Football 2011-2012

[The Nal]

Hmmm, I'm starting to think that Fergie's success might be firmly fixed to Scholes and (to a lesser extent) Giggs - and without them, no matter who they might get in, the success will fade away.

[pink_triangle]

I wouldn't be so sure. No one is going to want to pay his wages.

[thetime]

Just on a different note, I can't help but laugh at fergie for considering berba not fast enough for the faster speed he says he wants Utd to play at now, while welcoming back into the team an oldie that was never fast and is now much slower and whose return has slowed the team back below any increased speed they might have gained at the start of the season.

It says to me that fergie stands a more than decent chance of failing to keep up his consistent winning when giggs and scholes hang up their boots.It'll be interesting to see how Utd manage without them.

[The Nal]

Speaking of Fergie, turns out it was all a big master plan.........

[pink_triangle]

I think scholes coming back has been perfect for a premiership campaign, I dont think its the solution to become competitive in europe again and think man u may struggle to get past the last16/last8 next season if they dont look for a more permanent solution. Man Utd certainly cant become complacent if they win the league this season, they have plenty of flaws in their squad and city are likely to be stronger again. For all the talk about man city bottling the title, a couple of incorrect officiating decisions which have gone in Man Utds favour could also have resulted in the gap being more than the difference in the 2 clubs current form really reflect.

I suppose I see Scholes as a type of sticking plaster patching things up for now and Man U are lucky that their main rivals dont have experience in closing out a premiership season. I dont see it taking much of a change for some of the wins to become draws but luckily Man U probably have enough points on the board.

[thetime]

I think scholes coming back has been perfect for a premiership campaign, I dont think its the solution to become competitive in europe again and think man u may struggle to get past the last16/last8 next season if they dont look for a more permanent solution. Man Utd certainly cant become complacent if they win the league this season, they have plenty of flaws in their squad and city are likely to be stronger again. For all the talk about man city bottling the title, a couple of incorrect officiating decisions which have gone in Man Utds favour could also have resulted in the gap being more than the difference in the 2 clubs current form really reflect.

I suppose I see Scholes as a type of sticking plaster patching things up for now and Man U are lucky that their main rivals dont have experience in closing out a premiership season. I dont see it taking much of a change for some of the wins to become draws but luckily Man U probably have enough points on the board.

[The Nal]

How much money will city spend though with uefas fair play bollox? They certainly wont spend the way they have been for 3 or 4 years.

[pink_triangle]

How much money will city spend though with uefas fair play bollox? They certainly wont spend the way they have been for 3 or 4 years. This was city's big chance with united and chelsea in trasition, although people have been saying that for years and it will be 5 titles in 6.

[thetime]

I dont think finanical fair play will make much of a difference for the big spenders, they will find ways around the system, just as the rich find ways around paying tax in this country. Im personally against the principle at the top level as I think it protects the clubs who were happy to spend heavily when there were no regualtions in place and stops new clubs from ever challenging the elite.

Im not sure its citys big chance if they are willing to spend big than other chances will come. They are 15 points better than last year and have been in their first ever title race. This will leave them stronger in terms of experience but also in attracting a slightly higher calibre of player.

[pink_triangle]

It will make alot of difference to the likes of chelsea and man city becuase they dont have great turn over, you only have to look at the ground for most games to see that. City will not be able to spend like they have done, and they shouldnt need to either but they do. Im with you clubs should be able to spend whatt hey want, can they really get a higher calibre of player? ronaldo? no messi? no. The players that do go there are just there for the money rather than the presitge of playing for a club like barca, madrid, liverpool, man utd, inter milan.

It should give city the experience but can theyhold there nerve and not sack mancini? what will the likes of aguero, silva do when real madrid or barca come calling?

[The Nal]

More importantly, City wont be able to sustain those wages. Some of them are ridiculous. Total wage bill is 174m a year. 20m more than there total turnover. Thats not including transfers

Silva, Yaya, Kompany, Nasri, Tevez and Aguero are all on 200k+ a week with rumours of Tevez and Ageuro close to 300. Or over.

And heres what you get for your 300k a week. Some fucker who pissed off for 5 months and comes back with a belly.

[pink_triangle]

More importantly, City wont be able to sustain those wages. Some of them are ridiculous. Total wage bill is 174m a year. 20m more than there total turnover. Thats not including transfers

Silva, Yaya, Kompany, Nasri, Tevez and Aguero are all on 200k+ a week with rumours of Tevez and Ageuro close to 300. Or over.

And heres what you get for your 300k a week. Some fucker who pissed off for 5 months and comes back with a belly.

