UK Politics

[steviewevie]

 

[steviewevie]

I guess a reminder that twitter does not reflect the real world...although this was kind of just before the whole Abbott thing...

 

[Neil]

3 hours ago, steviewevie said:

 

that sort of dealing is probably pretty standard, from any party leader.

(a deal for abbott to go quietly is a good idea, if abbot could have stuck to the deal)shes a dinosaur of decreasing relevance (and her letter showed that her thinking is stuck long ago in the past). Thanks to her efforts over the years, society has moved on and there's a better understanding of racism than she displayed in that letter.

[steviewevie]

26 minutes ago, Neil said:

that sort of dealing is probably pretty standard, from any party leader.

(a deal for abbott to go quietly is a good idea, if abbot could have stuck to the deal)shes a dinosaur of decreasing relevance (and her letter showed that her thinking is stuck long ago in the past). Thanks to her efforts over the years, society has moved on and there's a better understanding of racism than she displayed in that letter.

Yes and maybe that was the deal anyway until someone leaked that she was being barred from standing to The Times.

Edited June 2, 2024 by steviewevie

[steviewevie]

Greens -10

 

[Neil]

2 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Yes and maybe that was the deal anyway until someone leaked that she was being barred from standing to The Times.

someone who's name starts with'd' i'd guess.

[steviewevie]

17 minutes ago, Neil said:

someone who's name starts with'd' i'd guess.

Nah it would have been someone that The Times trusted with this info...

[steviewevie]

 

[kaosmark2]

10 hours ago, LJS said:

They are 20 points ahead in the polls, but still seem to think they haven't been tory enough. He's starting to make Tony Blair look like a radical  Socialist.

 

Blair was willing to argue for the societal benefit of things. We got a minimum wage, surestart, new schools, new transport infrastructure. He was willing to promise hope. He was a league ahead of Starmer.

 

These twats only promise hate. I'm done with thinking there's any hope for the Labour party improving society. Starmer is too busy playing dogwhistle politics and enabling hatespeech.

 

A human rights lawyer who will attack human rights at home and abroad.

 

It's disgraceful.

[Neil]

only thing which would do for trump in the usa would be if he came out as gay!

[Neil]

3 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

 

Blair was willing to argue for the societal benefit of things. We got a minimum wage, surestart, new schools, new transport infrastructure. He was willing to promise hope. He was a league ahead of Starmer.

 

These twats only promise hate. I'm done with thinking there's any hope for the Labour party improving society. Starmer is too busy playing dogwhistle politics and enabling hatespeech.

 

A human rights lawyer who will attack human rights at home and abroad.

 

It's disgraceful.

Blair had the serious studied politician of brown behind him, seems like starmer understands power but not politics.

[lazyred]

1 hour ago, Neil said:

that sort of dealing is probably pretty standard, from any party leader.

(a deal for abbott to go quietly is a good idea, if abbot could have stuck to the deal)shes a dinosaur of decreasing relevance (and her letter showed that her thinking is stuck long ago in the past). Thanks to her efforts over the years, society has moved on and there's a better understanding of racism than she displayed in that letter.

I agree with the above except I think it was Labour not Abbott who broke the deal. They couldn't resist pushing the Change message and briefing she was finished. Also why wait until the election is called before restoring the  whip? She could have been selected by the local party and still stood down now. It looks like she is going to make them endorse her before she stands down.

[Neil]

38 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Greens -10

 

the activists that article speaks of, have moved out of mummy's and now live in a caravan  between ikea and the dump, so might not even get a vote.

[steviewevie]

3 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

 

Blair was willing to argue for the societal benefit of things. We got a minimum wage, surestart, new schools, new transport infrastructure. He was willing to promise hope. He was a league ahead of Starmer.

 

These twats only promise hate. I'm done with thinking there's any hope for the Labour party improving society. Starmer is too busy playing dogwhistle politics and enabling hatespeech.

 

A human rights lawyer who will attack human rights at home and abroad.

 

It's disgraceful.

agree it is a bit sh*tty (and disingenuous as net migration was forecast to come down anyway)...but...well...bluntly...immigration is still an important issue for a lot of people...you can continue to argue they're wrong, or just give them something.

[kaosmark2]

3 minutes ago, Neil said:

Blair had the serious studied politician of brown behind him, seems like starmer understands power but not politics.

 

It's "the cost of everything and the value of nothing" politics. Reeves has, in the past, made the emotional, principled argument for economic policies. She's stopped that now, and I suspect this is from briefings by Starmer and his closest allies.

