When will covid end ? Please be nice and respectful to others

[BobWillis2]

 

masks definitely work though 🤪🤪

[DeanoL]

2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Loads of people getting sick not so good for the economy either.

But...yeah, working from home definitely hurting some city centre business that rely on office workers, and there are definitely downsides to mass working from home as well as some upsides. Some people prefer it, some really don't. At moment looks like many people are moving to a hybrid where working from a few times a week, that's what I'm doing, but not sure that will last in the long term.

Our company are basically going down the line of "go into the office for meetings, stay home for desk work".

City centre businesses will be impacted for sure but people will still want to put money into the economy. It's just it'll be in different places. Some city centre cafes and gyms will close but more will open in residential areas. I'd expect most runs of little corner shops (y'know, where's there's 5-6 shop, a Nisa and a newsagents and maybe a hairdressers and a chippy) to have a cafe in them by this time next year. It's possible one of the biggies (Costa, Starbucks, Pret) will actively push into that area. 

The demand isn't going away, it's just moving. It's economic disruption, not decline, and that's just how business and the free market works.

[DeanoL]

3 minutes ago, Barry Fish said:

Biggest challenge with hybrid working will be the training and mentoring of junior staff.

This is totally true but it's a challenge that can be overcome. But it'll require effort.

1 minute ago, Barry Fish said:

You keep saying home working has limited impact.  Yet every single call centre / company in general I interact me plays me recorded messages telling me due to the challenges of covid 19 and staff working remotely it may take longer to answer the phone / deal with me issue etc.

I must just be me experiencing this....   or maybe its you with your head in the sand  ?

Oh yeah I do get that. But when I called those same companies pre-COVID I wasn't being spoken to any quicker, it'd just be "due to the high volume of calls at the moment" - weren't you literally saying yesterday that COVID and Brexit are going to be the go-to excuse for everything that's shit for the next decade?

[DeanoL]

1 minute ago, Barry Fish said:

Just thought I would fix that for you 🙂 

Well since we sent all the EU workers home there's a massive job shortage in hospitality anyway so I think the city centre Pret and Pub workers will be okay. And the owners will just re-focus their business elsewhere.

But even without that, the world changes, jobs that existed ten years ago don't exist now and that's always the way. I don't think we should hold back progress because it means jobs go away, especially when it also creates new ones elsewhere, so there's no net reduction. 

Remember when we all Laser Quest and there was one in every town? Should we all have kept playing Laser Quest, even after we realised it was shit, because otherwise the poor people who worked at Laser Quest would be out of a job?

[DeanoL]

3 minutes ago, Barry Fish said:

What role do you work in ?  Because I don't think at this point you work in a professional role.

Junior's learn most from being around more senior members of staff being supported adhockly.  Oh let me show you this, can you tell me about that.  Doing that over zoom is almost impossible.  Its a huge challenge.  I don't think it can be got around to be frank. 

Risk and assurance. Go on, give it your best shot 😄

You're right people won't be able to learn in the exact same ways but that doesn't mean it's not possible. You can foster those sort of environments virtually if you want although that's also not necessarily the best option. But we've had a lot of new team members over the past six months and we've got people up to speed okay. I think it's been more challenging for them but they've not performed any worse.

[DeanoL]

2 minutes ago, Barry Fish said:

I just simply do not believe you.  Example...

Well known Sofa company.  I now have to raise a support ticket and wait for a call back rather than get straight through to someone.  Took them a week to get back to me.  Wasn't like that pre-pandemic.  They have clearly restructured how you get access to the call centre.  No doubt because they are now remote and Sally is picking her kids up now and grabbing the shopping rather than being logged on.

Could be, or could be they laid off half their staff or had them on furlough.

[Fuzzy Afro]

32 minutes ago, DeanoL said:

Our company are basically going down the line of "go into the office for meetings, stay home for desk work".

City centre businesses will be impacted for sure but people will still want to put money into the economy. It's just it'll be in different places. Some city centre cafes and gyms will close but more will open in residential areas. I'd expect most runs of little corner shops (y'know, where's there's 5-6 shop, a Nisa and a newsagents and maybe a hairdressers and a chippy) to have a cafe in them by this time next year. It's possible one of the biggies (Costa, Starbucks, Pret) will actively push into that area. 

The demand isn't going away, it's just moving. It's economic disruption, not decline, and that's just how business and the free market works.

 

This is 100% the correct route to go down. Ive moved all my meetings to the 2 days that I’m in the office. 

[DeanoL]

6 minutes ago, Barry Fish said:

Not sure what you mean give it my best shot.

I was expecting a "how can you be a risk manager when you have no ability to judge risk" or something like that. Letting the side down!

[Fuzzy Afro]

23 minutes ago, Barry Fish said:

From what prospective is it correct ?

I mean don't get me wrong - for me personally I would rather WFH (selfish personal reasons) - but it has consequences and it makes zero difference to the covid situation.

