news & politics:discussion

[lost]

2 minutes ago, Neil said:

that was due to the EU having shit loads of money to give to Ireland, and after 80 years of financial pain for Ireland, too, the EU  doesn't have huge sums to gift anyone now, so the same wouldn't happen.

Corporation tax too which the EU is looking to standardize across all countries. As you say they also won't be happy with a new tax haven singing up to try and attract the jobs from the multinationals.

Edited April 29, 2022 by lost

[Neil]

7 minutes ago, lost said:

This "well we can simply create a more successful economy" seems to come from the same school of thought

it comes from the same false belief in exceptionalism, that drives indie

[Neil]

as far as i'm concerned, scotland and wales are welcome to govern themselves, but not if they win that status with bullshit, bullshit is everything they have.

[steviewevie]

9 minutes ago, lost said:

Yep but like it or not there are 3 global cities in the world. London, New York and Hong Kong (HK probably to be replaced by Singapore as the CCP as ruining it) London and the SE generate a surplus and this money is redistributed around the UK. For the nations to leave they need replace this somehow. This "well we can simply create a more successful economy" seems to come from the same school of thought as "you can repair a economy but can't bring people back to life" comments during covid like its so simple and poor countries are choosing to be poor for a laugh or something.

We've lost part of our economy for going on 18 months during covid and now have a lower standard of living for the majority.

But a lot of countries don't have London and are doing just fine (apart from inflation and war etc)

[lost]

1 minute ago, steviewevie said:

But a lot of countries don't have London and are doing just fine (apart from inflation and war etc)

Yep and alot aren't. Its a big gamble isn't it like brexit.

[steviewevie]

Anyway I think Scottish independence less likely now, they missed their big chance in 2014 or whenever it was.

A united ireland on the other hand...

[clarkete]

30 minutes ago, Neil said:

yeah, but thats hardly the english putting themselves first at scotts expense, which is the Nats'  myth.

Don't you ever read things by the current cabinet or their supporters and wonder "how the f are they so ignorant about the issues"?

Particularly in NI (with its myriad of unique issues) and Scotland (where the last two Scottish tory leaders were clearly a lot more perceptive than their lying chancer counterparts in Westminster). 

[clarkete]

1 hour ago, lost said:

In 2020/21, public spending per person in the UK as a whole was £13,414. In England, it was £13,166 (2% below the UK average). This compares with: • Scotland: £14,842 (11% above the UK average) • Wales: £14,222 (6% above the UK average) • Northern Ireland £15,357 (14% above the UK average).

https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN04033/SN04033.pdf

Thatcher squandered the Scottish family silver where it could have been invested for future generations... 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jan/18/labour-squanders-scotland-oil-revenues

[Neil]

30 minutes ago, lost said:

Yep and alot aren't. Its a big gamble isn't it like brexit.

it is like brexit, its dumping an established single market for a dream of sunlit uplands.

[Neil]

1 minute ago, clarkete said:

Thatcher squandered the Scottish family silver where it could have been invested for future generations... 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jan/18/labour-squanders-scotland-oil-revenues

the oil money could have been better used, butt was spent was 'for to the benefit of future generations, not perfectly, but an oil fund wouldn't have worked out like norway,( circumstances are very different ).

[Ozanne]

 

[lost]

20 minutes ago, clarkete said:

Thatcher squandered the Scottish family silver where it could have been invested for future generations... 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jan/18/labour-squanders-scotland-oil-revenues

Yes there may of been an argument during the 80's oil boom for indy but that ship has now clearly sailed. I don't see a strong argument like that appearing again. Especially if we are pushing for net zero.

Petro-states are at the mercy of the commodity cycles. Its easy to forget an indy Scotland would of been trying to pay for a furlough scheme and covid off the back of a negative oil price at the time.

Edited April 29, 2022 by lost

[fred quimby]

11 hours ago, Ozanne said:

The Question Time audience isn’t really representative.

