2024 Festival

[amanufan16]

Strange that they just did a surprise announcement for Artemis, wonder when/if the next lineup announcement would be and why he wasn’t added there

[Andre91]

Never heard of Artemas but I’ve just listened to the top songs on Spotify and I like the sound of it a lot. Adds something I want to see on the LG day which is my quietest. 

[RedJosh]

On 4/3/2024 at 1:42 PM, Benj said:

The question is (or at least the one I want answered) is why did they die so quickly, to never be allowed a return…

Late to the discussion about why did so many Britpop acts, post Britpop acts and early indie revival acts die off, but I think it is really interesting.

 

When you look at some of the people you talked about who headlined or had prominent positions in the 2000's, but then never returned - Razorlight, Bloc Party, Franz Ferdinand - I think I have the answers.

 

Razorlight imploded not long after their 2007 headline set, pretty much stopped touring a couple of years later when their drummer who wrote their hits left and then didn't release an album in 10 years. They have only properly started touring recently since they have their OG line-up back together.

 

Bloc Party wrote a straight up banger first album and a great second album, but then decided that they wanted to do experimental stuff that I'd say doesn't work as well with R+L indie crowd compared to others they could book. To be fair they did 5 of 6 years between 2004 and 2009. During that time they headlined radio 1, were third down main and sub-headlined twice for The Killers and Radiohead.

 

Franz Ferdinand I think are the interesting one, but I never really liked them so have never though about them, but my inclination is that they were never an 'indie' band that anyone I knew was ever invested in and wanted to see live. They felt to me like they clicked more with they younger teachers while I was in secondary school than with the people who liked indie a bit like someone such as The Coral or Elbow.

 

Britpop was just before me, so can't really comment on it, but I think the fact that the biggest three are all still bigish with younger people shows how well Oasis, Blur and Pulp still hold up.

 

Edited May 1 by RedJosh

[Alex DeLarge]

17 hours ago, amanufan16 said:

Strange that they just did a surprise announcement for Artemis, wonder when/if the next lineup announcement would be and why he wasn’t added there

Probably just because he's massive on TikTok and a (very) new artist. 

[gfa]

15 hours ago, RedJosh said:

Late to the discussion about why did so many Britpop acts, post Britpop acts and early indie revival acts die off, but I think it is really interesting.

 

When you look at some of the people you talked about who headlined or had prominent positions in the 2000's, but then never returned - Razorlight, Bloc Party, Franz Ferdinand - I think I have the answers.

 

Razorlight imploded not long after their 2007 headline set, pretty much stopped touring a couple of years later when their drummer who wrote their hits left and then didn't release an album in 10 years. They have only properly started touring recently since they have their OG line-up back together.

 

Bloc Party wrote a straight up banger first album and a great second album, but then decided that they wanted to do experimental stuff that I'd say doesn't work as well with R+L indie crowd compared to others they could book. To be fair they did 5 of 6 years between 2004 and 2009. During that time they headlined radio 1, were third down main and sub-headlined twice for The Killers and Radiohead.

 

Franz Ferdinand I think are the interesting one, but I never really liked them so have never though about them, but my inclination is that they were never an 'indie' band that anyone I knew was ever invested in and wanted to see live. They felt to me like they clicked more with they younger teachers while I was in secondary school than with the people who liked indie a bit like someone such as The Coral or Elbow.

 

Britpop was just before me, so can't really comment on it, but I think the fact that the biggest three are all still bigish with younger people shows how well Oasis, Blur and Pulp still hold up.

 

Acts get too big to the point they aren't worth booking again in that slot

 

esp if they play a lot e.g. bloc party - victim of their own success almost

 

Once you play a big slot, its hard to get them to play lower let alone subbing the whole fest twice - and they just weren't worth having sub again i guess

[charlierc]

On 5/1/2024 at 12:00 AM, RedJosh said:

Franz Ferdinand I think are the interesting one, but I never really liked them so have never though about them, but my inclination is that they were never an 'indie' band that anyone I knew was ever invested in and wanted to see live. They felt to me like they clicked more with they younger teachers while I was in secondary school than with the people who liked indie a bit like someone such as The Coral or Elbow.

