Wednesday then it's all over.

Not sure where UK fits in with all this, just parroting what US says I guess.

[DeanoL]

1 hour ago, Neil said:

it would be a terrible mistake for labour to have a policy to try to rejoin the EU. it suggests they reject the democratic vote to leave, 'reject democracy' ,and the deal to go back in won't be as good, so will be a hard sell.

Right now sure, in ten years, assuming the EU is still about, it's pretty much inevitable. We'll just do it by small pieces, bit by bit. It'll be a complete waste of time and energy, and the UK will be defined for pretty much a 30-year period as having done nothing of note but left and rejoined the EU. It's a sad fate really.

[Neil]

48 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

Right now sure, in ten years, assuming the EU is still about, it's pretty much inevitable. We'll just do it by small pieces, bit by bit. It'll be a complete waste of time and energy, and the UK will be defined for pretty much a 30-year period as having done nothing of note but left and rejoined the EU. It's a sad fate really.

you might be right about bit by bit, but that can be presented as different to re-joining.

[steviewevie]

 

[steviewevie]

 

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

 

What a horrible individual he is. 

[Homer]

Hold on... did Jeremy Corbyn used to be the leader of the Labour party?! The thing is, you don't tend to hear much about him these days do you? Particularly from lefties on social media...

[Homer]

10 minutes ago, Barry Fish said:

I wonder if Keir would get the same reception ? 

I wonder how this lot feel about Corbyn now ?

The left have't a clue lol

I wonder how many of this lot voted for Boris 😄 
 

 

I was there, as I was going to see RTJ anyway. Though I stopped short of doing the annoying chant.

I voted for Corbyn twice - but I've come to this crazy realisation that he's probably not going to be leader again any time soon. I mean, I used to vote for Charles Kennedy too, and I think they both have about an equal chance of ever being PM.

[squirrelarmy]

5 hours ago, Neil said:

im not happy that spaffer is putting himself forward as the guy to sort the ukraine issue, if anyone can fuck it up, he can.

Can we put him on the front line with a big arrow pointing at his head

[squirrelarmy]

2 hours ago, Homer said:

I was there, as I was going to see RTJ anyway. Though I stopped short of doing the annoying chant.

I had an easy choice. LG and Kaisers on the other were definitely a better option. 

[Neil]

6 hours ago, steviewevie said:

Russia aren't going to invade...everyone knows it

not sure of that russia wants ukraine as a bufferzone.

[Guest]

Boris Johnson is the worst.

[Neil]

11 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Boris Johnson is the worst.

people said that about cameron, and May, there's always a worse tory.

Edited February 14, 2022 by Neil

[Ryan1984]

The former culture secretary decides to attack ‘woke’ culture and gets shot down. What a useless waste of space Oliver Dowden is…

[Guest]

Happy Valentines Day, politics thread 😉 

[Zoo Music Girl]

1 hour ago, Ryan1984 said:

The former culture secretary decides to attack ‘woke’ culture and gets shot down. What a useless waste of space Oliver Dowden is…

Odious little man.

[steviewevie]

 

[Guest]

The same Boris Johnson that lied to Parliament when he said there was no parties.