news & politics:discussion

[Mr.Tease]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

Le Pen polling ahead of Macron.

Macron is a dick, but a Le Pen presidency would be fuckin grim.

Unfortunately last time people who despised Macron ended up voting for him as they were convinced by the 'vote against LePen line'. Since then Macron has done nothing to accommodate those people and instead looks set to embrace some of LePen's anti Muslim stuff, so good luck to him in persuading those people to vote for him again! (suspect they'll stay home) 

[eFestivals]

1 hour ago, gizmoman said:

They have been working on vaccine passports for years, well before Covid came about, they have nothing to do with safety. Care to show me ANY scientific justification for their introduction? They are entirely about control and monitoring the population.

If people have had the vaccine been tested as not having covid then there's low risk of catching covid.itscaboutsafety not control

[eFestivals]

How's your tinfoil hat

[gizmoman]

10 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

If people have had the vaccine been tested as not having covid then there's low risk of catching covid.itscaboutsafety not control

https://ec.europa.eu/health/sites/health/files/vaccination/docs/2019-2022_roadmap_en.pdf

This was published in 2018, they had a clear "roadmap" (where have we heard that before?), working to a europe wide vaccine passport by 2022 so they are right on target, Covid is the useful excuse they need to convince the unquestioning population they are needed.

At what point are you (and others on here) going to stop using the "tinfoil hat" comment to try to win an argument when the facts are plain to see?  A year ago vaccine passports were a "conspiracy theory", we are beyond the theoretical now and yet you continue with this. How can you seriously believe a valid justification exists for them when no scientific evidence has been given and there has been a concerted effort from the likes of Tony Blair to bring in ID schemes over the years?

[steviewevie]

3 hours ago, gizmoman said:

They have been working on vaccine passports for years, well before Covid came about, they have nothing to do with safety. Care to show me ANY scientific justification for their introduction? They are entirely about control and monitoring the population.

oh no they aren't.infection control requires control of infections... Do you think there should have been no attempts to control covid.

Edited April 2, 2021 by eFestivals

[mcshed]

1 hour ago, gizmoman said:

https://ec.europa.eu/health/sites/health/files/vaccination/docs/2019-2022_roadmap_en.pdf

This was published in 2018, they had a clear "roadmap" (where have we heard that before?), working to a europe wide vaccine passport by 2022 so they are right on target, Covid is the useful excuse they need to convince the unquestioning population they are needed.

At what point are you (and others on here) going to stop using the "tinfoil hat" comment to try to win an argument when the facts are plain to see?  A year ago vaccine passports were a "conspiracy theory", we are beyond the theoretical now and yet you continue with this. How can you seriously believe a valid justification exists for them when no scientific evidence has been given and there has been a concerted effort from the likes of Tony Blair to bring in ID schemes over the years?

You know that loads of countries in the EU have ID cards, an EU vaccine passport has fuck all to do trying to convince the UK that ID cards are a sensible thing.

You say people have laughed at you about Vaccine passports in the past, but that is only true when you are being silly. A domestic vaccine passport that you show to get into a bar is always going to be a temporary measure suggesting it will be a permanent part of a surveillance state is as nutty now as it was when you were saying it last summer.

[eFestivals]

1 hour ago, gizmoman said:

https://ec.europa.eu/health/sites/health/files/vaccination/docs/2019-2022_roadmap_en.pdf

This was published in 2018, they had a clear "roadmap" (where have we heard that before?), working to a europe wide vaccine passport by 2022 so they are right on target, Covid is the useful excuse they need to convince the unquestioning population they are needed.

At what point are you (and others on here) going to stop using the "tinfoil hat" comment to try to win an argument when the facts are plain to see?  A year ago vaccine passports were a "conspiracy theory", we are beyond the theoretical now and yet you continue with this. How can you seriously believe a valid justification exists for them when no scientific evidence has been given and there has been a concerted effort from the likes of Tony Blair to bring in ID schemes over the years?

They don't need vaccine passports for control most EU states already have I'd cards.

I'll throw in the tinfoil hats thing for as long as yousaycontrol When there's no clear way to control via vaccine passports there is clear infection control via them so there's no need to allege something more dodgy about them.

