UK Politics

[Neil]

15 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

Even if they did get rid of NI, that money is still going to come from elsewhere. They can't just get rid of tens of billions of tax revenue and not rejig things.

True the rejig might be end state  pensions 

[steviewevie]

 

[Ryan1984]

Sunak was on Jeremy Vine’s show and couldn’t handle any line of questioning.

[Ozanne]

 

[kaosmark2]

7 hours ago, Nobody Interesting said:

Now that media and others are talking about merging NI and Income Tax I have rethought my support for it.

Not only would pensioners be worse off as they do not pay NI but do pay Income Tax but in all the discussions not much if anything has been talked about on the Employers NI part.

If they merge the taxes, ie scrap NI, then businesses stop paying this but it is not replaced unless a new tax is added. Seems a great way to get business off the tax hook and put more on people already struggling....... like the Tories like to do.

Then you get the 'qualifying years' for State Pension, how would that work?

Don't get me wrong, I would like one simple tax but to get to that the entire system needs starting again otherwise if will create a right old mess and likely the poorest will take the burden.

Employers NI is a bit of a double-edged sword though, and already has some obnoxious work-arounds. Notably, a huge number of employers - both small businesses and giant ones - do the "you're not my employee, you're a self-employed contractor", to get around employer's contributions to NI, and a bunch of workers rights stuff. It's been prominent in the media about zero-hours contracts, or about uber/deliveroo, but I'd explicitly say that virtually everywhere that tries to get around the employer's NI contributions is kind of doing so already.

PAYE isn't the same thing for Gen Z and many millennials as for others - so many people are self-employed and doing their own tax calculations in the same way as in the USA. 

I do agree with the concept of what you're saying - don't let businesses off the hook for their tax contributions - but it's already happening and if scrapping NI overall would come with a wider reform of how the tax system works - I think it could definitely be done as a good thing.

Ofc, I also think Universal Credit is a good idea, making all benefits assessed and paid in combination - but the way the Tories implemented it was a cruel one that came with brutal cuts and left the poorest worst off. So even if it should be a good-thing long-term, there's many that would suffer from that transition - and they're already often the poorest amongst society and a natural target of Tory goverments.

[Nobody Interesting]

46 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

Employers NI is a bit of a double-edged sword though, and already has some obnoxious work-arounds. Notably, a huge number of employers - both small businesses and giant ones - do the "you're not my employee, you're a self-employed contractor", to get around employer's contributions to NI, and a bunch of workers rights stuff. It's been prominent in the media about zero-hours contracts, or about uber/deliveroo, but I'd explicitly say that virtually everywhere that tries to get around the employer's NI contributions is kind of doing so already.

PAYE isn't the same thing for Gen Z and many millennials as for others - so many people are self-employed and doing their own tax calculations in the same way as in the USA. 

I do agree with the concept of what you're saying - don't let businesses off the hook for their tax contributions - but it's already happening and if scrapping NI overall would come with a wider reform of how the tax system works - I think it could definitely be done as a good thing.

Ofc, I also think Universal Credit is a good idea, making all benefits assessed and paid in combination - but the way the Tories implemented it was a cruel one that came with brutal cuts and left the poorest worst off. So even if it should be a good-thing long-term, there's many that would suffer from that transition - and they're already often the poorest amongst society and a natural target of Tory goverments.

Tories do have some good ideas but sadly their first thought is how can we 'save' or 'make' money out of it rather than is it helpful to people who need help

[steviewevie]

😒

[steviewevie]

They should do an emergency thingy like they did with covid with sexy Paul Johnson and even sexier Torsten Bell giving some cold hard truths...

and maybe for balance you could get some David Frost expertise.

Edited March 7 by steviewevie

[Nobody Interesting]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

😒

 

36 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

They should do an emergency thingy like they did with covid with sexy Paul Johnson and even sexier Torsten Bell giving some cold hard truths...

and maybe for balance you could get some David Frost expertise.

Every day that goes by I see the gap between the two main parties get smaller and smaller and in time it will vanish all together if it has not already.

[steviewevie]

Just now, Nobody Interesting said:

 

Every day that goes by I see the gap between the two main parties get smaller and smaller and in time it will vanish all together if it has not already.

that's what Labour want you to think...that's what the Tories really don't

[Nobody Interesting]

3 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

that's what Labour want you to think...that's what the Tories really don't

Labour want me to think they are the Tories!!!

If that is true then the UK is f**ked.

A pretty much two party state with two parties that are nigh on the same.

So glad I am not young.

[steviewevie]

5 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

Labour want me to think they are the Tories!!!

If that is true then the UK is f**ked.

A pretty much two party state with two parties that are nigh on the same.

So glad I am not young.

that appears to be their strategy...like the tories but more competent. Seems to be working too according to the polls, but not sure how long that strategy will last.

I love being young.

[gizmoman]

6 hours ago, steviewevie said:

The cutting of NI and freezing of the personal allowance is their solution to the "Triple Lock Problem". They can't scrap the triple lock, it's too politically costly, they can't keep it either without changes as it's too costly financially and getting worse each year as more boomers retire. By freezing the allowance until the basic state pension catches up (£12570 pa) they ensure poor pensioners who only have the state pension aren't affected. All other pensioners are then taxed on ALL their non-state income, currently 20% but soon to rise as income tax and NI are "merged", may well end up at 30% or so. The upshot is the richer pensioners will be paying for the poorer pensioners.

[Ozanne]

If the last 24 hours has taught us anything it’s that the Tories will steal Labours economic plans them so those plans will be wrecked. So Labour should now not make any more of those plans public right up until an election campaign/manifesto launch, which means we’ll get a load not committals on what they’ll do now. 

[steviewevie]

lovely

 

[steviewevie]

[Neil]

5 hours ago, Nobody Interesting said:

 

Every day that goes by I see the gap between the two main parties get smaller and smaller and in time it will vanish all together if it has not already.

shame you don't  see  yourself using the campaigning slogan for the kippers??

[Neil]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

your never going to get the kippers to admit, they don't know what they're talking about.

[Ozanne]

 

[Ozanne]

 

[steviewevie]

42 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

 

it's just getting silly now.

[steviewevie]

 

[steviewevie]

Anarchy in the UK

 

[kaosmark2]

5 hours ago, steviewevie said:

 

It's absolutely batshit, considering the horrendous sh*t she spouted and culture she created while Home Secretary, that we would now talk about her as a "moderate Tory".

Evil, evil woman, and still somehow better than a lot of them.

[Neil]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

Anarchy in the UK

 

Now an immigrant in the USA