UK Politics

[xxialac]

1 hour ago, lost said:

 

Just seen you can get a 3 year savings bond at 5%. Can't remember the last time savings rates started with a 5.

3 years a hell of a long time to lock up money. If your circumstances change, you will be heavily penalised for withdrawing if you can withdraw at all.

[xxialac]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

I'd argue that Johnson had that ability...in his own style.

I was more tentative on him but still ultimately no.

 

After all he grew up with this most entitled life possible and a plummy voice and acting like a jumped up Bertie Wooster and zero clue how it might feel to be working class, having never mingled with any such people. 

I guarantee at Eton he would have been calling them plebs often enough to build up contempt for working class people. 

 

There's only so much you can fake..  

[steviewevie]

38 minutes ago, xxialac said:

I was more tentative on him but still ultimately no.

 

After all he grew up with this most entitled life possible and a plummy voice and acting like a jumped up Bertie Wooster and zero clue how it might feel to be working class, having never mingled with any such people. 

I guarantee at Eton he would have been calling them plebs often enough to build up contempt for working class people. 

 

There's only so much you can fake..  

Maybe, but people liked him...

[steviewevie]

But when it comes to actually saying things and not just making people laugh Burnham is definitely very good...no notes too...he's up there with Blair and peak Cameron.

[xxialac]

15 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Maybe, but people liked him...

 

His buffoon act was popular but he could not communicate normally with ordinary people, having spent his entire life with the most extreme privilege.

[steviewevie]

4 minutes ago, xxialac said:

 

His buffoon act was popular but he could not communicate normally with ordinary people, having spent his entire life with the most extreme privilege.

I agree with all that except that he could not communicate with ordinary people, I think he could pretty well. He made them laugh, he was a bit of fun, they liked him. He made people feel optimistic and hopeful. That's why he was at the forefront of both the brexit and 2019 election campaigns. Not sure leave would have won that referendum without him on board.

[xxialac]

And of course it was all a massive act. Look at his father, a nasty piece of work if ever there was one.

 

Behind closed doors, Boris was completely different.

 

Hell, he wasn't even called Boris!

[steviewevie]

2 minutes ago, xxialac said:

And of course it was all a massive act. Look at his father, a nasty piece of work if ever there was one.

 

Behind closed doors, Boris was completely different.

 

Hell, he wasn't even called Boris!

Well yeah...but I don't know..he actually had a bit of a complicated up bringing...dad was a bit of a twat to the family and so he's not really that close to him, his mum having mental health problems and breakdowns which is ultimately why he ended up in boarding school. I have read that is actually quite introverted and the whole Boris thing is an act, but he was pretty good at it...until he inevitably f**ked up when in office. 

[xxialac]

Just now, steviewevie said:

Well yeah...but I don't know..he actually had a bit of a complicated up bringing...dad was a bit of a twat to the family and so he's not really that close to him, his mum having mental health problems and breakdowns which is ultimately why he ended up in boarding school. I have read that is actually quite introverted and the whole Boris thing is an act, but he was pretty good at it...until he inevitably f**ked up when in office. 

 

Introverted, I've heard it all now 🙂

 

He was the definition of an extrovert, constantly craving attention and the validation of others.

 

He was in the most elite club for extroverts (aka the most arrogant elite) called Pop and the Bullingdon Club at Eton.

 

And he ended up in an elite boarding school in the same way as his father did. To give him the maximum foot up in life.

 

 

[steviewevie]

47 minutes ago, xxialac said:

 

Introverted, I've heard it all now 🙂

 

He was the definition of an extrovert, constantly craving attention and the validation of others.

 

He was in the most elite club for extroverts (aka the most arrogant elite) called Pop and the Bullingdon Club at Eton.

 

And he ended up in an elite boarding school in the same way as his father did. To give him the maximum foot up in life.

 

 

privately an introvert, publicly an extrovert.

 

Bring back Boris.

[steviewevie]

Anyway, my point was he was a good communicator, even to "ordinary people".

[xxialac]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

privately an introvert, publicly an extrovert.

 

Bring back Boris.

Yes, bring back the true man of the people, Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson, humble father of Lara Lettice, Cassia Peaches, Theodore Apollo, Milo Arthur, Pops and Wilf.

[lost]

32 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Bring back Boris.

 

The funny thing is, as you say the working class public didn't care about all the posh/elite labels that people tried to damage him with. It's whom ever the guy is who came up with the phase "Boris Wave" that’s probably ended his career.

Edited 7 hours ago by lost

[steviewevie]

9 minutes ago, lost said:

 

The funny thing is, as you say the working class public didn't care about all the posh/elite labels that people tried to damage him with. It's whom ever the guy is who came up with the phase "Boris Wave" that’s probably ended his career.

it was covid and partygate that did it for him. 

I guess the Boris Wave meant he didn't stand a chance coming back, not with the direction that the Tories started to go in.

