Who Will Play Before Radiohead?

[Stokesy10]

7 minutes ago, bennyhana22 said:

Stokesy, you down-voting little tinker!

It's not about who is great enough. It's about the 'moral' qualification, for me. You must understand, I am about as non-Pyramid as it gets, so I try not to be judgmental about its line-up. In RH are just about the only act I can think of (that could reasonably likely be booked...) that would get me to watch a Pyramid headliner. I'm already agonising about my impending banishment from the über-hipster society of never having seen a Pyramid headliner, when I inevitably watch Thom and the lads in June. No, I am quite comfortable with which acts typically grace that iconic stage. All this talk of Lady Ga Ga? Wouldn't watch her if she was playing in my back garden, but I would be delighted for the festival if she played, as she carries pop credibility and would be a great booking, Just in the same way that this year's (for me) vanilla flavoured trio of headliners were an unbelievable festival main stage line-up.

The problem I have with NG is both his self-perception of a musician still producing quality material that matters, and a wide-ranging public support of his ongoing career, both pretty much solely, IMO, as a legacy of past glories and success. Hey, I was at Knebworth (and Murrayfield, Sheffield, Heaton Park etc) and it was amazing. But, and apologies to many friends on these boards, for me it's just like the Stone Roses. Riding on pretty much nothing other than a massive rip-curl of nostalgia. It didn't matter that the Roses' new singles were utter garbage, there'll still be 1000s of bucket-hatted nostalgists who will forgive them that for one last rendition of I Am The Resurrection. For me, listening constantly to new music, there's something a little depressing about how easily pleased we can be, how little the artist has to do to satisfy. I realise I am being an almighty music snob (I never deny that, btw...!), but take one of my favourite ever bands - Sigur Rós. They have meant as much to me as probably any other band in my >40 years of loving music, even to the point of permanently inking that bond on my skin. Do you know what? Since Valtari, and since Kjarten left, they're...not actually very good anymore (in terms of what they now create in their art and, to a degree, their live performances). And that hurts. But I won't be a blind hypocrite and try to convince myself or others that they are incredible just because they previously have been.

It's a toughie.

Anyway, that 's all good!

Ben

Edit: PS - and that you found NGHFB to be "not bad" kind of says it all to me, British vernacular or not!

A wonderfully written article, Benjamin! . I honestly agree with a hell of a lot of what you're saying. I've had very similar conversations with mates about how easily pleased people can be. I wouldn't say this was my case for NGHFB'S first album - I genuinely, fully expected it to be shite, so it was more of a pleasant surprise when it wasn't (in my opinion of course!). 

I think we've all got at least a liiiiitle case of music snobbery, some more than others (myself included in that!).

Oh, and on the subject of Noel running out of stuff after Be Here Now...I actually prefer Dig Out Your Soul 

[swede]

15 minutes ago, bennyhana22 said:

Stokesy, you down-voting little tinker!

It's not about who is great enough. It's about the 'moral' qualification, for me. You must understand, I am about as non-Pyramid as it gets, so I try not to be judgmental about its line-up. In fact, RH are just about the only act I can think of (that could reasonably likely be booked...) that would get me to watch a Pyramid headliner. I'm already agonising about my impending banishment from the über-hipster society of never having seen a Pyramid headliner, when I inevitably watch Thom and the lads in June. No, I am quite comfortable with which acts typically grace that iconic stage. All this talk of Lady Ga Ga? Wouldn't watch her if she was playing in my back garden, but I would be delighted for the festival if she played, as she carries pop credibility and would be a great booking, just in the same way that this year's (for me) vanilla flavoured trio of headliners were an unbelievable festival main stage line-up.

The problem I have with NG is both his self-perception of a musician still producing quality material that matters, and a wide-ranging public support of his ongoing career, both pretty much solely, IMO, as a legacy of past glories and success. Hey, I was at Knebworth (and Murrayfield, Sheffield, Heaton Park etc) and it was amazing. But, and apologies to many friends on these boards, for me it's just like the Stone Roses. Riding on pretty much nothing other than a massive rip-curl of nostalgia. It didn't matter that the Roses' new singles were utter garbage, there'll still be 1000s of bucket-hatted nostalgists who will forgive them that for one last rendition of I Am The Resurrection. For me, listening constantly to new music, there's something a little depressing about how easily pleased we can be, how little the artist has to do to satisfy. I realise I am being an almighty music snob (I never deny that, btw...!), but take one of my favourite ever bands - Sigur Rós. They have meant as much to me as probably any other band in my >40 years of loving music, even to the point of permanently inking that bond on my skin. Do you know what? Since Valtari, and since Kjarten left, they're...not actually very good anymore (in terms of what they now create in their art and, to a degree, their live performances). And that hurts. But I won't be a blind hypocrite and try to convince myself or others that they are incredible just because they previously have been.