[Neil]

Just now, kaosmark2 said:

 

It's "the cost of everything and the value of nothing" politics. Reeves has, in the past, made the emotional, principled argument for economic policies. She's stopped that now, and I suspect this is from briefings by Starmer and his closest allies.

in the past reeves was working with a mythical future, where the outcome of her policies always worked as hoped, and where there was slack in the numbers to find money for investment.

[kaosmark2]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

agree it is a bit sh*tty (and disingenuous as net migration was forecast to come down anyway)...but...well...bluntly...immigration is still an important issue for a lot of people...you can continue to argue they're wrong, or just give them something.

 

It's not a bit sh*tty. It's a disgrace. It was bad enough when he was fence-sitting, but I've suffered two racist assaults in the past two years, and unsurprisingly, the racist shitbirds that fill the police weren't interested. These won't go down in the statistics even though I ended up in A&E for one of them. I know others who've had similar experiences, and this is on top of the official rises.

 

This isn't just "a bit sh*tty", this is enabling f**king racist assaults up and down the country. There's been plenty of red lines that have made me leave the party, not vote for them etc, but now I feel I have to actively campaign against the f**king Labour party for the safety of myself and others.

 

f**k them.

[steviewevie]

6 minutes ago, Neil said:

Blair had the serious studied politician of brown behind him, seems like starmer understands power but not politics.

I think the big difference is Blair had been a politician for a lot longer. But also, Starmer is mostly following advice, I don't think he actually had much to do with this Abbott decisions, all coming from McSweeney and co...and there's some really factional revenge sh*t going on with that lot.

 

[kaosmark2]

Just now, Neil said:

in the past reeves was working with a mythical future, where the outcome of her policies always worked as hoped, and where there was slack in the numbers to find money for investment.

It's not about the slack in the numbers, it's that she's stopped making arguments of principle and only arguments of economics. Even about the exact same policies.

[lazyred]

10 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

 

Blair was willing to argue for the societal benefit of things. We got a minimum wage, surestart, new schools, new transport infrastructure. He was willing to promise hope. He was a league ahead of Starmer.

 

These twats only promise hate. I'm done with thinking there's any hope for the Labour party improving society. Starmer is too busy playing dogwhistle politics and enabling hatespeech.

 

A human rights lawyer who will attack human rights at home and abroad.

 

It's disgraceful.

Blair, Brown and Cameron all continually promised to bring down legal migration. Brown even said British Jobs for British Workers at one point. None of them meant it. They couldn't stop migration from  the EU but actually they didn't  want to. Their policy for all of them  was to use migration to keep low wages and flexible employment. At least Blair compensated with tax credits and extra funds for certain areas.

[Neil]

5 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

I feel I have to actively campaign against the f**king Labour party for the safety of myself and others.

i get why you're saying that, but when the only other outcome will be tories, its not a great idea if you want something better than the tories.

[steviewevie]

Just now, kaosmark2 said:

 

It's not a bit sh*tty. It's a disgrace. It was bad enough when he was fence-sitting, but I've suffered two racist assaults in the past two years, and unsurprisingly, the racist shitbirds that fill the police weren't interested. These won't go down in the statistics even though I ended up in A&E for one of them. I know others who've had similar experiences, and this is on top of the official rises.

 

This isn't just "a bit sh*tty", this is enabling f**king racist assaults up and down the country. There's been plenty of red lines that have made me leave the party, not vote for them etc, but now I feel I have to actively campaign against the f**king Labour party for the safety of myself and others.

 

f**k them.

ok ok. sorry to hear about your experience, that is truly terrible...but there should be a way to talk about immigration without provoking racism...because for some people, normally those on lower income scales, higher immigration does have an impact.

 

[steviewevie]

Here is Starmer and his Sun article...if you dare...

 

sets out two things...first that bosses who pay less than minimum wage will not be able to hire from abroad, and with training sectors applying for foreign worker visas must first train British people. Not sure how that works. They have that sort of thing in other countries? I know they do in Canada.

 

[kaosmark2]

1 hour ago, Neil said:

i get why you're saying that, but when the only other outcome will be tories, its not a great idea if you want something better than the tories.

I no longer believe Labour will be better than the Tories though.

[steviewevie]

2 minutes ago, Nobody Interesting said:

 

and when the good old British people who have not yet wanted to do the jobs immigrants do hence we have immigrants doing them what then when the good old British people still don't want to do them?

You can't make someone like wiping the arses of old folk and looking after them and if you think you can ask yourself, would you like to be looked after by someone who simply did not want to look after you?

 

You think people coming in from abroad like wiping old people's arses?

Basically need to improve pay and conditions if want to get British people doing it