Football 2011-2012

[The Nal]

Kuyt and Bellamy?

[eFestivals]

I really dont think Daglish would allow the club to buy a player without his agreement. Even if he was only in the door. Hes too smart for that.

Think it was a mistake by him, brought on by Torres fucking them over late in the day.

I think it's likely that he'd have given his approval ... but that still doesn't make him responsible for it.

I can't remember the timings of things now, so while he might have given his approval it might have been done without him giving it much attention. He'd have had a lot of things to get on top of when he was made manager, and he might have decided that what he was presented with (if he was presented with it of course) had been given the necessary consideration by others, and for him to query it too much might have looked a bit too much like he was trying to undermine others who were already established in their roles ... the fact that he was only temporary at that time might have affected how much he felt he could query things that were being done by others.

All that aside, it seems pretty clear that the amount paid was a rushed decision (whoever's it was). By that point Carroll was the only game in town, and it was pay what Newc were asking or not sign anyone. While with hindsight it's been a very poor decision, they couldn't have known at that time how Suarez would go, or how Kenny would perk things up with the existing players - so getting a replacement for Torres would have been hugely important.

[eFestivals]

corr, what a dreadful dreadful specacle last night's game was.

It was brave of Liverpool to play that second half purely defensively and I didn't think they'd hold out, but with a poor City against them it wasn't as hard as it might have been.

Johnson's lunge: worse than Kompany's? I'd say so by quite a lot, given that he was jumping almost directly at a player.

[The Nal]

Johnson's lunge: worse than Kompany's?

[eFestivals]

credit to Spurs for being right up there with over half the season gone. I can't say I'd have believed they'd keep it up.

Mind you, the window is open and 'Arry can't help but fiddle, so there's a few weeks now where he can blow it.

And then there's 'Arry's court case which starts in about a week. I can't see how he's going anywhere but downnnnnn, so it'll be interesting whether that galvanises the team or they fall apart.

[The Nal]

credit to Spurs for being right up there with over half the season gone. I can't say I'd have believed they'd keep it up.

Mind you, the window is open and 'Arry can't help but fiddle, so there's a few weeks now where he can blow it.

And then there's 'Arry's court case which starts in about a week. I can't see how he's going anywhere but downnnnnn, so it'll be interesting whether that galvanises the team or they fall apart.

Edited January 12, 2012 by The Nal

[eFestivals]

Their next 7-8 games will make or break them. They play City, Liverpool, Toon, Utd, Arsenal and Chelski in those games. City, Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelski all away.

what you mean is if 'Arry's absence for clink doesn't break them first.

I really can't see how he's going to avoid going down. There's no get out of "I misunderstood the tax rules" with the charge he's on, and the revenue appear to have the solid evidence to prove he recieved payments that he didn't declare for tax.

[eFestivals]

And on another note - it just has to be said - how bad was Andy Carroll!? Dear Christ.

to be fair to him he spent most of the game totally isolated, so I'm not sure that any player could have had much more joy.

He should have done better with his shot early on, it was too easy for Hart, but he was trying to fight off Savic at the time which probably affected what he was able to do.

But yeah, still dreadful - spending far too much time being bumped onto his arse for a big guy, far too slow at getting up again, and still able to fall over his own feet without any assistance.

And it seems to be the case that the other players are trying to avoid sending him the ball, knowing it'll just be a waste. If Newc would really cough up £10M to have him back I'd bite their hands off, cos I can only see things getting worse as time goes by.

[lost]

everton rumour - Gibson in / Rodwell out

Edited January 12, 2012 by lost

[The Nal]

And it seems to be the case that the other players are trying to avoid sending him the ball,

[jammy2211]

credit to Spurs for being right up there with over half the season gone. I can't say I'd have believed they'd keep it up.

Mind you, the window is open and 'Arry can't help but fiddle, so there's a few weeks now where he can blow it.