Franz Ferdinand's third album seems to have been a tilt-point in a way. I like Tonight: Franz Ferdinand, but it didn't seem to have the crossover hits like the first two acts did, plus the two year gestation period saw them kinda drift away from bill-toppers thoughts (even if they did have some decent spots in 2009) and I also wonder if there was a conscious choice from the band that they preferred playing smaller venues to doing arena tours. They also nearly broke up before releasing Right Thoughts..., and in coming back in 2013/14, by that point the ship had kinda sailed for being a bill-topper.

 

They're still quite effective though. Seen them live several times and usually have an excellent time, and still seem to be a solid choice for mid-range festivals (think they've done Truck and Y Not, for instance) or supporting indie mega-stars like Killers or Kings of Leon, both of whom they've opened for at UK/Ireland festivals. Indeed, I would've already booked a ticket for KoL at Hyde Park if Franz were the opener, which I had been hoping for but it ain't to be.

Edited May 6 by charlierc

[VCK2]

Even The Libertines are nowhere near headline status nowadays, and until they reformed they held something of a semi-mythical status.

It's interesting how the American acts of that era - The Strokes, The Killers, even KOL who are still very much a festival/arena headline sized act - have fared so much better than their British counterparts. Only ones I can think of that still hold up well commercially today are Arctic Monkeys, who were always a huge name, and Kasabian (up until the Tom Meighan controversy) who had more of a crossover appeal and were less guitar oriented than the others.

It's just crazy looking back how once upon a time Razorlight and Franz Ferdinand were deemed to be on the same level as the likes of RHCP, Muse and Pearl Jam by the R&L promoters.

Edited May 7 by VCK2

[charlierc]

On 5/7/2024 at 7:26 PM, VCK2 said:

It's just crazy looking back how once upon a time Razorlight and Franz Ferdinand were deemed to be on the same level as the likes of RHCP, Muse and Pearl Jam by the R&L promoters.

Franz in retrospect isn't that insane - first 2 albums had high-charting singles and they seemed on a trajectory, but like I said, they stalled with album three.

 

But maybe it's me just going into bat because I like their work, and also noting that Razorlight seem to have plummeted further. Indeed, they opened for Muse at Hammersmith Apollo two years ago (exactly two years ago today, as it turns out), and that was the first time I'd heard about them for years.

[Chad888]

On 5/1/2024 at 12:00 AM, RedJosh said:

Late to the discussion about why did so many Britpop acts, post Britpop acts and early indie revival acts die off, but I think it is really interesting.

 

I think the times and youth have completely changed with the advent of mobile phones, social media and Internet, and more accessible/realistic video games .. and shockingly 9/11.

 

After 9/11, everything changed, the entire mood in pop culture went darker, we lost the upbeat TV comedies like Friends etc and comedy and music went a lot more nihilistic.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-9-11-changed-pop-culture-in-america-11631026800

 

Britpop was very much the culture of 90s Britain before everything got dark and scary, when we didn't have access to 24/7 news at our finger tips, we weren't filled with fear constantly, and we weren't hooked on trying to live the most hollow life to present it to social media in a twisted vanity project. 

 

20-30 years ago, we would leave the house and go to your local flat top pub, drink pints, probably a little sick down their jeans after downing a 35cl bottle of vodka from the offy on the bus, whilst girls danced to the shite DJ wearing foundation for lipstick, and the latest BANK blouse and PBJ clutch and a 20 pack of £1.49 L&B. The lads got into fights with bouncers and the night would end in town where you'd go to a late night club and could be as messy as you want, as a finger up to your straight edge parents that told you to stay safe and out of trouble. The music reflected this and you could bop to it because they sang what you were living.

 

Now everything is commercialised, you take an uber to the club in a £400 on a Gucci t shirt and £1200 on a Moncler coat, have to stand posed all night incase someone has you in the background of their Instagram story. Girls wear the skimpiest outfits in hope they can flash a cheek in a photo to get a few more likes and a sponsorship deal. Alcohol gets you to messy and anti-photogenic so they stick to cocaine. The music is all about being posed and the brands you wear. Kids can't connect with the old britpop because we don't live like that anymore.

 

The closest we have to the old style is the 'rock' focused clubs and bars, because the rock scene is less focused on posing and more on making noise with a finger up at authority. Unfortunately 90% of it is manufactured radio friendly rock, created by focus groups like Imagine Dragons and Wet Leg.

