Football 16-17

[mjsell]

8 minutes ago, ThomThomDrum said:

Not the same thing IMO, by a long way. BM have got to the final 3 times in the last 7 years, winning it once and going out in the semis 3 of the other years. No top club expects to win it every year in reality, but to get to the semis 6 out of the last 7 years would be viewed as achieving expectations IMO.

Arsenal going out in the last 16 every year for the last 7 has got to hurt. Qualifying for it every year but coming up with the same result for such a protracted period of time must be infuriating. 

Although I get your point, you mention that teams have an expectation of where they should be getting in the CL (you say Bayern semis - which is realistic). But in that case Arsenal's expectations of achievement should probably be Quarters. Of those 7 years of last 16, 5 of them we were knocked out by teams that have a higher expected finish than us (3 Bayern, 2 Barca). The only 2 years you could question our CL exit is 2015 against Monaco and 2012 against Milan. And yes maybe our performances in the group stages could have helped us avoid some of those last 16 fixtures (not this year), but I think it is easy and lazy to simply say Arsenal have failed because of only getting to the last 16 for 7 straight seasons.

[pink_triangle]

52 minutes ago, zahidf said:

7 potential new arsenal managers

http://www.football365.com/news/studying-seven-potential-new-arsenal-managers

Of those names I would probably only take Allegri. While Simeone has been a success, I suspect Arsenal fans may not enjoy the style of football. It could easily end up the same lack of trophies with less enjoyable football. Whoever is the new manager they will likely still have the same issue which is 3 clubs outspending them at the domestic level.

[mjsell]

17 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

Of those names I would probably only take Allegri. While Simeone has been a success, I suspect Arsenal fans may not enjoy the style of football. It could easily end up the same lack of trophies with less enjoyable football. Whoever is the new manager they will likely still have the same issue which is 3 clubs outspending them at the domestic level.

Allegri is not that much different. Defense first priority then look at improving going forward - although that might just be the italian league in general. The thing that puts me off Allegri is the fact he has never coached outside of Italy (but then the same coud have been said for Conte)

To be honest getting a coach that prioritses defence will be the best way for Arsenal to try and win trophies again. Wenger has only ever built 1 good defence in his 20 years (that of the invincibles)

 

My biggest hope would be to try and prise Löw away from Germany - but I cant see that being a possiblity until after 2018 world cup.

Edited March 8, 2017 by mjsell

[sdvruxk]

Alonso clearly won the ball. How that decision is even being debated is silly. 

Not seen the Bayern one so can't comment. 

[zahidf]

3 hours ago, eFestivals said:

if you watched the game you'll know it could have easily turned out that way.

And while I'd say Arsenal were run out before Bayern scored, when they did score it's not really surprising that Arsenal collapsed as they did, with ten men, and where the chance of turning round the tie had gone.

I don't think the scoreline from last night says very much about where Arsenal are.

it was the heaviest two legged defeat in the champs league by an english club ever though. And arsene blaming the ref and saying the players played well isnt going to make the fans happy...

[mjsell]

3 minutes ago, zahidf said:

it was the heaviest two legged defeat in the champs league by an english club ever though. And arsene blaming the ref and saying the players played well isnt going to make the fans happy...

Did you watch the game?

[ThomThomDrum]

1 hour ago, mjsell said:

 but I think it is easy and lazy to simply say Arsenal have failed because of only getting to the last 16 for 7 straight seasons.

Im not saying Arsenal have failed (to the contrary) . Im trying to explain the frustrations of a lot of their supporters. Other than last year when bloody Leicester won the league! Arsenal have finished 3/4th in the previous 10 years and as mentioned, in the last 7 years gone out of the CL in the last 16. The same results year in year out gets boring and frustrating with fans (even when, if what they are doing, is achieving what the majority of teams in the PL would love to achieve), hence why Wengers is under this pressure. Its too long of a period to have this level of "success" without any progress at all. His sin is achieving and sustaining a "boring" level of success over a long period of time but not being able to build on it. 

[pink_triangle]

13 minutes ago, zahidf said:

it was the heaviest two legged defeat in the champs league by an english club ever though. And arsene blaming the ref and saying the players played well isnt going to make the fans happy...

Im not sure that really matters in a knockout competition. A penalty elimination or a 9 goals elimination, the end result is exactly the same.