Exactly, all lefty leaning BBC people. Wonder if your statement would be the same if they were all against the tories, I am sure it would

Be interesting in the election, an open goal for starmer, let's see if he can score

[Neil]

27 minutes ago, clarkete said:

Don't you ever read things by the current cabinet or their supporters and wonder "how the f are they so ignorant about the issues"?

Particularly in NI (with its myriad of unique issues) and Scotland (where the last two Scottish tory leaders were clearly a lot more perceptive than their lying chancer counterparts in Westminster). 

the average Nat is as ignorant as those tories,  or a brexit voter. the ignorance offends me.

[Neil]

5 minutes ago, lost said:

Yes there may of been an argument during the 80's oil boom for indy but that ship has now clearly sailed. I don't see a strong argument like that appearing again. Especially if we are pushing for net zero.

Petro-states are at the mercy of the commodity cycles. Its easy to forget an indy Scotland would of been trying to pay for a furlough scheme and covid off the back of a negative oil price at the time.

if the uk had done an oil fund  it would have screwed sterling. (that  process has a name, i forget what it is).

[Ozanne]

22 minutes ago, fred quimby said:

Exactly, all lefty leaning BBC people. Wonder if your statement would be the same if they were all against the tories, I am sure it would

Be interesting in the election, an open goal for starmer, let's see if he can score

It isn’t really ‘lefty leaning’ people in the audience.

[clarkete]

54 minutes ago, lost said:

Yes there may of been an argument during the 80's oil boom for indy but that ship has now clearly sailed. I don't see a strong argument like that appearing again. Especially if we are pushing for net zero.

Petro-states are at the mercy of the commodity cycles. Its easy to forget an indy Scotland would of been trying to pay for a furlough scheme and covid off the back of a negative oil price at the time.

An interesting what if...but in that scenario they wouldn't have been pegged back by brexit like the rest of the UK presumably? 

[Neil]

1 minute ago, clarkete said:

An interesting what if...but in that scenario they wouldn't have been pegged back by brexit like the rest of the UK presumably? 

theyd be pegged back by indie with the EU much more than by brexit,  they'd be a scotland/england border to deal with.

[clarkete]

50 minutes ago, Neil said:

the average Nat is as ignorant as those tories,  or a brexit voter. the ignorance offends me.

Show me on the roll where the snp hurt you. 

Whether I agree with you or not, I can often see where you're coming from, but comparing those three parties is just daft. 

[fred quimby]

34 minutes ago, Ozanne said:

It isn’t really ‘lefty leaning’ people in the audience.

That was a joke on my part. Something the Brexit crew and those on the right shout.

It is however meant to be a representative audience randomly chosen

[Neil]

Just now, clarkete said:

how me on the roll where the snp hurt you.

they haven't, but i followed the arguments closely during the 2014 indyref, and got to see all the lies rolled out, often loaded with bnp-type nationalism as thats all the indy campaign has 

[Neil]

2 minutes ago, fred quimby said:

That was a joke on my part. Something the Brexit crew and those on the right shout.

It is however meant to be a representative audience randomly chosen

not randomly chosen, its self selection because the audience apply to be on it.

[fred quimby]

Just now, Neil said:

not randomly chosen, its self selection because the audience apply to be on it.

True, Not sure if it is first come basis or like other shows randomly picked from those that apply. 

[Ozanne]

4 minutes ago, fred quimby said:

That was a joke on my part. Something the Brexit crew and those on the right shout.

It is however meant to be a representative audience randomly chosen

Sorry about the joke, my bad 🫣

Don’t they try to get people on to discuss topics of the week such as when they wanted a mainly Brexit supporting audience a few weeks back?

[Neil]

58 minutes ago, Neil said:

if the uk had done an oil fund  it would have screwed sterling. (that  process has a name, i forget what it is).

i've remembered what its called ' the dutch disease'.

 

Quote

What is Dutch disease in economics?

• Dutch disease is a concept that describes an economic phenomenon where the rapid development of one sector of the economy (particularly natural resources) precipitates a decline in other sectors. It is also often characterized by substantial appreciation of the domestic currency