It's a toughie.

Anyway, that 's all good!

Ben

Edit: PS - and that you found NGHFB to be "not bad" kind of says it all to me, British vernacular or not!

Love it when people say "I wouldn't watch so and so even if they played in my back garden"......stop lying, if Gaga was playing your back garden you'd be out there like a shot even if you liked them or not.

I cant stand Phil Collins, but id watch a free Phil Collins gig in my own back garden, and my gardens a fucking shit hole !

[russycarps]

20 minutes ago, bennyhana22 said:

Stokesy, you down-voting little tinker!

It's not about who is great enough. It's about the 'moral' qualification, for me. You must understand, I am about as non-Pyramid as it gets, so I try not to be judgmental about its line-up. In fact, RH are just about the only act I can think of (that could reasonably likely be booked...) that would get me to watch a Pyramid headliner. I'm already agonising about my impending banishment from the über-hipster society of never having seen a Pyramid headliner, when I inevitably watch Thom and the lads in June. No, I am quite comfortable with which acts typically grace that iconic stage. All this talk of Lady Ga Ga? Wouldn't watch her if she was playing in my back garden, but I would be delighted for the festival if she played, as she carries pop credibility and would be a great booking, just in the same way that this year's (for me) vanilla flavoured trio of headliners were an unbelievable festival main stage line-up.

The problem I have with NG is both his self-perception of a musician still producing quality material that matters, and a wide-ranging public support of his ongoing career, both pretty much solely, IMO, as a legacy of past glories and success. Hey, I was at Knebworth (and Murrayfield, Sheffield, Heaton Park etc) and it was amazing. But, and apologies to many friends on these boards, for me it's just like the Stone Roses. Riding on pretty much nothing other than a massive rip-curl of nostalgia. It didn't matter that the Roses' new singles were utter garbage, there'll still be 1000s of bucket-hatted nostalgists who will forgive them that for one last rendition of I Am The Resurrection. For me, listening constantly to new music, there's something a little depressing about how easily pleased we can be, how little the artist has to do to satisfy. I realise I am being an almighty music snob (I never deny that, btw...!), but take one of my favourite ever bands - Sigur Rós. They have meant as much to me as probably any other band in my >40 years of loving music, even to the point of permanently inking that bond on my skin. Do you know what? Since Valtari, and since Kjarten left, they're...not actually very good anymore (in terms of what they now create in their art and, to a degree, their live performances). And that hurts. But I won't be a blind hypocrite and try to convince myself or others that they are incredible just because they previously have been.

It's a toughie.

Anyway, that 's all good!

Ben

Edit: PS - and that you found NGHFB to be "not bad" kind of says it all to me, British vernacular or not!

it's depressing how spot on you are about sigur ros

 

[bennyhana22]

 

5 minutes ago, Stokesy10 said:

A wonderfully written article, Benjamin! . I honestly agree with a hell of a lot of what you're saying. I've had very similar conversations with mates about how easily pleased people can be. I wouldn't say this was my case for NGHFB'S first album - I genuinely, fully expected it to be shite, so it was more of a pleasant surprise when it wasn't (in my opinion of course!). 

I think we've all got at least a liiiiitle case of music snobbery, some more than others (myself included in that!).

Oh, and on the subject of Noel running out of stuff after Be Here Now...I actually prefer Dig Out Your Soul 

Cheers, Stokesy. One of the reasons I love festivals, Glastonbury and these 'ere boards is that I rarely get the chance to talk to people about this kind of stuff in my day to day life. In fact, my 15 year old Child 3 is about the only one! And his musical argument belies his tender years. And yes, I'm claiming full credit for that. Taking him to his first proper festival next year (Latitude) and can't wait to spend the weekend just watching his face...!

4 minutes ago, swede said:

Love it when people say "I wouldn't watch so and so even if they played in my back garden"......stop lying, if Gaga was playing your back garden you'd be out there like a shot even if you liked them or not.

I cant stand Phil Collins, but id watch a free Phil Collins gig in my own back garden, and my gardens a fucking shit hole !

Oh swede! Yes, OK, guilty as charged for using an over-used cliché! Btw, I'm firmly in the apart-from-being-a-shit-husband-and-tory-tax-evader-I-don't-mind Phil Collins camp. I know it's often trotted out but, along with Stuart Copeland, he really is one of my all-time favourite drummers. At his peak with Genesis, let's say 1973-1978 he was truly, truly magnificent. If those who hate prog can get past the prog, just watch YouTube live stuff of him at the kit. Wowsers. Because he came from a jazz-type drumming origin, his feel in rock was incredible - à la Copeland.

