More Metallica Controversy

[Jelly Belly]

Nope, you got labelled a troll for your own flaws - your inability to read, and your inability to differentiate.

PMSL.

Small brains and poor thought will never rattle me. Come back after a bit more training.

yep, true. There is nothing to discuss when you're saying grey is always Bblack .... and your hero Hetfield walks away unblemished as you want him to, as was your trolling plan.

[Blisterpack]

unfortunately, that only works for the people with a mind. ;)Two weeks ago loads of peeps voted for foxhunting-supporting w*nkers, on the basis that they greed with him how wrong it was that foreigners speak foreign on trains.I never knew that the UK was such a country of linguists, cos they're all talking native on their holidays, obviously.

[eFestivals]

You're a keyboard warrior who is unable to listen to anyone else who's viewpoint is different to your own.

I'm listening to a viewpoint that's very different to mine, which is saying that killing animals for fun is identical to not killing them at all.

Why do you think I should be accepting such utter mindblowing stupidity?

46'000 posts on a message board? I think you need to get outside now and again and read up on a few things before spouting off about something you clearly know very little about.

that's 46,000 posts made since you were still wearing nappies, and every single one of them has been related to my job.

When you've got a job so you get what jobs are about, get back to me.

[Craig_G]

lol - beat me to it.

[jeffie]

Look at his username. Then look at the name of this website. That may give you a clue as to why he has that many posts.

[Jelly Belly]

You're a child

[willutalk]

No one can judge James for what he has done. As they'll have sins:

[eFestivals]

You're a child

says the man who failed to read my posts properly, and won't discuss why he thinks killing animals purely the fun of it is 100% identical to not killing animals at all.

[Klyde]

All the metal fans should get together and start digging for some dirt on Dolly Parton and set up a petition to oust her.

I mean, how dare they have country and Western at Glastonbury! Arrgh!

[eFestivals]

No one can judge James for what he has done.

they can and they will as the facebook campaign shows, just as they will Eavis (as the multitude of internet posts 'out there' do).

Normally tho, when judging someone, it's usually a good idea to actually refer to and use the facts, and not invent mock outrage from real stupidity.

[autoinflate]

Eating meat is fun but unnecessary though isn't it?

Nobody going to pick that point up?

[eFestivals]

Eating meat is fun but unnecessary though isn't it?

Nobody going to pick that point up?

I've deliberately avoided it.

Mostly because numpty^^ has wanted to bang on about what is legal or illegal in relation to Hetfield and Eavis, which puts the purposeful-legal within the necessities.

[autoinflate]

I've deliberately avoided it.

[eFestivals]

ha nice one.

i really can't get my head round the morals.....it's not easy being human.

the meat or no-meat thing is a really difficult one from moral angles.

For example, in Tibet - a traditional religiously (Buddhist) based vegetarian society - there are religious exemptions that allow for the eating of meat in particular circumstances, so even those most wedded to the idea of vegetarianism have the circumstances of necessity over-ride the moral at times.

[Anarion]

Just hope the protesters won't try to ruin or interfere with the actual concert in any way.

I bet a large portion of those who have signed the petition, are people who just doesn't like the music and think it would be funny if Metallica was removed from the festival.

[Ted Dansons Wig]

the meat or no-meat thing is a really difficult one from moral angles.

For example, in Tibet - a traditional religiously (Buddhist) based vegetarian society - there are religious exemptions that allow for the eating of meat in particular circumstances, so even those most wedded to the idea of vegetarianism have the circumstances of necessity over-ride the moral at times.

[autoinflate]

Interesting.

On the subject of necessity, eating meat is surely un-necessary in a technologically advanced society....we could grow whatever food we need at far less cost to the planet and with no misery subjected on living things (which wouldn't therefore exist, bizarre thought).

By extension, eating meat is a barbaric act of equal or greater magnitude to hunting for sport, which is after all only an expression of human nature formed over billions of years of evolution.

Therefore is it not hypocritical to eat a ham sandwich and slag off James Hetfield?