[steviewevie]

2 hours ago, Mr.Tease said:

Unfortunately last time people who despised Macron ended up voting for him as they were convinced by the 'vote against LePen line'. Since then Macron has done nothing to accommodate those people and instead looks set to embrace some of LePen's anti Muslim stuff, so good luck to him in persuading those people to vote for him again! (suspect they'll stay home) 

what's happened to the other main political parties over there?

[eFestivals]

Just now, steviewevie said:

what's happened to the other main political parties over there?

Everyone hated the high taxes.

[efcfanwirral]

1 hour ago, gizmoman said:

https://ec.europa.eu/health/sites/health/files/vaccination/docs/2019-2022_roadmap_en.pdf

This was published in 2018, they had a clear "roadmap" (where have we heard that before?), working to a europe wide vaccine passport by 2022 so they are right on target, Covid is the useful excuse they need to convince the unquestioning population they are needed.

At what point are you (and others on here) going to stop using the "tinfoil hat" comment to try to win an argument when the facts are plain to see?  A year ago vaccine passports were a "conspiracy theory", we are beyond the theoretical now and yet you continue with this. How can you seriously believe a valid justification exists for them when no scientific evidence has been given and there has been a concerted effort from the likes of Tony Blair to bring in ID schemes over the years?

Honestly there's no point getting annoyed about it anymore. It's happening. We have our own choices over whether to use it or not, but it's what the majority wants and will feel safe with. 

[gizmoman]

19 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

They don't need vaccine passports for control most EU states already have I'd cards.

I'll throw in the tinfoil hats thing for as long as yousaycontrol When there's no clear way to control via vaccine passports there is clear infection control via them so there's no need to allege something more dodgy about them.

"most EU states already have I'd cards" - True but you don't need to show them to get into a bar or shop.

By accepting a vaccine passport to go about your normal life you are accepting total control over your own medical situation, if the vaccine passport has to be "up to date" then the government can mandate any future vaccine in order for you to live, it's easy to say (as Mcshed does) that this is just a temporary emergency measure but history shows these temporary restrictions tend to become the norm. Again I say, where is the evidence that justifies them?

[eFestivals]

7 minutes ago, gizmoman said:

"most EU states already have I'd cards" - True but you don't need to show them to get into a bar or shop.

By accepting a vaccine passport to go about your normal life you are accepting total control over your own medical situation, if the vaccine passport has to be "up to date" then the government can mandate any future vaccine in order for you to live, it's easy to say (as Mcshed does) that this is just a temporary emergency measure but history shows these temporary restrictions tend to become the norm. Again I say, where is the evidence that justifies them?

Show something from history where temporty infection control mesursve become a perminsnt way of control.. Unless you can youre talking scare. Ongering crap. The evidence that justifies rthem is covid. 

Edited April 2, 2021 by eFestivals

[eFestivals]

23 minutes ago, gizmoman said:

"most EU states already have I'd cards" - True but you don't need to show them to get into a bar or shop.

By accepting a vaccine passport to go about your normal life you are accepting total control over your own medical situation, if the vaccine passport has to be "up to date" then the government can mandate any future vaccine in order for you to live, it's easy to say (as Mcshed does) that this is just a temporary emergency measure but history shows these temporary restrictions tend to become the norm. Again I say, where is the evidence that justifies them?

The way you say it you're in! lockdown forever.....are you or sare you not.adeveryone hospital or care homes denied visitors are being put to death. Thre only perminent thing going on is you turning into an idjut. 

Edited April 2, 2021 by eFestivals

[eFestivals]

28 minutes ago, gizmoman said:

"most EU states already have I'd cards" - True but you don't need to show them to get into a bar or shop.

By accepting a vaccine passport to go about your normal life you are accepting total control over your own medical situation, if the vaccine passport has to be "up to date" then the government can mandate any future vaccine in order for you to live, it's easy to say (as Mcshed does) that this is just a temporary emergency measure but history shows these temporary restrictions tend to become the norm. Again I say, where is the evidence that justifies them?

Hello Lawrence don't you have some campaign ing for mayor Tobe getting on with.

