London riots

[5co77ie]

Red Ken talking sense on Newsnight

[lost]

Okay, I'm fairly sure I read in the paper that those youth services in Tottenham had already closed - just trying to see what I can dig up on youth services cuts in London, Birmingham etc this year.

Whole of Connections gone

[feral chile]

As has been said, social imbalance is unquestionably adding fuel to this fire (poor choice of words I accept). But this has f**k all to do with politics. Burning down parliament or the Olympic stadium would be defendable if not something that I would condone personally, but burning down people's homes and family businesses is f**king disgusting.

Here's a political idea. End the war in Libya, and in exchange, send the people responsible for arson to serve out their sentences in Libyan prisons.

Edited August 8, 2011 by feral chile

[feral chile]

Just to get this clear, are you condoning these riots?

[brighteyes]

Are there any circumstances where the government are allowed to make public sector cuts, and the public not get all pissy about it?

If you're made redundant from your job at a private sector company, you don't petrol bomb their head offices. I don't understand this idea that the public sector is responsible for providing a set/increasing number of jobs, no matter how inefficient and uneconomical the service is, or the state of the economy. Government workers going on strike because of a tiny change to their pensions - how dare the government make any change to their incredibly generous benefit packages. Poor, disaffected youth, not knowing if they have a future or where their next meal will come from, co-ordinating rioting via their Iphones.

People just like complaining. Also, they're selfish and greedy, and don't tolerate losing out anymore.

[5co77ie]

Even so, I think its unlikely the population will believe those involved have gone from making jam down the youth club to help OAP charity days to smashing and stealing stuff in a few months.

[5co77ie]

Are there any circumstances where the government are allowed to make public sector cuts, and the public not get all pissy about it?

If you're made redundant from your job at a private sector company, you don't petrol bomb their head offices. I don't understand this idea that the public sector is responsible for providing a set/increasing number of jobs, no matter how inefficient and uneconomical the service is, or the state of the economy. Government workers going on strike because of a tiny change to their pensions - how dare the government make any change to their incredibly generous benefit packages. Poor, disaffected youth, not knowing if they have a future or where their next meal will come from, co-ordinating rioting via their Iphones.

People just like complaining. Also, they're selfish and greedy, and don't tolerate losing out anymore.

[grumpyhack]

5co77ie in this thread is almost as bad as the tools on my facebook that have compared what's happening in London to the Arab Spring

[Snufflebutt]

Even so, I think its unlikely the population will believe those involved have gone from making jam down the youth club to help OAP charity days to smashing and stealing stuff in a few months. As I said to paint this as a failure of government policy over the last 20 years I think will only fuel the arguments made by the BNP and similar groups.

[metallimuse]

Haven't read this thread yet but my first reaction and thoughts from the little I know is,and this may not be an 'educated' comment,the riot on Saturday may be considered loosely political in my eyes as it started off with good intentions and a point but decended into anarchy as mob mentality set in.Everything that has followed is chavs and thugs using that incident as an excuse to cause chaos.Little twats thinking they are 'bad man' and street gangsters.Fools.

[5co77ie]

Are there any circumstances where the government are allowed to make public sector cuts, and the public not get all pissy about it?

If you're made redundant from your job at a private sector company, you don't petrol bomb their head offices. I don't understand this idea that the public sector is responsible for providing a set/increasing number of jobs, no matter how inefficient and uneconomical the service is, or the state of the economy. Government workers going on strike because of a tiny change to their pensions - how dare the government make any change to their incredibly generous benefit packages. Poor, disaffected youth, not knowing if they have a future or where their next meal will come from, co-ordinating rioting via their Iphones.

People just like complaining. Also, they're selfish and greedy, and don't tolerate losing out anymore.

[5co77ie]

Haven't read this thread yet but my first reaction and thoughts from the little I know is,and this may not be an 'educated' comment,the riot on Saturday may be considered loosely political in my eyes as it started off with good intentions and a point but decended into anarchy as mob mentality set in.Everything that has followed is chavs and thugs using that incident as an excuse to cause chaos.Little twats thinking they are 'bad man' and street gangsters.Fools.

[feral chile]

Are there any circumstances where the government are allowed to make public sector cuts, and the public not get all pissy about it?

If you're made redundant from your job at a private sector company, you don't petrol bomb their head offices. I don't understand this idea that the public sector is responsible for providing a set/increasing number of jobs, no matter how inefficient and uneconomical the service is, or the state of the economy. Government workers going on strike because of a tiny change to their pensions - how dare the government make any change to their incredibly generous benefit packages. Poor, disaffected youth, not knowing if they have a future or where their next meal will come from, co-ordinating rioting via their Iphones.

People just like complaining. Also, they're selfish and greedy, and don't tolerate losing out anymore.

[5co77ie]

this explains it all:

[Ed209]

No, he's stating what he thinks is the real cause. That's not the same as condoning.

[zero000]

There seems to be a lot of people (such as Ken Livingstone), who are all too keen to blame these riots on spending cuts carried out by the Tory government.

The riots started out as a well meaning protest about the shooting of an unarmed man (though the facts surrounding this are incredibly sketchy at this point). This then turned into a riot in Tottenham and spread through London. If it's politically motivated why are they robbing/looting/burning innocent peoples houses and businesses? That is simply inexcusable.

[Snufflebutt]

Genuine question, did looting play a large part in the riots of the 80s? Bit young to remember....

Edited August 8, 2011 by Snufflebutt

[feral chile]

There seems to be a lot of people (such as Ken Livingstone), who are all too keen to blame these riots on spending cuts carried out by the Tory government.

The riots started out as a well meaning protest about the shooting of an unarmed man (though the facts surrounding this are incredibly sketchy at this point). This then turned into a riot in Tottenham and spread through London. If it's politically motivated why are they robbing/looting/burning innocent peoples houses and businesses? That is simply inexcusable.

Edited August 8, 2011 by feral chile

[brighteyes]

You need to research your facts before posting unsubstantiated claims.

Myths

More Myths

[5co77ie]

I also think this is political. However I don't see at as direct political action or politically motivated, but instead a symptom of political policy and social inequality that stretches back over many years.

[feral chile]

Genuine question, did looting play a large part in the riots of the 80s? Bit young to remember....

[5co77ie]

Genuine question, did looting play a large part in the riots of the 80s? Bit young to remember....

Edited August 8, 2011 by 5co77ie

[zero000]

I haven't seen what Ken Livingstone's said, but certainly on here people are saying that the spending cuts might have resulted in social discontent that led to rioting, which is not quite the same thing as saying they're politically motivated.

[Ed209]

Not all bad, reckon there'll be some good bargins on ebay tomorrow

[feral chile]

Which are the unsubstantiated claims? Those are just my opinions. I'm not sure how your links are relevant to my example - the pensions strike one was Welsh Assembly, I should have specified.

Edited August 8, 2011 by feral chile