I can't decide.

[jeffie]

But this is only only allowed when youre really pissed

[Blisterpack]

Interesting.

On the subject of necessity, eating meat is surely un-necessary in a technologically advanced society....we could grow whatever food we need at far less cost to the planet and with no misery subjected on living things (which wouldn't therefore exist, bizarre thought).

By extension, eating meat is a barbaric act of equal or greater magnitude to hunting for sport, which is after all only an expression of human nature formed over billions of years of evolution.

Therefore is it not hypocritical to eat a ham sandwich and slag off James Hetfield?

I can't decide.

[The Nal]

I bought a smoker bbq recently. Last weekend I cooked two pork shoulders, a huge beef brisket, a chicken and a load of ribs on it.

Also had the normal bbq on at the time which cooked 20 odd burgers, more ribs, a few pounds of sausages, chicken wings, chicken thighs and some lamb. 20 odd people from ages 2 to age 40 odd eating a shitload of different animals. Delicious tasty animals.

Honestly didn't give the welfare of the animals a second thought. Was listening to Master of Puppets for some of it. Played a few rousing chords of air guitar during the riff breaks too as the aroma of burning carcasses wafted across the neighbourhood.

Actually, come to think of it, I hope the animals were mercilessly slaughtered in front of their young and then the staff at the abattoir wore their warm bloody skins as masks while they all had sex with each other .

[eFestivals]

Interesting.

On the subject of necessity, eating meat is surely un-necessary in a technologically advanced society....we could grow whatever food we need at far less cost to the planet and with no misery subjected on living things (which wouldn't therefore exist, bizarre thought).

By extension, eating meat is a barbaric act of equal or greater magnitude to hunting for sport, which is after all only an expression of human nature formed over billions of years of evolution.

Therefore is it not hypocritical to eat a ham sandwich and slag off James Hetfield?

I can't decide.

It's certainly the case that most of the meat eating is done because we like it. That gets pretty much proved within any developing society, where the meat eating increases the further it moves from a subsistence society.

But .... it still serves an essential purpose more than does the shooting of bears only for fun.

Food is an absolute requirement. Our bodies don't much care if that food is animal or vegetable (tho operate better with some combinations than others).

In relation to Hetfield's bear shooting, I'm not sure that the food choices we've made as a society should be considered as anything but essential. As far as it goes, it's a settled matter within global society (tho of course there's plenty of individuals who might disagree with that conclusion) and as such has almost ceased to be a moral question. The moral questions around it are about how the killing is done, not whether it should be done - and nothing of it is done for the pleasure of the killing itself.

And this is where the very big difference is with Hetfield - because there is a clear moral question there of whether the killing should be done at all in the first place.

Where people and bears live too close together they'd be good reasons to kill bears (in much the same way as farmers have good reasons to need foxes dead), but as far as I'm aware that was nothing about what Hetfield was doing. He was doing it only for the personal pleasure that killing something gave him.

That's on a totally different level as far as i'm concerned.

Edited June 5, 2014 by eFestivals

[Ted Dansons Wig]

I bought a smoker bbq recently. Last weekend I cooked two pork shoulders, a huge beef brisket, a chicken and a load of ribs on it.

Also had the normal bbq on at the time which cooked 20 odd burgers, more ribs, a few pounds of sausages, chicken wings, chicken thighs and some lamb. 20 odd people from ages 2 to age 40 odd eating a shitload of different animals. Delicious tasty animals.

Honestly didn't give the welfare of the animals a second thought. Was listening to Master of Puppets for some of it. Played a few rousing chords of air guitar during the riff breaks too as the aroma of burning carcasses wafted across the neighbourhood.

Actually, come to think of it, I hope the animals were mercilessly slaughtered in front of their young and then the staff at the abattoir wore their warm bloody skins as masks while they all had sex with each other .

[Red Day]

The two bears doing their DJ slot at the Stonebridge bar on the Thursday night better have a good lookout

[autoinflate]

It's certainly the case that most of the meat eating is done because we like it. That gets pretty much proved within any developing society, where the meat eating increases the further it moves from a subsistence society.