[gizmoman]

7 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

The way you say it you're in! lockdown forever.....are you or sare you not.adeveryone hospital or care homes denied visitors are being put to death. Thre only perminent thing going on is you turning into an idjut. 

I preferred it when you referred to those you disagreed with as morons, maybe you should revert to that, it might be easier to type than idiot.

 

[eFestivals]

2 minutes ago, gizmoman said:

I preferred it when you referred to those you disagreed with as morons, maybe you should revert to that, it might be easier to type than idiot.

 

The evproper evil bastards use lies to create a climate o fear without care for the people it damages as a consequence. I don't have to call you a moron for People to know that you are you're happy to show people yourself.

Edited April 2, 2021 by eFestivals

[gizmoman]

1 minute ago, eFestivals said:

Hello Lawrence don't you have some campaign ing for mayor Tobe getting on with.

Your replies are getting pretty pathetic, why don't you try and find some actual evidence for why we need a vaccine passport?

[Mr.Tease]

47 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

what's happened to the other main political parties over there?

Pasokification:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pasokification

Labour under Corbyn bucked the trend in 2017 then succumbed to it in 2019.there are genuinely complex reasons for the collapse of the centre and centre left, but rather than genuinely reflect on those, or how Labour bucked the trend in 2017 (I'm genuinely not sure what the answers are) , a lot of commentators prefer to stick to 'Corbyn's crap' 'destroy the left' and pretend it's 1997 so the decline/stagnation continues.

Even the Democrats in the US seem to be updating some of their thinking 

Edited April 2, 2021 by Mr.Tease

[eFestivals]

3 minutes ago, gizmoman said:

Your replies are getting pretty pathetic, why don't you try and find some actual evidence for why we need a vaccine passport?

Covid is the evidence.would you prefer to sit next to someone with covid or without it

[eFestivals]

4 minutes ago, Mr.Tease said:

Pasokification:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pasokification

Labour under Corbyn bucked the trend in 2017 then succumbed to it in 2019.there are genuinely complex reasons for the collapse of the centre and centre left, but rather than genuinely reflect on those, or how Labour bucked the trend in 2017 (I'm genuinely not sure what the answers are) , a lot of commentators prefer to stick to 'Corbyn's crap' 'destroy the left' and pretend it's 1997 so the decline/stagnation continues.

Even the Democrats in the US seem to be updating some of their thinking 

Corbyn and other idiots are the reason for the ack of support for sensible ideas.

[eFestivals]

7 minutes ago, gizmoman said:

Your replies are getting pretty pathetic, why don't you try and find some actual evidence for why we need a vaccine passport?

What's pathetic is your own evidence free care mongering

[Mr.Tease]

4 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

Corbyn and other idiots are the reason for the ack of support for sensible ideas.

Nope, a lot of the ideas were and are popular that's why even the tories (and Biden in America) are adopting some of them. You don't seem to have any ideas for policies whatsoever, nor do the current Labour leadership,which is part of the problem and why all you can do is fall back on the "blame Corbyn" 

[strummer77]

35 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

Show something from history where temporty infection control mesursve become a perminsnt way of control.. Unless you can youre talking scare. Ongering crap. The evidence that justifies rthem is covid. 

It’s not a reaction to Covid at all. The idea of vaccine passports or a ‘health passport’ or common pass etc outdates the pandemic by years.

 

8 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

Covid is the evidence.would you prefer to sit next to someone with covid or without it

Well if someone’s had their vaccine it shouldn’t matter anyway? They shouldn’t be infected.

 

[gizmoman]

3 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

Covid is the evidence.would you prefer to sit next to someone with covid or without it

Having the vaccine doesn't stop you having covid, but you know that, until enough of the population have been vaccinated and we can see the effect on transmission and the number of cases of transmission by the unvaccinated there won't be any actual science behind this policy, at the moment it's all speculation and assumption. If you are vaccinated and still afraid of other people a passport won't help you, you will still be interacting with potential carriers away from pubs etc.

[eFestivals]

1 minute ago, strummer77 said:

It’s not a reaction to Covid at all. The idea of vaccine passports or a ‘health passport’ or common pass etc outdates the pandemic by years.

 

Well if someone’s had their vaccine it shouldn’t matter anyway? They shouldn’t be infected.