And then there's 'Arry's court case which starts in about a week. I can't see how he's going anywhere but downnnnnn, so it'll be interesting whether that galvanises the team or they fall apart.

[Jaybles]

Interesting that a similar tackle should happen on their very next game.

Johnson was definitely flirting with disaster there.

By the letter of the law one could argue Johnson should have seen red just as much as Kompany. Maybe the only thing saving him in the referee's eyes was that Johnson came in from the side and won the ball without the City player having to move out the way to avoid contact. Still a very dangerous tackle though and it was foolish for Johnson to do it. Both should have seen red.

[eFestivals]

Interesting that a similar tackle should happen on their very next game.

Johnson was definitely flirting with disaster there.

By the letter of the law one could argue Johnson should have seen red just as much as Kompany. Maybe the only thing saving him in the referee's eyes was that Johnson came in from the side and won the ball without the City player having to move out the way to avoid contact. Still a very dangerous tackle though and it was foolish for Johnson to do it. Both should have seen red.

Yep, the City player didn't have to move to avoid contact.

Which was more the case with the Kompany one, because if Nani had frozen the moment that Kompany went for the ball (which Kompany was clearly going to get to first, as happened) then Nani would have been yards away from any possible danger.

The way I see these incidents is that Johnson's was the more dangerous and so more derserving of a red, because Johnson only needed to have made a small error of judgement with his lunge to have got the player.

Whereas with Kompany's there was zero chance of any error of judgement, because there was no player near the ball or able to get near the ball until after Kompany had landed (at which point the danger has gone).

It's not the lunge itself that makes these things deserving of a red - after all, there's no dangerous play in making a lunge like those if no player is is around to be endangered - but the danger a player is put in by the lunge.

If Nani was in any danger then it's danger he chose to put himself in by making a late attempt to get the ball - and late attempts to get the ball like that are fouls in themselves if they make contact with the opposing player.

[5co77ie]

everton rumour - Gibson in / Rodwell out

Edited January 12, 2012 by 5co77ie

[Jaybles]

The way I see these incidents is that Johnson's was the more dangerous and so more derserving of a red, because Johnson only needed to have made a small error of judgement with his lunge to have got the player.

Whereas with Kompany's there was zero chance of any error of judgement, because there was no player near the ball or able to get near the ball until after Kompany had landed (at which point the danger has gone).

[kaosmark2]

Interesting that a similar tackle should happen on their very next game.

Johnson was definitely flirting with disaster there.

By the letter of the law one could argue Johnson should have seen red just as much as Kompany. Maybe the only thing saving him in the referee's eyes was that Johnson came in from the side and won the ball without the City player having to move out the way to avoid contact. Still a very dangerous tackle though and it was foolish for Johnson to do it. Both should have seen red.

[eFestivals]

They coped fine when Arry was away with his heart problems, so I don't see a problem there. I've no idea how long this court case could take him out but I don't think it'd matter in terms of this season - the reality is Spurs just have a better team then the sides below them and they play as a team too. You've been predicting their downfall since the season began but they're now 9 points clear of Arsenal... perhaps they're just better then them?

it's one thing for a manager to take a week or two off for health reason but still be available on the end of the phone if need be (and in the case of 'Arry I'm guessing he was still picking the team), and another thing entirely for the manager to be incommunicardo for several months at least cos he's banged up.

Banged up is what I expect from this court case. HMRC have put their evidence out there, and unless 'Arry is able to clearly demonstrate it's been faked I really can't see how he'll get off .... and if he doesn't get off then he's defo going down cos of what he's charged with.

How much that'll effect Spurs we'll have to wait and see, but I do expect it to effect them, if only a little.

Spurs are defo a better team than I was giving them credit for earlier in the season. But I'm still not convinced it's something they'll maintain for the full season, 'Arry or no 'Arry.