But .... it still serves an essential purpose more than does the shooting of bears only for fun.

Food is an absolute requirement. Our bodies don't much care if that food is animal or vegetable (tho operate better with some combinations than others).

In relation to Hetfield's bear shooting, I'm not sure that the food choices we've made as a society should be considered as anything but essential. As far as it goes, it's a settled matter within global society (tho of course there's plenty of individuals who might disagree with that conclusion) and as such has almost ceased to be a moral question. The moral questions around it are about how the killing is done, not whether it should be done - and nothing of it is done for the pleasure of the killing itself.

And this is where the very big difference is with Hetfield - because there is a clear moral question there of whether the killing should be done at all in the first place.

Where people and bears live too close together they'd be good reasons to kill bears (in much the same way as farmers have good reasons to need foxes dead), but as far as I'm aware that was nothing about what Hetfield was doing. He was doing it only for the personal pleasure that killing something gave him.

That's on a totally different level as far as i'm concerned.

All well put and I think you're probably right, but I'm not completely convinced.

Eating meat is done for gratification, not need, no matter how we try to dress it up. It may be the status quo and completely natural, but it is what it is. We can look to various cultures/people that don't eat meat at all because they believe this type of gratification is morally abhorent, or they're scared of god. Either way they're not harming animals by food or hunting choices and lead otherwise normal lives. Are they morally superior to meat eaters and hunters?

Hetfield shot bears for gratification based on a naturally evolved desire to hunt and kill which is present in various animals regardless of their need for food. Are we saying that because we're more evolved/intelligent than say a cat, we shouldn't hunt and toy with prey for fun when not hungry? If so, should we not kill prey at all because we're evolved/intelligent enough to realise that Morrisey is right and meat really is murder?

In the end aren't we just talking about the moral boundaries of what is acceptable to gain personal gratification? You're saying a pig dying because we get a nice taste/texture in our mouths is better than the pig dying because we get an adrenalin rush. At the end of it, we're talking about two sets of actions that cause pleasure responses in our brains, both entirely un-necessary for our survival. You justify the pig because we need to eat. Well, we also need to have fun / enjoy our lives, or what's the point of even living? A cat would be miserable without hunting. So might a lot of humans. I would be miserable not eating meat. Would you?

It's enough to fuck your head up thinking about it

[Jelly Belly]

EFestivals - let's break my points down into lamens terms for someone like you, thick as mince and unable to have a reasoned debate without resorting to personal insults.

James Hetfield - supports and indeeds has been known to hunt.

My view - This is wrong, Hunting as a sport is something I, along with the vast majority of those who have expressed an opinion seem to agree with.

EFestivals - ok so far? Got that? Right, next point.

Fox Hunting - This is another trophy seeking blood sport, no matter how you try and dress it up it is certainly not 'pest control'

Michael Eavis - without going as far as hunting himself (as far as I'm aware?) openly allows Fox Hunting to take place on Worthy Farm. Now, Michael giving his permission is not illegal so no crime commited there BUT (here's where you seem to be getting confused bless you, maybe stay away from the internet porn for ten minutes and let it sink in eh?) Fox Hunting IS illegal.

Phew, nearly there EFest, tough work this concentrating business isn't it? Keep at it son, we are nearly there.

Protests to have Metallica removed because of his hunting history - Those expressing their desire to see Metallica removed from the Glastonbury line up are doing so because THEY believe it is against what Glastonbury stands for (this is clearly not defined anywhere is merely their view)

My main point - Its massively hypocritical to criticise James Hetfield and ask Eavis to take Metallica off the bill when Michael Eavis himself shares similar beliefs to Hetfield when it comes to hunting.

Now, is that broken up enough for you? Nobody denies that Foxes need to be controlled but the manner of its control is the important factor.

Official, traditional Hunts = blood sports

A farmer and his gun = 'pest control'

Class dismissed