UK Politics

[fraybentos1]

2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

They send their kids to private schools because the best universities and the best jobs in business/science/arts/politics are full of people who went to private schools.

Yeah sure but the choice is likely between a great state school in a lovely area or private. I totally get what you're saying its just a personal preference but even if I was minted there's no way I ever would.

[fraybentos1]

2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

like...

The public cost of private schools: rising fees and luxury facilities raise questions about charitable status (theconversation.com)

Furthermore, they can claim 25% of all donations received (such as chancellor Rishi Sunak’s donations to his old school, Winchester College, which reportedly exceed £100,000) from the tax authorities in gift aid.

 

This is a disgrace

[pink_triangle]

22 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

What's the actual evidence for this? I highly doubt this transpires.

 

Genuinely perplexes me that people send their kids to private school, I went to one of the best state schools in Scotland (lucky, I know) and if you can afford to live in the catchment area then a decent amount will also be able to afford school fees but many choose not to cause the state school is good.

 

And you might say , 'well not all state schools are good and some are dumps' but people who could go to private school don't tend to live in areas with poor state schools from my experience. It may be different in England where you have grammar schools etc I dunno

I am generally against private schools and would be happy if they got rid of them all. However I do worry the best state schools would effectively run as private schools and the money would just go into increased housing prices for those who can afford to live in those areas

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, fraybentos1 said:

Yeah I've seen stuff like this. What people say they will do and what actually happens is a different matter.

 

It's like when before we had a minimum wage people said we can't have this, it's unaffordable and businesses will go under. Yet here we are. 

 

Why the f**k shouldn't they pay VAT. Please spare me the charitable status drivel cause its total pish.

 

Fine, and I wouldn't argue but if you do so, you have to take the consequences of having to fork out extra funds to accomodate the extra pupils in the state sector. A possible quarter of a million pupils is more than just two or three in each school.
It's just an example of Labour's politics of envy with a vacumn of ideas of how to deal with the consequences.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

I am generally against private schools and would be happy if they got rid of them all. However I do worry the best state schools would effectively run as private schools and the money would just go into increased housing prices for those who can afford to live in those areas

 

Correct  - parents who can just about to pay for private education now, but won't in the future can easily get their kids into the best state schools by offering to invest funds into those schools in exchange for a place thereby depriving another pupil of the opportunity to attend.

[pink_triangle]

15 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

I actually would have preferred Faiza Shaheen to stand rather than Abbott...not sure what Abbott can actually contribute whereas Shaheen seemed smart, keen etc. May not have been super loyal but wouldn't be grumbling about everything like Abbott does.

The thing is Shaheen doesn’t have a national profile so the political calculation is different. My view is Abbott is a bit useless, but her past means she is kept when she is a bit past her sell by date.

 

I think it’s the right decision by Starmer, sometimes you have to know which battles to fight and when to retreat. If he becomes PM there will be  loads of similar incidents and he won’t always get it right.

[steviewevie]

If you actually want to do something about inequality in this country then bin private schools. Raise taxes on higher incomes and wealth and have a better state school system. Yes a state school that is considered successful means house prices rise in that area, but then you divert more funding in underperforming schools.

[steviewevie]

2 minutes ago, pink_triangle said:

The thing is Shaheen doesn’t have a national profile so the political calculation is different. My view is Abbott is a bit useless, but her past means she is kept when she is a bit past her sell by date.

 

I think it’s the right decision by Starmer, sometimes you have to know which battles to fight and when to retreat. If he becomes PM there will be  loads of similar incidents and he won’t always get it right.

yeah, ok...I'm not really thinking or caring about the national profile or how this is for Starmer, just that she would be a far better contributor to parliament and maybe government than Abbott.

[steviewevie]

just feels like Starmer's boys or whatever they're called were getting a bit gun ho macho with their de-selection thing on Tuesday or whenever this was and now there's a lot of bad vibes running through Labour. 

[fraybentos1]

12 minutes ago, Ommadawn said:

A possible quarter of a million pupils is more than just two or three in each school.

There is no way this amount is happening.

 

13 minutes ago, Ommadawn said:

It's just an example of Labour's politics of envy

Have you seen the current Labour Party's policy platform? It's hardly politics on envy stuff. 

 

 

[pink_triangle]

5 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

yeah, ok...I'm not really thinking or caring about the national profile or how this is for Starmer, just that she would be a far better contributor to parliament and maybe government than Abbott.

Yes completely agree with you there. Abbott feels like she is just there at this point, while you feel Shaheen could have been an interesting voice.

[fraybentos1]

Here's a quote from Michael Gove about this from 2017. Michael f**king Gove 

 

Writing in the Times in 2017, Gove said: “Private school fees are VAT exempt. That tax advantage allows the wealthiest in this country, indeed the very wealthiest in the globe, to buy a prestige service that secures their children a permanent positional edge in society at an effective 20% discount. How can this be justified?”

[steviewevie]

 

[Guest]

I wonder if Starmer would be Labour leader if he hadn't had a private education?

[lazyred]

11 minutes ago, Ommadawn said:

I wonder if Starmer would be Labour leader if he hadn't had a private education?

Just pointing out it was a state grammar school when he started and went private during his time there. He didn't have to pay fees. He would probably have gone to the same university and become a lawyer if it stayed a grammar school.

[fraybentos1]

20 minutes ago, Ommadawn said:

I wonder if Starmer would be Labour leader if he hadn't had a private education?

It was a grammar school which changed to a private school while he was there

[Guest]

1 minute ago, fraybentos1 said:

It was a grammar school which changed to a private school while he was there

 

So he had a private education then.

 

[fraybentos1]

2 minutes ago, Ommadawn said:

 

So he had a private education then.

 

Yeah I'm sure if it had stayed a grammar school he'd be destitute right now and working at Morrison's part time

[steviewevie]

Just shows you need a private education to succeed.

Scrap private education.

[steviewevie]

 

[steviewevie]

 

[steviewevie]

 

[steviewevie]

 

[mattiloy]

5 hours ago, steviewevie said:

 

I hate the concept of parachuting. But, whilst I dont always agree with Torsten Bell (particularly recent focus on ’productivity’, where productivity is just wages/hours, and since unions are neutered and automation has increased big time, the so called productivity gap is more a reflection of the system giving more of the spoils to the owners of capital than it is to do with the workers being more unskilled) he is generally more sympathetic to newer ideas. Hopefully he gets a treasury job.

Edited May 31, 2024 by mattiloy

[Neil]

5 hours ago, fraybentos1 said:

And you might say , 'well not all state schools are good and some are dumps' but people who could go to private school don't tend to live in areas with poor state schools from my experience. It may be different in England where you have grammar schools etc I dunno

the number of remaining grammar schools is so tiny (they're statistically insignificant). catchment areas for schools don't work like they used to, but i think its still the case that the more prosperous families move into the catchment area for the best schools.