I wouldn't be surprised for Spurs to finish above Arsenal now, particularly now they've got last night's game in hand out of the way. That was one I felt they had a decent chance of dropping points with, cos Everton are nearly always a toughie for just about every team.

I don't see how a few transfers will hurt anything anyway, he'll either get another defender - a position which he's pretty much been rotating between 4 players all season anyway or another striker which they've still looked like they needed at times. No one important is going to leave...

I was going at this from the angle that changes might upset the balance of the team or just the dressing room dynamic. It wouldn't be the first time that 'Arry's tinkering had done those sorts of things.

They have a pretty epic fixture list ahead though, should pick up home wins over Wolves / Wigan but between them they go to the Etihad and February they have Liverpool, Newcastle and Arsenal. I can see them doing well out of them though - the Arsenal one is either side of them playing Milan so I can see Arsenal underperforming.

Given their home form I'd say it's pretty likely that Spurs will drop points against City and L'pool - and if they lose those, and lose to Arsenal (far from impossible for all 3, tho probably won't pan out that way with all three) then that's those nine points gone.

Having said all that, I'm pretty certain that Spurs will get a top-four place (tho that might get upset if others go on a spending spree), but it's not guaranteed just yet. Everything's still there to play for down to Liverpool if not lower than them.

[swede]

to be fair to him he spent most of the game totally isolated, so I'm not sure that any player could have had much more joy.

He should have done better with his shot early on, it was too easy for Hart, but he was trying to fight off Savic at the time which probably affected what he was able to do.

But yeah, still dreadful - spending far too much time being bumped onto his arse for a big guy, far too slow at getting up again, and still able to fall over his own feet without any assistance.

And it seems to be the case that the other players are trying to avoid sending him the ball, knowing it'll just be a waste. If Newc would really cough up £10M to have him back I'd bite their hands off, cos I can only see things getting worse as time goes by.

[eFestivals]

If one of them is a red then they both are. Both defenders come to within inches of contact. Being that close to contact, the way they have tackled makes it too dangerous. Both have left the ground at speed with studs showing.

nah .... Nani ran into the side of Kompany's legs. There was zero danger of Nani getting hit by Kompany's flying feet.

If anything with that one, Nani fouled Kompany with his late challenge.

[kaosmark2]

it's one thing for a manager to take a week or two off for health reason but still be available on the end of the phone if need be (and in the case of 'Arry I'm guessing he was still picking the team), and another thing entirely for the manager to be incommunicardo for several months at least cos he's banged up.

Banged up is what I expect from this court case. HMRC have put their evidence out there, and unless 'Arry is able to clearly demonstrate it's been faked I really can't see how he'll get off .... and if he doesn't get off then he's defo going down cos of what he's charged with.

How much that'll effect Spurs we'll have to wait and see, but I do expect it to effect them, if only a little.

Spurs are defo a better team than I was giving them credit for earlier in the season. But I'm still not convinced it's something they'll maintain for the full season, 'Arry or no 'Arry.

I wouldn't be surprised for Spurs to finish above Arsenal now, particularly now they've got last night's game in hand out of the way. That was one I felt they had a decent chance of dropping points with, cos Everton are nearly always a toughie for just about every team.

I was going at this from the angle that changes might upset the balance of the team or just the dressing room dynamic. It wouldn't be the first time that 'Arry's tinkering had done those sorts of things.

Given their home form I'd say it's pretty likely that Spurs will drop points against City and L'pool - and if they lose those, and lose to Arsenal (far from impossible for all 3, tho probably won't pan out that way with all three) then that's those nine points gone.

Having said all that, I'm pretty certain that Spurs will get a top-four place (tho that might get upset if others go on a spending spree), but it's not guaranteed just yet. Everything's still there to play for down to Liverpool if not lower than them.

[Jaybles]

nah .... Nani ran into the side of Kompany's legs. There was zero danger of Nani getting hit by Kompany's flying feet.

If anything with that one, Nani fouled Kompany with his late challenge.

