news & politics:discussion

[Neil]

14 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

they can blame the boe and Russia for inflation going up and take the credit for when it comes down.

Not sure many people will be listening though, it's not as if prices will immediately come down and everything will be rosy, they will just stop rising so much and we'll have to wait for incomes to catch up..

won't be listening to labour either, so it'll be a hard sell for labour to win.

[Guest]

33 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

I've argued against the triple lock before. I think that was an inevitable bad not a positive. The fact that some cuts will fall on defence for the first time in forever (since 80s?) Is good.

No it won't, but I'd still prefer they do a budget that's decent for the country over their own political gain.

We went over the triple lock a few weeks back but I think that’s a good result as is benefits being raised with inflation. However public sector workers are being shafted which isn’t good, we should be able to increase their pay with inflation too.

I think I saw that due to real terms spending being cut it’ll essentially mean NHS workers are left with 1-2% pay rises which isn’t good enough. 

[fraybentos1]

5 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

 

I think I saw that due to real terms spending being cut it’ll essentially mean NHS workers are left with 1-2% pay rises which isn’t good enough. 

What would Labour offer?

[Guest]

First bit of polling done after the budget. 

[cellar]

2 hours ago, steviewevie said:

they can blame the boe and Russia for inflation going up and take the credit for when it comes down.

Not sure many people will be listening though, it's not as if prices will immediately come down and everything will be rosy, they will just stop rising so much and we'll have to wait for incomes to catch up..

Absolutely this... the forecast in the OBR report suggests that RHDI is still over 1% lower than pre-pandemic levels by 27/28. Its going to be a rough time, and regardless of who is in power or what policies are put in place, people are going to be understandably worried.

[Ryan1984]

Despite all those front pages, The Scum are still broadly supportive - “our readers say we’re worse off but there’s no other way”.

[Guest]

Another post budget poll. 

[kaosmark2]

8 hours ago, steviewevie said:

it's keeping it at 2% isn't it or is that tbd?...not the 3% hoped for by Wallace and promised by Truss, and at a time when there's an increased chance of larger scale war in europe...but yeah, priorities are elsewhere at moment...and war war is stupid as Boy George once sung.

If there's a world war, is the 0.5% that's the practical difference going to make a difference? I doubt it. I'd argue Brexit hurts our ability to hold our own internationally more than any defence "cuts" now. Fact is, spending on public services that have been cut to the bone is more important right now, as long as we meet Nato commitments.

[kaosmark2]

8 hours ago, Ozanne said:

We went over the triple lock a few weeks back but I think that’s a good result as is benefits being raised with inflation. However public sector workers are being shafted which isn’t good, we should be able to increase their pay with inflation too.

I think I saw that due to real terms spending being cut it’ll essentially mean NHS workers are left with 1-2% pay rises which isn’t good enough. 

I think benefits being raised with inflation is good, I still think the triple lock is an outdated Gideon invention designed to buy the pensioner vote, that fundamentally redistributes wealth upwards rather than downwards.

Public sector workers should be getting more, but this is the most progressive budget since the last time Labour were in power, and the tories aren't even getting any acclaim for it!

[steviewevie]

2 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

I think benefits being raised with inflation is good, I still think the triple lock is an outdated Gideon invention designed to buy the pensioner vote, that fundamentally redistributes wealth upwards rather than downwards.

Public sector workers should be getting more, but this is the most progressive budget since the last time Labour were in power, and the tories aren't even getting any acclaim for it!

They had to look credible to the markets because we're now in the developing world, and there is fuck all left to cut.

[steviewevie]

In terms of taxes this was kind of new labour. I guess that's as progressive as we get. But, next 2 to 5 years are fucked, and not sure anything is going to feel particularly progressive.

[kaosmark2]

1 hour ago, steviewevie said:

They had to look credible to the markets because we're now in the developing world, and there is fuck all left to cut.

Defence and pensions is what's left to cut. They've been ring-fenced for 12 years.

 

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, kaosmark2 said:

Defence and pensions is what's left to cut. They've been ring-fenced for 12 years.

 

Yeah well politically hard to cut either of those at moment.

[kaosmark2]

4 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

Yeah well politically hard to cut either of those at moment.

It's always hard to cut the vote-winners. It's always hard to implement tax rises.

Either those things need to be cut, or more tax rises introduced or both, unless we want every other public service to keep declining.

[steviewevie]

5 minutes ago, kaosmark2 said:

It's always hard to cut the vote-winners. It's always hard to implement tax rises.

Either those things need to be cut, or more tax rises introduced or both, unless we want every other public service to keep declining.

I mean, we could actually do things to try and grow the economy so don't need to cut things so much....maybe rejoin the single market, and borrow to invest in training and new industries (when inflation back down).

[steviewevie]

.. although apparently if really want to save the planet we have to give up on the growth thing, so I guess stick with taxes and cuts.

[Guest]

 

[Guest]

The guy at the head of the organisation that took a bung for the 2022 World Cup says not blame to Qatar. Good look. 

[Guest]

The Autumn statement doesn’t appear to be helping the Tories. 

[steviewevie]

1 hour ago, Ozanne said:

The guy at the head of the organisation that took a bung for the 2022 World Cup says not blame to Qatar. Good look. 

he knows how it feels to be discriminated and persecuted, because he had red hair.

[Guest]

20 minutes ago, steviewevie said:

he knows how it feels to be discriminated and persecuted, because he had red hair.

The bald guy had red hair?

[steviewevie]

1 minute ago, Ozanne said:

The bald guy had red hair?

and freckles.

[steviewevie]

A substack long read...lots of words and some graphs... about voter coalitions etc and how future doesn't look great for tories..

https://benansell.substack.com/p/are-the-conservatives-in-a-death

 

[Crazyfool01]

surely thats it for Braverman now ?

 

[kaosmark2]

Well this is potentially excellent

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/nov/19/keir-starmer-i-will-abolish-house-of-lords-to-restore-trust-in-politics