news & politics:discussion

[Guest]

Just now, Crazyfool01 said:

its all guesses ... 

I thought we had a labour lead in the polls .... I know things can move quick but it isnt  happening in this term is it ? lets not have it based on guesses what might happen ? 

No it isn’t happening but I’m saying why I feel changing the Monarchy might not be a good idea. The Tories will use any situation to help their mates and consolidate power so changing the head of state will be another opportunity for them to do so. 

[Crazyfool01]

Just now, Ozanne said:

No it isn’t happening but I’m saying why I feel changing the Monarchy might not be a good idea. The Tories will use any situation to help their mates and consolidate power so changing the head of state will be another opportunity for them to do so. 

no you just dont want a change because you are a fan of the royal family .... I would love a change .... we can base things on what the tories might do forever and not move on  ... that wont ever give us progress lets face it Boris rode rough shot over the queen anyway ... 

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Crazyfool01 said:

no you just dont want a change because you are a fan of the royal family .... I would love a change .... we can base things on what the tories might do forever and not move on  ... that wont ever give us progress lets face it Boris rode rough shot over the queen anyway ... 

No, my concerns would be because of the reasons I’ve stated. I’m not a fan of the Royals, I have no feelings to them either way.

If a new system could allow the Tories to abuse that then we probably shouldn’t go with it. If we could change the current structure and that not be an issue then go for it.

It isn’t hard to see what happens in this country when the Tories have a majority we shouldn’t risk giving them more power. 

Edited September 13, 2022 by Ozanne

[fraybentos1]

9 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

No, my concerns would be because of the reasons I’ve stated. I’m not a fan of the Royals, I have no feelings to them either way.

Did you not say you teared up on Thursday night cause the Queen died?

[Crazyfool01]

1 minute ago, fraybentos1 said:

Did you not say you teared up on Thursday night cause the Queen died?

beat me to it ... was just trying to figure out how to multiquote 

[Neil]

24 minutes ago, Crazyfool01 said:

its all guesses ... 

I thought we had a labour lead in the polls .... I know things can move quick but it isnt  happening in this term is it ? lets not have it based on guesses what might happen ? 

its difficult, as changes to the system will be viewed suspiciously by opponents, like they're trying to change the system to their unfair advantage.

[Crazyfool01]

1 minute ago, Neil said:

its difficult, as changes to the system will be viewed suspiciously by opponents, like they're trying to change the system to their unfair advantage.

yep and that will go both ways it shouldn't be used a reason for it not happening though ... it should be justification for trying to achieve a fairer solution ... maybe through negotiations 

[Guest]

Just now, Crazyfool01 said:

beat me to it ... was just trying to figure out how to multiquote 

Because it’s a sad situation, all the talk of death and a family losing their Gran did make me feel sad. That doesn’t mean I’m a fan of them.

Either way it doesn’t change what I said about changing the head of state which isn’t because of any perceived feelings for the Royals it’s because I feel a new system would be abused. 

[steviewevie]

I think it's a fair argument to suggest we'd have people from political parties standing to be president, and that would mean we could have a tory president more often than not. Whether they had any executive power would have to be in the new constitution, and would be much simpler to keep as is except bin the whole hereditary thing and make it democratic. Then we could finally have Mr Blobby for president.

[Crazyfool01]

4 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

and that would mean we could have a tory president more often than not

and if we had PR or a coalition does the country lean left ?  ( if you could just consider labour as left ) 

[steviewevie]

7 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

Because it’s a sad situation, all the talk of death and a family losing their Gran did make me feel sad. That doesn’t mean I’m a fan of them.

Either way it doesn’t change what I said about changing the head of state which isn’t because of any perceived feelings for the Royals it’s because I feel a new system would be abused. 

yeah, made me sad too. No idea why. Maybe I'm stupid royalist scum. Maybe it is the collective grief thing. Or the loss of some constant thing. Or maybe I was just thinking of my 92 year old Mum. But, it didn't make me happy that's for sure, and it hasn't made me angry either. Kind of just feel a bit removed from it, as if watching from abroad, it is all so archaic and odd, and just waiting for it to end so Kwarteng can tell us about the mega billions we're about to spend but that's ok because Growth.

[fraybentos1]

9 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

 because I feel a new system would be abused. 

Yeah cause the current system isn't abused at all lol

[steviewevie]

6 minutes ago, Crazyfool01 said:

and if we had PR or a coalition does the country lean left ?  ( if you could just consider labour as left ) 

we'd have PR for the presidency?!