[pink_triangle]

7 minutes ago, ThomThomDrum said:

Im not saying Arsenal have failed (to the contrary) . Im trying to explain the frustrations of a lot of their supporters. Other than last year when bloody Leicester won the league! Arsenal have finished 3/4th in the previous 10 years and as mentioned, in the last 7 years gone out of the CL in the last 16. The same results year in year out gets boring and frustrating with fans (even when, if what they are doing, is achieving what the majority of teams in the PL would love to achieve), hence why Wengers is under this pressure. Its too long of a period to have this level of "success" without any progress at all. His sin is achieving and sustaining a "boring" level of success over a long period of time but not being able to build on it. 

What is amazing about Arsenal is the level of consistency. I havent gone into any season in the last 10 years expecting Arsenal to win the league, so am not going to criticize them too much for failing to be champions. However I would have expected them to go closer. However at the same time I would have expected the odd season of underachieving to result in a 5/6 finish.

[eFestivals]

36 minutes ago, sdvruxk said:

Alonso clearly won the ball. 

nope, he didn't even touch it.

New eyes needed.

[mjsell]

Just now, eFestivals said:

nope, he didn't even touch it.

New eyes needed.

He definitely did touch it.

[eFestivals]

34 minutes ago, zahidf said:

it was the heaviest two legged defeat in the champs league by an english club ever though. And arsene blaming the ref and saying the players played well isnt going to make the fans happy...

heavy defeats happen, particularly when a team is that good and you only have ten men.

And whatever the fans might be thinking, Wenger is right to a degree. Arsenal were superb in the first half - tho they needed the chances they had to go in - and both of the two big decisions the ref made might have gone the other way on another day, so I can see why he's not a fan of them.

(you can argue about whether the ref called them right or not, but they were both the sort of decisions which might have been called differently whatever the actual happenings were).

[eFestivals]

3 minutes ago, mjsell said:

He definitely did touch it.

goal kick, wasn't it?

[eFestivals]

7 minutes ago, mjsell said:

He definitely did touch it.

just found it on youtube ... and you're right.

[mjsell]

1 minute ago, eFestivals said:

just found it on youtube ... and you're right.

 

5 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

goal kick, wasn't it?

Yeah it was a corner. If it had been given against me I would have gone mental. The debate was around can you still give away a foul when getting a slight touch on the ball? Which is one of those that outside the box the answer is yes, inside the box its pretty unlikely.

[TheGayTent]

2 hours ago, eFestivals said:

Hmmmm.... just about a home match for Spurs, too, if that happens. 

Shouldn't be allowed.

Semi Finals shouldn't be played at Wembley, but it wouldn't be anything like a home game if it were to happen - or indeed were it the final. 

Edited March 8, 2017 by TheGayTent

[DavisO89]

[sdvruxk]

8 minutes ago, mjsell said:

 

Yeah it was a corner. If it had been given against me I would have gone mental. The debate was around can you still give away a foul when getting a slight touch on the ball? Which is one of those that outside the box the answer is yes, inside the box its pretty unlikely.

Yeah a foul can be given even if there is a touch. But in this case, Walcotts not getting the ball even if Alonso doesn't touch him. His touch changed the direction of the ball. 

Keown calling it a stonewall penalty was pathetic. 

[eFestivals]

7 minutes ago, TheGayTent said:

Semi Finals shouldn't be played at Wembley, but it wouldn't be anything like a home game if it were to happen - or indeed were it the final. 

next season it defo will be.

[mjsell]

1 hour ago, sdvruxk said:

Yeah a foul can be given even if there is a touch. But in this case, Walcotts not getting the ball even if Alonso doesn't touch him. His touch changed the direction of the ball. 

Keown calling it a stonewall penalty was pathetic. 

Im fairly confident that Alonso's tackle would be given as a foul more often than not if its in the middle of the pitch.

[TheGayTent]

5 hours ago, eFestivals said:

next season it defo will be.

No it won't 

[eFestivals]

23 minutes ago, TheGayTent said:

No it won't 

I thought they were playing all home games at wembley next season?

[pink_triangle]

I don't know what I was thinking when I put £10 on Barcelona to qualify at 12/1 last night, but I'm glad I thought it!

[mungo57]

That takes the total piss.

I took the liberty of turning the match off when PSG scored but wish I hadn't now. Checked just before Barca scored their 5th and by the time I managed to find the remote and put the match back on they'd scored again.

Move over Liverpool vs AC Milan that has to be the best comeback ever seen in football.

Complete and total piss take.

Emerys face was a right picture.

[mungo57]

5 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

I don't know what I was thinking when I put £10 on Barcelona to qualify at 12/1 last night, but I'm glad I thought it!

Lol great shout that mate