Nothing to do with covid, I’m talking about long term

 

 

There is very limited benefit to going in to an office to sit and work at a desk all day but a lot of benefits to having meetings face to face 

[Crazyfool01]

lets blame the teachers / GPs and Crazyfool ( because I went to a gig ) for the issues around the pandemic .....because you read it in the daily mail or we could blame the twat supposedly in charge of the country when hes not on holiday or missing crucial Cobra meetings 

 

[steviewevie]

 

[BobWillis2]

11 minutes ago, crazyfool1 said:

lets blame the teachers / GPs and Crazyfool ( because I went to a gig ) for the issues around the pandemic .....because you read it in the daily mail or we could blame the twat supposedly in charge of the country when hes not on holiday or missing crucial Cobra meetings 

 

It’s everybody else’s responsibility to make sure I’m safe at all times. 

[Crazyfool01]

Just now, BobWillis2 said:

It’s everybody else’s responsibility to make sure I’m safe at all times. 

ill see what I can do Bob 

[mcshed]

4 hours ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

I could ring up BUPA today, get a private GP appointment on Monday and be referred to see a specialist by the end of the week. Would be waiting months for that level of care on the useless NHS. 

That's not evidence that they'd be more efficient if you transferred the bulk off NHS GPs workload onto them. 

You might be right that the private sector currently has excess capacity so we'd be using it better if more people went private but that is a world away from you saying everyone other than the very low paid should pay £70 a month health insurance as that would be more efficient than paying an extra £70 a month tax and giving that to the NHS.

[Fuzzy Afro]

15 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

 

Ah, the dangerous experiment c**ts are back 

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

Ah, the dangerous experiment c**ts are back 

they never went away, they are in government.

[Fuzzy Afro]

Just now, mcshed said:

That's not evidence that they'd be more efficient if you transferred the bulk off NHS GPs workload onto them. 

You might be right that the private sector currently has excess capacity so we'd be using it better if more people went private but that is a world away from you saying everyone other than the very low paid should pay £70 a month health insurance as that would be more efficient than paying an extra £70 a month tax and giving that to the NHS.

What you need to understand is that the benefit is in the competition in the sector. If you’re paying BUPA £70 a month and you’re not getting good value for it, you’ll simply leave and go to a competitor like vitality. Hike up tax and fund the NHS more and they have zero incentive to provide a good product.

 

 

France and Italy, two comparable European countries, absolutely shit on us for life expectancy and both of them have hybrid public/private healthcare systems. Too many people just hear “private sector” and immediately jump to the conclusion that we’re going to end up like the US charging every Tom, Dick and Harry £20k for an ambulance ride and some medium grade painkillers. 

[steviewevie]

9 minutes ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

What you need to understand is that the benefit is in the competition in the sector. If you’re paying BUPA £70 a month and you’re not getting good value for it, you’ll simply leave and go to a competitor like vitality. Hike up tax and fund the NHS more and they have zero incentive to provide a good product.

 

 

France and Italy, two comparable European countries, absolutely shit on us for life expectancy and both of them have hybrid public/private healthcare systems. Too many people just hear “private sector” and immediately jump to the conclusion that we’re going to end up like the US charging every Tom, Dick and Harry £20k for an ambulance ride and some medium grade painkillers. 

France and Italy both have national health services mostly paid for by state, but not all of it....and nor is it here, prescriptions, dentists etc.

[steviewevie]

In case you missed it.

 

[steviewevie]

burnout

 

[Fuzzy Afro]

21 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

France and Italy both have national health services mostly paid for by state, but not all of it....and nor is it here, prescriptions, dentists etc.

And I want us to have that here.

 

I’m not saying there’s anything wrong with the NHS as it is, I’m just saying too many people are using it. 
 

 

In the UK, 11% of the population have private medical insurance. In Italy it’s almost half and in France it’s nearly two-thirds.

The UK spends about 50% more per head on state healthcare than the other to (€4,500 per person per year compared to €3,000 in those two countries) but the NHS is charged with treating significantly more people than either of those two healthcare systems.

 

Take the UK’s €4,500 per head, but only using it for 89% of the population, suddenly it’s just over €5,000

 

Italy are spending €3,000 per head but only half the population use it. So €6,000 per head.

 

France are also spending €3,000 per head but only 1/3 of people use it. So €9,000 per head.

 

 

Suddenly it’s very easy to see why both these countries have better healthcare systems and better life expectancies than us. They have relatively well funded state healthcare but the middle classes tend to provide for themselves and remove the strain on the system, and suddenly it becomes a much better system for poorer people. 

 

[Fuzzy Afro]

Ultimately, if people are happy to list in NHS waiting lists for months on end then be my guest but I can guarantee you that if you can afford, joining a private medical insurer is one of the best products money can buy. 

[zahidf]

so.... masks and ventilation isn't a silver bullet.

[steviewevie]

1 hour ago, Fuzzy Afro said:

Ultimately, if people are happy to list in NHS waiting lists for months on end then be my guest but I can guarantee you that if you can afford, joining a private medical insurer is one of the best products money can buy. 

I have private health insurance through work and not used it once.

[steviewevie]

42 minutes ago, zahidf said:

so.... masks and ventilation isn't a silver bullet.

need full lockdown