news & politics:discussion

[Ryan1984]

The Scum have their say (sorry for the link): https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/18310098/boris-johnson-partygate-perspective-lost/

[steviewevie]

14 minutes ago, Ryan1984 said:

The Scum have their say (sorry for the link): https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/18310098/boris-johnson-partygate-perspective-lost/

I mean, that's definitely a point of view you hear a lot, and is understandable...all this over a few drinks and some cake..but bigger picture is govt created these rules and laws and johnson was on tv every night stating the importance of following them...which were then obviously being ignored in downing street under Johnson's watch...and then Johnson denied when stories started coming out, then lied saying hadn't attended or known anything about them,  now just says he didn't know they were breaking the very same rules. I mean, yes it isn't as important as what is happening to Ukrainians, but in terms of how this country is run I think it actually is right up there. For so called liberal democracies to function there has to be trust, trust that those making the laws are following them too, and now this trust has gone completely.

Edited April 20, 2022 by steviewevie

[steviewevie]

[steviewevie]

 

[lost]

1 hour ago, Barry Fish said:

I think come the election it will be the traditional arguments and personality battles that will be the key factor.  The electorate have short memories.  Boris just needs to play the long game.

I said two years ago the next election will be decided when the manifestos drop. How we continue to pay for the covid spending plus everything else. I still haven't changed my mind.

Public sentiment has shifted as the economy has become more important than covid to people, Its easy to be rated higher on the economy when you don't have any economic policies. Starmer has alot of plates to keep spinning with already the highest tax burden for 70 years, wanting to appear credible but the corbynista element of his party probably wanting even higher taxes and more public spending. He nearly faced a leadership challenge for refusing to back zero covid and that could happen again over economics.  

Edited April 20, 2022 by lost

[Ozanne]

48 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

I mean, that's definitely a point of view you hear a lot, and is understandable...all this over a few drinks and some cake..but bigger picture is govt created these rules and laws and johnson was on tv every night stating the importance of following them...which were then obviously being ignored in downing street under Johnson's watch...and then Johnson denied when stories started coming out, then lied saying hadn't attended or known anything about them,  now just says he didn't know they were breaking the very same rules. I mean, yes it isn't as important as what is happening to Ukrainians, but in terms of how this country is run I think it actually is right up there. For so called liberal democracies to function there has to be trust, trust that those making the laws are following them too, and now this trust has gone completely.

No it’s not understandable at all.

People that are defending Johnson on this and trying to downplay it are the definition of bad faith actors. 

[Ozanne]

 

[lost]

15 minutes ago, Barry Fish said:

  Labour need a solution to the Scotland issue as well and they don't seem to have one.

Yep. A hinted coalition with the SNP definitely damaged Milliband. I would think any future coalition would result in a one term parliament for labour possibly being ended early by the SNP themselves.

[steviewevie]

51 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

 

yeah, if tories do lose their majority who they going to work with...DUP maybe? who else? So, a minority tory govt, or  labour/lib-dem/snp somehow forming a coalition?

[lost]

8 minutes ago, Barry Fish said:

The SNP are wreckers.  They care for nothing other than their independence cause.  Starmer would be mad to get in bed with them and the price would be another referendum which would be unpopular in England I feel.  The best he can hope for is doing something with the Lib Dems and a minority government maybe.  Until the Scots reattach their brains we will have Tory rule.

I guess you've also got to look at it from the SNP's point of view. Would they want to run an indy campaign blaming everything on Westminster whilst simultaneously being in power at Westminster? That may backfire spectacularly.

Edited April 20, 2022 by lost

[charlierc]

24 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

yeah, if tories do lose their majority who they going to work with...DUP maybe? who else? So, a minority tory govt, or  labour/lib-dem/snp somehow forming a coalition?

This is assuming the DUP aren't in trouble themselves? They fell to 2 seats in the last election and early polling for the Northern Ireland elections next month suggest that they're behind Sinn Fein there as well, though their poll numbers have improved in the last few weeks.

[Ozanne]

34 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

yeah, if tories do lose their majority who they going to work with...DUP maybe? who else? So, a minority tory govt, or  labour/lib-dem/snp somehow forming a coalition?

The Tories won’t be able to govern if they don’t have a majority, no one will work with them anymore as everyone has been burnt. Also because the FTPA has been revoked if they can’t pass a Queens Speech then it’ll trigger another general election I think. 

[gary1979666]

59 minutes ago, lost said:

Yep. A hinted coalition with the SNP definitely damaged Milliband. I would think any future coalition would result in a one term parliament for labour possibly being ended early by the SNP themselves.

I reckon this will be case, unless someone comes in to take over from Boris with a lot of charisma.

After 14 years of the Tories, the electoral cycles will likely turn against them, but Labour will be forced to do a deal with the SNP, which will backfire.  If the Scots get independence, then it's even harder for Labour to get a majority, just on the remaining seat maths.

[steviewevie]

9 minutes ago, gary1979666 said:

I reckon this will be case, unless someone comes in to take over from Boris with a lot of charisma.

After 14 years of the Tories, the electoral cycles will likely turn against them, but Labour will be forced to do a deal with the SNP, which will backfire.  If the Scots get independence, then it's even harder for Labour to get a majority, just on the remaining seat maths.

maybe they'd offer devo max or something similar...more devolution but scotland stays in UK single market and currency etc

[steviewevie]

 

[Ozanne]

 

[Neil]

Prime ministers lies will be happening shortly. 

[squirrelarmy]

4 minutes ago, Neil said:

Prime ministers lies will be happening shortly. 

He’s running away to India

[steviewevie]

I think labelling Starmer as a corbynista might not work as well for bojo as he thinks it does...Starmer done a lot to separate himself from Corbyn, down to even kicking the bloke out.

[steviewevie]

 

[steviewevie]

Someone needs to ask Johnson why is it that he such a massive c**t. The country demands to know.

[Ozanne]

Johnson completely lost the plot when answering Starmer today at PMQs.

[charlierc]

2 hours ago, Barry Fish said:

Because we have never had a minority government before ?   

The reality is someone has to lead the country in that position and there is more chance of the Tories forming a working government than Labour.

We saw the Tories try it when Boris Johnson sacked about 20 Tory MPs who were lukewarm on Brexit compared to their peers shortly after he took office several million years ago in October 2019 after the proroguing attempt failed, and all he did was spend his time trying to force through another election which the Lib Dems decided to endorse. So if that's the precedent, I'm not sure if a minority government will get much done.

[steviewevie]

37 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Johnson completely lost the plot when answering Starmer today at PMQs.

he lost it with Starmer's accusation of what Johnson said about Archbishop and BBC regarding Rwanda/Ukraine...and not sure if it has been confirmed that Johnson did say this stuff or not. Anyway, definitely upset poor old Boris.

[steviewevie]