[steviewevie]

Yeah, I don't think ordinary people or working class or salt of the earth or great unwashed or whatever that riffraff is called mind posh people, Blair was pretty posh and they liked him, Starmer wasn't posh (although that Sir thing confused things) and they all thought he was a proper dickhead. Farage is posh, they like him, and they liked Boris. Burnham went to Cambridge to study English and he likes poetry the posh c**t but everyone thinks he's a proper good bloke.

[xxialac]

7 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

it was covid and partygate that did it for him. 

I guess the Boris Wave meant he didn't stand a chance coming back, not with the direction that the Tories started to go in.

That and the cost of living crisis. In the end a million crises would have kept him in power, had he maintained his popularity.

 

[lost]

14 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

 not with the direction that the Tories started to go in.

 

I think even Starmer stood there and said it wasn't an accident, it was by design, a failed experiment in open borders and risked us becoming an island of strangers. When even labour were positioning themselves well to the right of Boris you knew he was done.

Edited 6 hours ago by lost

[steviewevie]

8 minutes ago, lost said:

 

I think even Starmer stood there and said it wasn't an accident, it was by design, a failed experiment in open borders and risked us becoming an island of strangers. When even labour were positioning themselves well to the right of Boris you knew he was done.

and then so was Starmer.

[mattiloy]

2 hours ago, steviewevie said:

But when it comes to actually saying things and not just making people laugh Burnham is definitely very good...no notes too...he's up there with Blair and peak Cameron.

Agree, funnily enough, I went in to the 2015 Labour Party leader elections thinking to vote Burnham, had never heard of Corbyn beforehand. I saw both him and Burnham speak and went for Corbyn, as did everyone else.

 

Burnham needed his time in Manchester. He wasn’t the guy back then, lacked the conviction in his own positions, presumably because they weren’t his- he was a product of Westminster. Whats interesting about this version of him, perhaps because of that experience and the subsequent time back up home actually doing stuff and meeting normal people- is that the thing that he ’has’ is a sort of honesty and straight forwardness, at least in communication, and that is very much the thing that attracted so many to Corbyn in 2015. I’d go as far to say that 2026 in terms of political persona Andy Burnham is as much created by Corbynism as Blairism - and because of that, he will have broader appeal. It seems from the polls like he’s already clipping polanskis wings.

Edited 6 hours ago by mattiloy

[steviewevie]

Its easy to get carried away, they've had a good first two weeks...but they haven't actually done anything of any substance yet. Early signs are good, but this autumn could be tricky.

[steviewevie]

e.g.

Burnham promises ‘pragmatic’ approach to North Sea oil and gas | Fossil fuels | The Guardian

[xxialac]

5 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

e.g.

Burnham promises ‘pragmatic’ approach to North Sea oil and gas | Fossil fuels | The Guardian

Bonkers.

 

A half baked plan to involve a little more drilling on existing licences is not going to change anyone in the UK's energy bills.

[steviewevie]

6 minutes ago, xxialac said:

Bonkers.

 

A half baked plan to involve a little more drilling on existing licences is not going to change anyone in the UK's energy bills.

I don't think it will make much difference to bills, or actually the climate, or hopefully our net zero strategy, but it will help some industries and it will keep some unions happy and it will raise some more tax revenues maybe.

But, what it does do is send a bad message to the rest of the world, yes we're not the biggest contributor to global carbon emissions, we're not even close...but we are a big contributor to the changing climate that we're living through now, and I think we owe it to show that we're are still making an effort, because everyone needs to. But, it does feel like there's a lot of pushback, you hear a lot more about adaption rather than mitigation,,,which when you consider the summer has is kind of mad, but then maybe everyone could just go live on Antarctica in 50 years time.

Also though...there is a counter argument that with our geographical position and that we're the last to stop using gas but the first to stop producing, maybe we need to balance that a bit more, like get off gas quicker and also keep digging a bit longer.

[xxialac]

38 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

I don't think it will make much difference to bills, or actually the climate, or hopefully our net zero strategy, but it will help some industries and it will keep some unions happy and it will raise some more tax revenues maybe.

But, what it does do is send a bad message to the rest of the world, yes we're not the biggest contributor to global carbon emissions, we're not even close...but we are a big contributor to the changing climate that we're living through now, and I think we owe it to show that we're are still making an effort, because everyone needs to. But, it does feel like there's a lot of pushback, you hear a lot more about adaption rather than mitigation,,,which when you consider the summer has is kind of mad, but then maybe everyone could just go live on Antarctica in 50 years time.

Also though...there is a counter argument that with our geographical position and that we're the last to stop using gas but the first to stop producing, maybe we need to balance that a bit more, like get off gas quicker and also keep digging a bit longer.

It will add a pathetically small amount to tax revenues.

It will help a pathetically small number of industries (and modestly).

 

And yes, it makes no difference to bills and, as you say, the climate except it weakens our ability to influence others.

 

It's far from sure Burnham will even do it, perhaps one to kick down the road and hope that Trump and Farage f**k off.

 

 

[lazyred]

3 hours ago, steviewevie said:

privately an introvert, publicly an extrovert.

 

Bring back Boris.

We're getting lLevelling up and a Social Care levy

Edited 4 hours ago by lazyred