UK Politics

[steviewevie]

I know Burnham is the saviour of the left, and as a labour supporter I hope he gets in because at the moment at least he seems to be the only one anyone actually likes...but his manchesterism thing is just kind of blairism, business friendly with higher public spending. And maybe that's what the country needs, but never call it blairism of course. It has done well for growth, but it's not good for everyone, and it isn't really that left wing.

(he might be a bit blue labourish too, but let's see).

[pink_triangle]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

Well, there must be some pressure on Starmer to both state that he will stand down within a certain time, and that he wouldn't block Burnham standing as an MP. But, still think he'll just say he's going nowhere and will stumble on till next crisis finishes him completely. I don't know why he'd want to carry on, can't be fun...but maybe he likes the power etc.

At the end of the day you will have loads of Labour MPs looking at losing their seats and making the calculation on who is more likely to help them keep them. Whether they agree with his politics or like him as a person will likely be irrelevant. My view is Labour has been too London focussed for years and a move away from that would be something I would support. As I said I would be fine with Nandy, but she doesn’t seem to have a support base.

 

As a natural Labour supporter I just want to see something a bit more inspirational. I find the Starmer, Reeves, Reed, Mahmood etc just suck any positivity away. I know things are sh*t, I don’t need Polanski and Farage promising the moon on a stick, but some positivity would be good.

[pink_triangle]

19 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

I know Burnham is the saviour of the left, and as a labour supporter I hope he gets in because at the moment at least he seems to be the only one anyone actually likes...but his manchesterism thing is just kind of blairism, business friendly with higher public spending. And maybe that's what the country needs, but never call it blairism of course. It has done well for growth, but it's not good for everyone, and it isn't really that left wing.

(he might be a bit blue labourish too, but let's see).

The funny thing is if you look at his voting record he is no more left than Starmer, but he knows how to play the game and say what people want to hear. 

[steviewevie]

Tories don't seem bothered that they also have done really badly.

[steviewevie]

6 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

At the end of the day you will have loads of Labour MPs looking at losing their seats and making the calculation on who is more likely to help them keep them. Whether they agree with his politics or like him as a person will likely be irrelevant. My view is Labour has been too London focussed for years and a move away from that would be something I would support. As I said I would be fine with Nandy, but she doesn’t seem to have a support base.

 

As a natural Labour supporter I just want to see something a bit more inspirational. I find the Starmer, Reeves, Reed, Mahmood etc just suck any positivity away. I know things are sh*t, I don’t need Polanski and Farage promising the moon on a stick, but some positivity would be good.

yep to all of this.

Also, I think people need to stop going on about Change, without saying what this Change actually is...where we're actually heading. Starmer kept using it in the lead up to the election, but in the end it was meaningless.

[steviewevie]

These election results don’t mean tacking left or right, but delivering for the whole country | Keir Starmer | The Guardian

[lazyred]

31 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Tories don't seem bothered that they also have done really badly.

They aren't  the story today but they must be worried. 6 shadow cabinet members have seats in Essex which is now reform. Still as it stands they'll be in Govt with Reform.There are also reports they think they have a chance at winning the London Mayor. 

[lazyred]

10 hours ago, sheffinghell said:

South Yorkshire not looking too clever either. Rotherham didn't vote this time, but would have gone the same way. Barnsley fell good and proper, and Doncaster took a big hit last time. We've picked up 13 Reform in Sheffield, but even though the Labour leader lost his seat we still have a 3-way progressive coalition, this time with added Greens. It's not too desperate for now, but next year might feel a lot more precarious. 

 

I'm saddened by what is happening, and don't know how we get things back on an even keel.Reform led councils are certainly not the answer to the woes many are facing. 

 

In my heart it feels time for a switch to PR, at least then there's an opportunity for fragmented progressives to work together as a stronger group. Whatever, it's going to a massive struggle.

It's just bad luck they were all full council elections. The seats round Manchester from Rochdale to Wigan would have gone the same way as well. I reluctantly agree about PR, it's the only way with 5/6 parties. 