[The Nal]

They are able to sustain them just in the way as wigan are able to sustain their wage bill, the money is a lot to us but a drop in the ocean to the city owners, so they are sustainable as long as the man city owners are willing to sustain them.

[jammy2211]

I think the real test is if UEFA would be willing to ban a team like City from entering their competition. End of the day UEFA want Tevez, Aguerro, Silva etc all playing in their premier tournament cause it benefits them to have them making it a bigger spectable and ultimately raise the money UEFA make through TV contracts.

When I first read this financial rule I said it'd only be imposed on the smallest European clubs who get them selves in a mess but UEFA would never reject any of the big boys no matter what.

It's hard to see how City will ever be sustainable though. I can't see that ever mattering until the owners bail.

[eFestivals]

not so much teams giving them too much space as you suggested I think.

bullshit. There was no reason to give him the space he was given at the weekend, or in other matches.

It's fuck all to do with any skills of Scholes and everything to do with poor play from those teams.

(that's not a comment on the skills of Scholes btw, just to make that clear. It's a comment on the poor skills of other teams).

Utd were mildly successful before Scholes.

corrected for you.

[eFestivals]

They said that when hughes, kanchelskis and ince left in 1995.

They said that when cantona left.

They said that when scmeichel left

They said that when Keane left

They said that when big ron left

Now if you said the winning will decline when fergie left, more or less everyone would agree with you.

The difference this time around is this:- Scholes left and Utd declined.

There's no doubt about that, just as there's no doubt about the improvement since he returned.

How would have Utd done over the full season without Scholes? It's impossible to say, but I think it's fair comment to say that they wouldn't be doing as well.

As for the rest you list, only Scmichael would have brought any similar comment from anyone of any sense. The rest were easy to replace, as was shown when they were replaced.

[pink_triangle]

The FIFA fair play rules will be a factor. Sure they may shuffle a bit of cash around but they won't be able to mask that sort of overspending.

[The Nal]

bullshit. There was no reason to give him the space he was given at the weekend, or in other matches.

It's fuck all to do with any skills of Scholes and everything to do with poor play from those teams.

(that's not a comment on the skills of Scholes btw, just to make that clear. It's a comment on the poor skills of other teams).

Edited April 10, 2012 by The Nal

[strummer77]

Widely reported to be £90k....

[zahidf]

http://chortle.co.uk/news/2012/04/10/15 ... on_my_tits

So, the best way to counter someone saying something bad is to say something worse?...

[eFestivals]

Is is a coincidence that all over the world, these small and nifty midfielders (Alonso aside) seem to be able to find a spare yard every time they get the ball?

who is talking about "a spare yard"? Not me.

I'm talking about no one being within a ten+ yard radius, and no one changing that for tens of seconds - which is what happened at the weekend, and happened when Utd played Shitty in one of the first games that Scholes played when he came back.

After that Shitty game you were raving about the stats that Scholes had, but my 77 year old mum could have got those stats if she was given that much time and space.

My comment is 100% about the failings of other teams and naff all to do with how great Scholes may or may not be.

Scholes of not holding those teams away with his skill, a bargepole, or even an invisible force field. It's everything about those other teams being shit and nothing to do with Scholes - he only comes into it when fools think his great stats off the back of it is his own doing.

Look at this.

Why? It's naff all to do with what I'm commenting on.

Utd won 4 leagues and 3 FA Cups from 92 until Scholes really started playing in the team in 97ish. thats success in my book.

the 'kid' years don't count?

[strummer77]

I think thats bollocks to be frank...

Gerrard is probably one of two players who makes the difference between you being a top half and a bottom four team right now...

I won't have any reasonable conversation that starts with him being your problem... He is a glowing example of how your team lacks any sort of quality.... He stands out like a swore thumb...

EDIT: well maybe bottom six...

[JBarbour]

my greatest joy being a man utd fans is listening to all the haters crying and making excuses for their teams being shit. PURE JOY

City players no balls

Liverpool ha ha everton better with no money

Chelsea run by a bond villain all money and ego

Arsenal best acadamy side in europe feeder club for bigger fish

[strummer77]

my greatest joy being a man utd fans is listening to all the haters crying and making excuses for their teams being shit. PURE JOY

[The Nal]

who is talking about "a spare yard"? Not me.

I'm talking about no one being within a ten+ yard radius, and no one changing that for tens of seconds - which is what happened at the weekend, and happened when Utd played Shitty in one of the first games that Scholes played when he came back.

After that Shitty game you were raving about the stats that Scholes had, but my 77 year old mum could have got those stats if she was given that much time and space.

My comment is 100% about the failings of other teams and naff all to do with how great Scholes may or may not be.

Edited April 10, 2012 by The Nal