[Andre91]

You heard it here first: people don’t care about The Libertines anymore because of 9/11. 

[Andre91]

29 minutes ago, Chad888 said:

 

I think the times and youth have completely changed with the advent of mobile phones, social media and Internet, and more accessible/realistic video games .. and shockingly 9/11.

 

After 9/11, everything changed, the entire mood in pop culture went darker, we lost the upbeat TV comedies like Friends etc and comedy and music went a lot more nihilistic.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-9-11-changed-pop-culture-in-america-11631026800

 

Britpop was very much the culture of 90s Britain before everything got dark and scary, when we didn't have access to 24/7 news at our finger tips, we weren't filled with fear constantly, and we weren't hooked on trying to live the most hollow life to present it to social media in a twisted vanity project. 

 

20-30 years ago, we would leave the house and go to your local flat top pub, drink pints, probably a little sick down their jeans after downing a 35cl bottle of vodka from the offy on the bus, whilst girls danced to the shite DJ wearing foundation for lipstick, and the latest BANK blouse and PBJ clutch and a 20 pack of £1.49 L&B. The lads got into fights with bouncers and the night would end in town where you'd go to a late night club and could be as messy as you want, as a finger up to your straight edge parents that told you to stay safe and out of trouble. The music reflected this and you could bop to it because they sang what you were living.

 

Now everything is commercialised, you take an uber to the club in a £400 on a Gucci t shirt and £1200 on a Moncler coat, have to stand posed all night incase someone has you in the background of their Instagram story. Girls wear the skimpiest outfits in hope they can flash a cheek in a photo to get a few more likes and a sponsorship deal. Alcohol gets you to messy and anti-photogenic so they stick to cocaine. The music is all about being posed and the brands you wear. Kids can't connect with the old britpop because we don't live like that anymore.

 

The closest we have to the old style is the 'rock' focused clubs and bars, because the rock scene is less focused on posing and more on making noise with a finger up at authority. Unfortunately 90% of it is manufactured radio friendly rock, created by focus groups like Imagine Dragons and Wet Leg.

Ahh yes, the 90s! That decade where people famously didn’t do drugs. 
 

Your whole post is about Britain and Britpop, so you link an article about the USA? 
 

Also, worst post I’ve ever seen on here. HANDS DOWN. 

Edited May 10 by Andre91

[VCK2]

On 5/10/2024 at 8:44 PM, charlierc said:

Franz in retrospect isn't that insane - first 2 albums had high-charting singles and they seemed on a trajectory, but like I said, they stalled with album three.

 

But maybe it's me just going into bat because I like their work, and also noting that Razorlight seem to have plummeted further. Indeed, they opened for Muse at Hammersmith Apollo two years ago (exactly two years ago today, as it turns out), and that was the first time I'd heard about them for years.

Don't get me wrong, both Franz and Razorlight were huge at the time they headlined. Just that no one talks about them any more so looking back and seeing bands that I'd imagine a fair number of the younger crowd might not even have heard of is weird.

[charlierc]

18 minutes ago, VCK2 said:

Don't get me wrong, both Franz and Razorlight were huge at the time they headlined. Just that no one talks about them any more so looking back and seeing bands that I'd imagine a fair number of the younger crowd might not even have heard of is weird.

I feel like Franz are slightly ahead of Razorlight tbf - Take Me Out still gets some indie disco rotation and I feel like I saw a reasonable number of people younger than me at Ally Pally 2 years ago.

 

I'm not gonna pretend they're still at the same level as they were in 2006 when they were subbing Red Hot Chilis at T in the Park and headlining Reading alongside Muse & Pearl Jam. Although tbf Muse had yet to graduate into the stadium league at that point.

 

Razorlight's 2007 R&L headline slot genuinely seemed to stop their career momentum imo.

[Benj]

33 minutes ago, VCK2 said:

Don't get me wrong, both Franz and Razorlight were huge at the time they headlined. Just that no one talks about them any more so looking back and seeing bands that I'd imagine a fair number of the younger crowd might not even have heard of is weird.

Think they were both still seen as pretty weak headliners at the time

 

FF were great though, can’t really remember the Razorlight set but they were one of the (few) highlights of 2004

[charlierc]

15 hours ago, Benj said:

Think they were both still seen as pretty weak headliners at the time

 

FF were great though, can’t really remember the Razorlight set but they were one of the (few) highlights of 2004

I seem to recall people saying sub-headliners Kings of Leon were better and should've headlined.