[fraybentos1]

4 minutes ago, Crazyfool01 said:

  ( if you could just consider labour as left ) 

you on the wind up CF?😄

[Crazyfool01]

Just now, fraybentos1 said:

you on the wind up CF?😄

its probably more centre than its ever been in my opinion 🙂 

[Guest]

Just now, steviewevie said:

yeah, made me sad too. No idea why. Maybe I'm stupid royalist scum. Maybe it is the collective grief thing. Or the loss of some constant thing. Or maybe I was just thinking of my 92 year old Mum. But, it didn't make me happy that's for sure, and it hasn't made me angry either. Kind of just feel a bit removed from it, as if watching from abroad, it is all so archaic and odd, and just waiting for it to end so Kwarteng can tell us about the mega billions we're about to spend but that's ok because Growth.

I’m sure there were many around the country that were sad over it and don’t really have any feelings towards the Royals. It’s a perfectly normal thing to feel and people should talk about their emotions more. I’m sure there’s plenty of different reasons it made people feel sad.

[Skip997]

Just now, fraybentos1 said:

you on the wind up CF?😄

He's not on a wind up, Labour are no longer a left wing party, nor have they been for a while, they're a centre party.

Sadly under FPTP they're the best alternative to the current government. The Green Party are actually the best choice for government. 

[Crazyfool01]

5 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

we'd have PR for the presidency?!

so therefore not such a high  chance of a tory president ? 

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

we'd have PR for the presidency?!

We wouldn’t necessarily have PR to elect a head of state, that would depend on the people in charge at the time so in theory if this all happened and the Tories were in charge they wouldn’t go for that they would set the system up in their favour. 

[steviewevie]

7 minutes ago, Crazyfool01 said:

so therefore not such a high  chance of a tory president ? 

actually, yes, I'm getting confused...it wold not be based on constituencies/regions etc, just one person one vote.

52% Farage. 48% Mr Blobby.

[steviewevie]

10 minutes ago, Skip997 said:

He's not on a wind up, Labour are no longer a left wing party, nor have they been for a while, they're a centre party.

Sadly under FPTP they're the best alternative to the current government. The Green Party are actually the best choice for government. 

Labour are a coalition, some of it is left wing, some in the centre, and some inbetween somewhere. The current leadership is closer to the centre because they think they need to do that to win power.

[Crazyfool01]

2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

actually, yes, I'm getting confused...it wold not be based on constituencies/regions etc, just one person one vote.

52% Farage. 48% Mr Blobby.

52% max verstappen 48% Lewis Hamilton 

[squirrelarmy]

Just been down a bit of a Wikipedia rabbit hole. The UK is historically one of the most stable countries globally. Every major power has been at war with itself far more recently than this country
 

A lot of that is down to having a strong ruling class. The only times where there has been instability here is when there has been questions asked over who should be in overall control. 
 

I could be thinking in the realms of impossibility here but if we’re going to get rid of the monarchy then parliament should also go too. Might as well have a complete new system that isn’t England/London centric. 
 

More power to the local regions. With a decentralised seat of government. Scrap the political parties as well. 
 

It would still be very messy. 

[steviewevie]

6 minutes ago, squirrelarmy said:

Just been down a bit of a Wikipedia rabbit hole. The UK is historically one of the most stable countries globally. Every major power has been at war with itself far more recently than this country
 

A lot of that is down to having a strong ruling class. The only times where there has been instability here is when there has been questions asked over who should be in overall control. 
 

I could be thinking in the realms of impossibility here but if we’re going to get rid of the monarchy then parliament should also go too. Might as well have a complete new system that isn’t England/London centric. 
 

More power to the local regions. With a decentralised seat of government. Scrap the political parties as well. 
 

It would still be very messy. 

just have anarchy.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, squirrelarmy said:

Just been down a bit of a Wikipedia rabbit hole. The UK is historically one of the most stable countries globally. Every major power has been at war with itself far more recently than this country
 

A lot of that is down to having a strong ruling class. The only times where there has been instability here is when there has been questions asked over who should be in overall control. 
 

I could be thinking in the realms of impossibility here but if we’re going to get rid of the monarchy then parliament should also go too. Might as well have a complete new system that isn’t England/London centric. 
 

More power to the local regions. With a decentralised seat of government. Scrap the political parties as well. 
 

It would still be very messy. 

Imagine the mess we could end up with. We would need consensus from all parts of the country and political spectrum which we wouldn’t get with FPTP. The whole system would need to change it would be the aftermath of Brexit but turned up to 1,000.