It is sad, as others said some of them like Barnsley were making the best of a bad situation and starting to turn things around. I feel the same about Calderdale and Bradford, and the towns like Dewsbury or Mirfield. I don't want them to go back to sh*t to prove Reform aren't the answer

[sheffinghell]

A friend has also pointed out that turnouts were interesting this time. Very high for locals in areas where a Reform threat was perceived and unwelcome. Much lower in some areas that went to Reform.

 

Also agree with point made on councils that had an all out poll this time - for some of them it was very bad luck. Also, sadly wonder whether it will scupper Barnsley's bid for Town of Culture, where I think they have been a strong contender.

[steviewevie]

 

[steviewevie]

 

[TheSheriff]

3 hours ago, steviewevie said:

Can't pronounce his name, but this bloke seems like he knows what he's doing, if I was in Wales I would have voted Plaid Cymru too. I wish him good luck, he has to somehow make a positive difference now.

 

I voted Plaid for the first time and I’m over the moon, I’ve been leaning more towards independence the last few years especially after what they done with Corbyn and trying to do with Zack. I’d rather get away from the Westminster bubble 

[steviewevie]

One of the Green candidates who was arrested for antisemitism has been elected to Lambeth council.

[sheffinghell]

Meanwhile in Sheffield we have this charmless Reform guy elected for Woodhouse 

 

Sheffield politicians call for Reform UK to drop candidate for extremist views https://share.google/AEucS05XOP8tx3lJo

[pink_triangle]

34 minutes ago, TheSheriff said:

I voted Plaid for the first time and I’m over the moon, I’ve been leaning more towards independence the last few years especially after what they done with Corbyn and trying to do with Zack. I’d rather get away from the Westminster bubble 

What are they trying to do with Zack?

[steviewevie]

pulling out the big guns

 

apparently Brown has been appointed as Special Envoy on Global Finance and Cooperation...something to do with UK having chairmanship of the G20 in 2027 and Brown is a bit of a G20 big boy and has some plans to sort it out after Trump has f**ked it all up.

Also...makes Starmer look like proper PM bloke and above all the political shite going on.

[kaosmark2]

2 hours ago, pink_triangle said:

At the end of the day you will have loads of Labour MPs looking at losing their seats and making the calculation on who is more likely to help them keep them. Whether they agree with his politics or like him as a person will likely be irrelevant. My view is Labour has been too London focussed for years and a move away from that would be something I would support. As I said I would be fine with Nandy, but she doesn’t seem to have a support base.

 

As a natural Labour supporter I just want to see something a bit more inspirational. I find the Starmer, Reeves, Reed, Mahmood etc just suck any positivity away. I know things are sh*t, I don’t need Polanski and Farage promising the moon on a stick, but some positivity would be good.

I liked Nandy before she got her current job, but she clearly views culture secretary as a punishment role, and doesn't do her job there. I'd argue the current climate of media, AI, social media, and social dissonance is actually a time that a talented and inspiring politician would use this brief as a platform to be a leader and to manage this. Her utter disinterest has completely put me off her.

 

Starmer putting an article today out about "not tacking left or right, just delivering", I think it's far far too late. You can't lose 1400/2400 and stick around.

 

I do agree about wanting something inspirational though. The McSweeney strategy of "WE'LL CRACK DOWN ON THOSE FILTHY MIGRANTS AND PUNISH THE DISABLED (we're not reform vote us to stop reform)" isn't working, and Starmer is now intrinsically associated with that message. Even the good things Labour have done (workers rights and renters rights acts) they've been unable to get messaging out and acclaim for.

 

I have zero respect or trust in Burnham btw. I think he's almost as much a charlatan as Polanski. He's failed to get the Labour leadership twice before, and his acclaim has come from going into the Manchester mayor job at a time when it was given huge funding to invest in public transport. I also remember how many times he flip-flopped and vote-chased in the previous 2 Labour leadership campaigns, saying nice things he thought one group wanted to hear then the exact opposite to another group the next day. But he's got just enough distance from the cabinet while still being a recognisable name that he's not tainted by the hate speech.