 

An irony given KoL's reputation for dull and dour live sets - not least when they last did R&L in 2018 - although given this was a pre-Sex on Fire/Use Somebody KoL, it's one that still seemed to have the feral quality their early live sets had.

[gfa]

On 5/7/2024 at 7:26 PM, VCK2 said:

Even The Libertines are nowhere near headline status nowadays, and until they reformed they held something of a semi-mythical status.

It's interesting how the American acts of that era - The Strokes, The Killers, even KOL who are still very much a festival/arena headline sized act - have fared so much better than their British counterparts. Only ones I can think of that still hold up well commercially today are Arctic Monkeys, who were always a huge name, and Kasabian (up until the Tom Meighan controversy) who had more of a crossover appeal and were less guitar oriented than the others.

It's just crazy looking back how once upon a time Razorlight and Franz Ferdinand were deemed to be on the same level as the likes of RHCP, Muse and Pearl Jam by the R&L promoters.

Its a fair bit to do with touring i think

 

Killers are just huge but for KOL and Strokes they hardly do shows here which keeps their stock high. Sure they both have some big hits and are big abroad, but their lack of touring certainly helps a lot.

Worth noting though, Franz and Razorlight were never as big as KOL / Strokes internationally - who are both a fair bit smaller than Killers as well i'd say

[Benj]

1 hour ago, gfa said:

Its a fair bit to do with touring i think

 

Killers are just huge but for KOL and Strokes they hardly do shows here which keeps their stock high. Sure they both have some big hits and are big abroad, but their lack of touring certainly helps a lot.

Worth noting though, Franz and Razorlight were never as big as KOL / Strokes internationally - who are both a fair bit smaller than Killers as well i'd say

FF were pretty big in Europe, in fact they still get much bigger billings at many Euro festivals than they’d get in the UK

 

Although your point re scarcity probably applies there too 

[RedJosh]

On 5/10/2024 at 9:24 PM, Chad888 said:

 

I think the times and youth have completely changed with the advent of mobile phones, social media and Internet, and more accessible/realistic video games .. and shockingly 9/11.

 

After 9/11, everything changed, the entire mood in pop culture went darker, we lost the upbeat TV comedies like Friends etc and comedy and music went a lot more nihilistic.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-9-11-changed-pop-culture-in-america-11631026800

 

Britpop was very much the culture of 90s Britain before everything got dark and scary, when we didn't have access to 24/7 news at our finger tips, we weren't filled with fear constantly, and we weren't hooked on trying to live the most hollow life to present it to social media in a twisted vanity project. 

 

20-30 years ago, we would leave the house and go to your local flat top pub, drink pints, probably a little sick down their jeans after downing a 35cl bottle of vodka from the offy on the bus, whilst girls danced to the shite DJ wearing foundation for lipstick, and the latest BANK blouse and PBJ clutch and a 20 pack of £1.49 L&B. The lads got into fights with bouncers and the night would end in town where you'd go to a late night club and could be as messy as you want, as a finger up to your straight edge parents that told you to stay safe and out of trouble. The music reflected this and you could bop to it because they sang what you were living.

 

Now everything is commercialised, you take an uber to the club in a £400 on a Gucci t shirt and £1200 on a Moncler coat, have to stand posed all night incase someone has you in the background of their Instagram story. Girls wear the skimpiest outfits in hope they can flash a cheek in a photo to get a few more likes and a sponsorship deal. Alcohol gets you to messy and anti-photogenic so they stick to cocaine. The music is all about being posed and the brands you wear. Kids can't connect with the old britpop because we don't live like that anymore.

 

The closest we have to the old style is the 'rock' focused clubs and bars, because the rock scene is less focused on posing and more on making noise with a finger up at authority. Unfortunately 90% of it is manufactured radio friendly rock, created by focus groups like Imagine Dragons and Wet Leg.

You have obviously not been on a night out in 20-30 years then fella and look to have watched too much TOWIE or Made In Chelsea.

[gfa]

On 5/10/2024 at 9:24 PM, Chad888 said:

 

I think the times and youth have completely changed with the advent of mobile phones, social media and Internet, and more accessible/realistic video games .. and shockingly 9/11.