[eFestivals]

I think Liverpool's activity in the transfer window is the most important. Without any purchases, unless Gerrard's at the form of his life, I could see us nicking 6th off them. If they sign a good striker, I could see them flying up and nicking 3rd off Spurs. I don't think there's any team other than an unimproved Liverpool we could rise above though.

I'm thinking that Liverpool might end up thanking the FA for Suarez's ban - he's not had any time off for years, so might come back very refreshed and start scoring the ones he's been missing.

Newc's continuing success is strongly linked to keeping Ba I reckon .... and if the rumours of a buy out clause are true I can't see how they'll still have him at the end of Jan. The player will agitate for a move if a 'big' club come in for him, and Ashley will take all that pure profit with a big smile.

Liverpool need a goal getter, and there's none better than Ba right now. If they got him and he fitted how they play (I'm not convinced that he necessarily would) then I reckon L'pool could still finish just about anywhere - out of all the teams around the top they're the ones who I see as being able to raise their game the easiest because their defence is so solid while still being able to make chances at the other end. There's also Sturridge, who there's rumours is refusing to sign a new contract.

But there's variables all-round .... who knows what difference Cahill might make to Chelsea (if they get him of course), and if RVP gets injured then Arsenal will probably struggle, and it's quite likely that Spurs are due injuries to one or more of their more important players.

Anything could happen.

[eFestivals]

Nani has to hurdle, if he didn't, he would have been taken out by Kompany. You can clearly see in the GIF that Nani has hurdled with his right leg first over Kompany before he even landed.

nope, completely wrong - check the other camera views, they make it far more clear.

There was zero chance of Nani being taken out by Kompany. Nani was coming in from the side, and arrived at the point where the ball had been a significant amount of time after Kompany's feet had. If Nani hadn't have jumped he'd have fallen over Kompany's knee or upper leg.

Kompany could have only got Nani if Nani had been faster than he was - which was never going to happen.

[kaosmark2]

I'm thinking that Liverpool might end up thanking the FA for Suarez's ban - he's not had any time off for years, so might come back very refreshed and start scoring the ones he's been missing.

Newc's continuing success is strongly linked to keeping Ba I reckon .... and if the rumours of a buy out clause are true I can't see how they'll still have him at the end of Jan. The player will agitate for a move if a 'big' club come in for him, and Ashley will take all that pure profit with a big smile.

Liverpool need a goal getter, and there's none better than Ba right now. If they got him and he fitted how they play (I'm not convinced that he necessarily would) then I reckon L'pool could still finish just about anywhere - out of all the teams around the top they're the ones who I see as being able to raise their game the easiest because their defence is so solid while still being able to make chances at the other end. There's also Sturridge, who there's rumours is refusing to sign a new contract.

But there's variables all-round .... who knows what difference Cahill might make to Chelsea (if they get him of course), and if RVP gets injured then Arsenal will probably struggle, and it's quite likely that Spurs are due injuries to one or more of their more important players.

Anything could happen.

[eFestivals]

Biting time? That was a pretty extended break.

I'd forgetten about that. How long did he get?

My hope is that Spurs aren't technically a Champs Lge club yet, nor Liverpool so neither could trigger the rumoured buy-out clause.

I don't think anything I've read about the clause has said it only applies to Chumps League clubs, but perhaps that's how it is. It makes sense on one level, but not so much when a player has come in on a free.

Sturridge would be a fantastic signing for Liverpool, but I just can't see it. Chelsea are shipping out their other strikers, so unless they decide to not worry about FFP and go for Hulk or someone expensive, I can't see who they'll sign.

yeah, I don't think Sturridge is too likely for L'pool either - I'd have thought that if they were going to get him they'd have got him last summer as part of the Meirelese (sp?) sale. Then again, if he feels that Chelsea are on the slide (presumably the reason why he won't sign a new contract) and Liverpool are on the up, who knows?