9 minutes ago, russycarps said:

it's depressing how spot on you are about sigur ros

 

I try not to believe it, russy, and get excited every time I'm due to see them again, but I genuinely feel that we are well beyond their zenith. I've tried to love Kveikur as a body of work, but I just can't. People will hate me for it, but the Phil Collins/Genesis analogy rings so true: All going swimmingly. Lead bloke goes off and makes amazing debut solo album. Comes back and, seemingly, takes a much more active role in songwriting/band direction than previously. Significant band member leaves (I realise that Hackett had left before Face Value and Kjarten after Go, but work with me here...). Band begins slow, inexorable decline, as the magical formula has been irrevocably broken...

Ben x

[bennyhana22]

33 minutes ago, Scruffylovemonster said:

I enjoyed their JPT slot immensely. But then, I had only got into them in the preceding few months and never seen them before. 

And the last thing I would want is to burst someone's first ever SR bubble. They are/were magnificent, scruffy.

I enjoyed them in the JPT too. The setlist was much better than we've had for a couple of years. And seeing them at my now-beloved Glastonbury was a thrill. The only issue I had at that set was with Georg's bass - he alternated basses track by track and one of them was set up badly on the PA and was fuzzy reverting crappy the whole time. Still, every other track was great .

Ben 

[bennyhana22]

39 minutes ago, Scruffylovemonster said:

I think you should have stopped worrying about that as soon as you said you liked be here now.

Just don't get why it's so maligned. Actually, I can - it's because of the absurd hype machine surrounding it, the on sale at midnight thing etc.

Sure it's overblown and some tracks are in desperate need of a producer with the bollocks to tell Noel to get the editing shears out, but other than an occasional track (I'm looking at you Girl in the Dirty Shirt...) they're all sing-along bangers! 

All The Young Dudes riff theft notwithstanding.

On that note, Child 3 was just yesterday remarking at the shameless theft of T-Rex's Get It On riff on Cigs and Alcohol. I have crafted him in my image...

Ben

[Hugh Jass]

7 minutes ago, bennyhana22 said:

Just don't get why it's so maligned. Actually, I can - it's because of the absurd hype machine surrounding it, the on sale at midnight thing etc.

Sure it's overblown and some tracks are in desperate need of a producer with the bollocks to tell Noel to get the editing shears out, but other than an occasional track (I'm looking at you Girl in the Dirty Shirt...) they're all sing-along bangers!

All The Young Dudes riff theft notwithstanding.

On that note, Child 3 was just yesterday remarking at the shameless theft of T-Rex's Get It On riff on Cigs and Alcohol. I have crafted him in my image...

Ben

Do You Know What I Mean and Fade In/Out are pretty good.

All Around The World and magic Pie are musical abominations.

The rest is pretty non-descript.

[russycarps]

I thought stand by me was one of the better songs on that album, still shite though.

 

[russycarps]

1 minute ago, Scruffylovemonster said:

Time has not been kind to Bonehead and the lads.

I'm going to have a curious listen on the way home.

PS have you played the new leonard cohen one? Got a tom waits feel to it.

 

[kalifire]

7 hours ago, bennyhana22 said:

are you fucking joking?!

Nope. But I appreciate the passion of your reply. I happen to enjoy NG's music (although I agree there's something of a dip between Be Here Now and HFB) and I'd love to see him play. I accept that's not going to find agreement with everybody, but I can live with diversity of opinion.

[bennyhana22]

1 hour ago, kalifire said:

Nope. But I appreciate the passion of your reply. I happen to enjoy NG's music (although I agree there's something of a dip between Be Here Now and HFB) and I'd love to see him play. I accept that's not going to find agreement with everybody, but I can live with diversity of opinion.

Hi Kali

I hope you realised that I was only being stoopid in my initial reply to you! Reading my line quoted in your post makes it look aggressive and arsey!

Unreserved apologies if my attempt at being funny misfired (I have form...!)

Ben x

[kalifire]

No drama, Benny. I love you too.

[swede]

I like Be Here Now just for how absurd it is, its like a crap movie you watch just for how absurdly over the top and bad it is. Its also very nostalgic for me as I was 14 when it came out, bought in on the morning of its release and listened to it endlessly.  Just layers upon layers of guitars, a massive wall of noise, although for me Liams voice on this album and tour was the best its ever been. I've enjoyed Noels interviews over the proceeding years regarding the album, saying it was the "sound of 5 men in a room on coke, not giving a fuck", not having a clue more like. He later went on to say it should have been called "Fuck it, that'll do !"

Liam still loves the album whereas Noel thinks it sounds like "Slippery when wet", he has a point, there's guitar solos everywhere on that album, even tracked behind Liams vocals !

Edited November 1, 2016 by swede