 

After 9/11, everything changed, the entire mood in pop culture went darker, we lost the upbeat TV comedies like Friends etc and comedy and music went a lot more nihilistic.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-9-11-changed-pop-culture-in-america-11631026800

 

Britpop was very much the culture of 90s Britain before everything got dark and scary, when we didn't have access to 24/7 news at our finger tips, we weren't filled with fear constantly, and we weren't hooked on trying to live the most hollow life to present it to social media in a twisted vanity project. 

 

20-30 years ago, we would leave the house and go to your local flat top pub, drink pints, probably a little sick down their jeans after downing a 35cl bottle of vodka from the offy on the bus, whilst girls danced to the shite DJ wearing foundation for lipstick, and the latest BANK blouse and PBJ clutch and a 20 pack of £1.49 L&B. The lads got into fights with bouncers and the night would end in town where you'd go to a late night club and could be as messy as you want, as a finger up to your straight edge parents that told you to stay safe and out of trouble. The music reflected this and you could bop to it because they sang what you were living.

 

Now everything is commercialised, you take an uber to the club in a £400 on a Gucci t shirt and £1200 on a Moncler coat, have to stand posed all night incase someone has you in the background of their Instagram story. Girls wear the skimpiest outfits in hope they can flash a cheek in a photo to get a few more likes and a sponsorship deal. Alcohol gets you to messy and anti-photogenic so they stick to cocaine. The music is all about being posed and the brands you wear. Kids can't connect with the old britpop because we don't live like that anymore.

 

The closest we have to the old style is the 'rock' focused clubs and bars, because the rock scene is less focused on posing and more on making noise with a finger up at authority. Unfortunately 90% of it is manufactured radio friendly rock, created by focus groups like Imagine Dragons and Wet Leg.

how did i miss this gold

[charlierc]

On 5/10/2024 at 9:47 PM, Andre91 said:

You heard it here first: people don’t care about The Libertines anymore because of 9/11. 

Given Up the Bracket came out in 2002, does that mean people stopped caring about them before they took off?

[charlierc]

22 hours ago, gfa said:

Its a fair bit to do with touring i think

 

Killers are just huge but for KOL and Strokes they hardly do shows here which keeps their stock high. Sure they both have some big hits and are big abroad, but their lack of touring certainly helps a lot.

Worth noting though, Franz and Razorlight were never as big as KOL / Strokes internationally - who are both a fair bit smaller than Killers as well i'd say

I mean Kings of Leon have a tour in June that still has a healthy amount of tickets available, having also done an arena run in 2022 and European shows in 2023 (though the only ones here were in Wrexham for Ryan Reynolds and Rob McElhenney's friends), and played UK shows in 2019, 2018 and 2017. So I wouldn't say they're as scarce as The Strokes.

 

I'd agree with The Killers being the biggest fish of the three though. Although KoL are surprisingly big in Germany looking at the data.

[glastorome]

Fred Again dropped an insane remix of Kendricks "Not Like Us" into a set in Mexico last week, hope that stays in for R&L 

[gfa]

1 hour ago, glastorome said:

Fred Again dropped an insane remix of Kendricks "Not Like Us" into a set in Mexico last week, hope that stays in for R&L 

that was a DJ set rather than live so pretty unlikely

 

his live set is basically only his own stuff - i'd expect something like this https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/fred-again/2024/spark-arena-auckland-new-zealand-1baa51cc.html

[losing43]

Apologies if this isn’t the best place, but where’s the best place to sell tickets? I was super keen for this after the headliner announcements, but every announcement since has been poor for me. So I’m gonna be selling 2 x Reading Festival weekend tickets, probably for cheaper than retail atm.

 

Such a shame, but I needed maybe 3 / 4 more acts to justify it for me!

[Muppetmark]

20 minutes ago, losing43 said:

Apologies if this isn’t the best place, but where’s the best place to sell tickets? I was super keen for this after the headliner announcements, but every announcement since has been poor for me. So I’m gonna be selling 2 x Reading Festival weekend tickets, probably for cheaper than retail atm.

 

Such a shame, but I needed maybe 3 / 4 more acts to justify it for me!

Either twickets or ticketmaster resale (if you bought on there)