[pink_triangle]

5 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

 

 

I have zero respect or trust in Burnham btw. I think he's almost as much a charlatan as Polanski. He's failed to get the Labour leadership twice before, and his acclaim has come from going into the Manchester mayor job at a time when it was given huge funding to invest in public transport. I also remember how many times he flip-flopped and vote-chased in the previous 2 Labour leadership campaigns, saying nice things he thought one group wanted to hear then the exact opposite to another group the next day. But he's got just enough distance from the cabinet while still being a recognisable name that he's not tainted by the hate speech.

I don’t disagree with any of that, but it comes down to who can win the most seats in a general election for Labour and I’m struggling to be persuaded  by another name. He seems to me the only one who can win votes from the green and reform.

[kaosmark2]

19 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

I don’t disagree with any of that, but it comes down to who can win the most seats in a general election for Labour and I’m struggling to be persuaded  by another name. He seems to me the only one who can win votes from the green and reform.

I think my preference would be Rayner backed by Miliband. And while I agree Labour has been far too London-centric for the past 15 years, I have more time/respect for Sadiq Khan (as a non-Londoner) than Burnham if they were to elevate a mayor. Lammy I think is excellent and while I don't think he'd get the former Corbyn acolytes back from Greens, I do think he'd get the "I'm upset with Starmer's racist pandering but kinda want to still vote Labour" bloc back. There's a handful of smaller names I like and would trust if they were to run but I don't think they have the name recognition and I'm less sure if they have the ambition/desire either.

 

I don't think you're wrong though, Burnham is the obvious choice in terms of having some actual momentum of popularity. The NEC blocking him standing as a MP last time will also give him some "anti-establishment" credentials. 

[steviewevie]

Starmer talking about giving people hope and helping young people out of poverty whilst Chris Mason keeps reminding him that no one likes him.

[pink_triangle]

36 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

I think my preference would be Rayner backed by Miliband. And while I agree Labour has been far too London-centric for the past 15 years, I have more time/respect for Sadiq Khan (as a non-Londoner) than Burnham if they were to elevate a mayor. Lammy I think is excellent and while I don't think he'd get the former Corbyn acolytes back from Greens, I do think he'd get the "I'm upset with Starmer's racist pandering but kinda want to still vote Labour" bloc back. There's a handful of smaller names I like and would trust if they were to run but I don't think they have the name recognition and I'm less sure if they have the ambition/desire either.

 

I don't think you're wrong though, Burnham is the obvious choice in terms of having some actual momentum of popularity. The NEC blocking him standing as a MP last time will also give him some "anti-establishment" credentials. 

At the end of the day it’s pragmatism for me. I would be fine with Rayner and Milliband, but it would be electoral suicide. 
 

To me if the choice is Burnham or Farage it’s an easy choice.

[TheSheriff]

1 hour ago, pink_triangle said:

What are they trying to do with Zack?

The constant smears in the press

[steviewevie]

Rayner must be f**ked off that the soft left are all getting behind Burnham and not her, especially when it would be a lot easier for her to take over. 

[steviewevie]

can you guess where the liberal metropolitan elite live?

[pink_triangle]

1 hour ago, TheSheriff said:

The constant smears in the press

That sounds very similar to what supporters of Farage and Trump say whenever there is any scrutiny of the leader, however considering I view Farage and Polanski as different sides of the same coin that doesn’t surprise me.

 

My view is that it is absolutely correct our media scrutinise a leader who is in charge of a party over 10 percent in the polls , they could have a say in the next government, so it’s right that the electorate knows what they are voting for, at the same time that person has the right to reply. Are you saying the media shouldn’t report things like his past claims in relation to hypnosis and breast enlargement. To me that raises questions about intelligence and integrity.