Football 2011-2012

[eFestivals]

How do you work that out? The error with pen and the sending off are similar sized errors?

Had Utd been able to score against ten men, then the consequence of the errors would have been the same.

The pen was an error and the sending off wasn't. Both were clear yellow cards, and I would imagine 99% of refs would have made the same decision.

Not sure about 99% of refs, but I'll certainly agree that most refs would have given those yellows.

But just because of that fact doesn't make them right. What a viewer thinks has happened in those incidents is hugely different dependant on the speed they're viewed at.

They were both fouls, I'm not disputing that. But they both look far more uncontrolled and dangerous than they were in the reality, when you're able to see them in detail at slow speed.

Usually one of the yellows can be disputed (see the childish moron's 2nd yellow for city yesterday) but Guitiarez yellows were pretty clear to me.

yeah, standing on the very edge of a player's boot with very little force is always seeing players sent off.

[the_hedge]

Had Utd been able to score against ten men, then the consequence of the errors would have been the same.

[eFestivals]

but you commented you only realised it should of been yellow cards once on slow motion? ref cant see that can he?

similarly, the ref obviously didn't see what happened in the Rio incident, which is why he deferred to the linesman.

Of course, the linesman obviously didn't see it clearly either else there wouldn't have been the wrong decision, tho from the viewing angle that linesman had I can understand why he got that one wrong just as I can with the two yellows for G.

what about carragher on nani last season, when he nearly broke his leg and went over the ball on his shin? should of been sent of but wasnt. or is that different?

what about paul scholes on side goal against mourinho porto in last minute?

it all even itself out and utd dont get as half as many as you think. which must be the case as your really struggling to come up with some decent facts, rather than a sendinf which could of gone either way.

how about luiz last season when he made the goal or scored when he should of been sent of?

the only one of those I remember is the first, and yes - with the hindsight provided thru here - that should have been a sending off too. But I reckon Utd have Nani to blame for an amount of why that wasn't given, crying wolf too often.

No, it's no different. A wrong decision is a wrong decision. They happen for all sorts of reasons.

And I agree, in general such things do even out. But Fergie clearly thinks he can influence whether they do or not, and the general opinion all-round is that he succeeds in warping whether they even out or not in Utd's favour.

[eFestivals]

Had United scored with ten men it would have been Gutiarez's fault for flying into the 2nd tackle when he was already booked. Nothing to do with the ref......

Gutiarez certainly didn't do himself any favours. As I've already said, I can fully understand why the ref gave those yellows.

But all the same, neither of those were yellows (based against other yellows) on what actually happened, they were based on what it looked like had happened (but hadn't) when viewed at full speed.

[kaosmark2]

if we're talking dodgy decisions in general: the sending off of Gutiarez (sp?) on Saturday.

I can understand why he got those cards cos at full speed the tackles he got carded for looked bad. But at low speed so you can actually see what happened they were both about as mild a foul as you get.

So even in the match where the ref made a huge error in giving the penalty against Utd, he also managed a similar sized error in their favour, and via which they very nearly won the game.

[TheGayTent]

So elephant man for the chop then...

[the_hedge]

So elephant man for the chop then...

[The Nal]

Not a nice thing to say but Brucie looks like hes one bad pass back away from a massive heart attack.

Could be best for everyone if he packs it in.

Seriously.

Edited November 28, 2011 by The Nal

[eFestivals]

It doesn't help that Martin O'Neil is sat around waiting for a job. I think Steve Bruce has done an ok job at Sunderland but things obviously haven't gone well this season at all. Would Sunderland want O'Neil, would O'Neil want Sunderland.

isn't Martin O'Neill really just Kevin Keegan in disguise...?

[The Nal]

Crazy old world.

Whats this? 12-15 hours before?

Unbelievable.

Taken on Saturday afternoon.....

Edited November 28, 2011 by The Nal

[strummer77]

Really tragic. Just shows how fragile the mind can be. How a can a man, apparently at the top of his profession with an apparently great family, suddenly and genuinely believe his life is no longer worth living? Comes just a few days after Stan Collymore got criticised by some for speaking of his own mental battles. If it is something similar to that, and even if it isn't, I hope people start to take depression etc. more serious.

If it is anything to do with the baseless twitter rumour (which I'm not going to spread on here until proven or as I'd expect disproven) then that is equally as terrible for many other reasons.

A shocking story and I really feel for everyone involved. Robbie Savage and Bryn Law have both broken down on TV. Seems Gary meant a lot to a lot people. He certainly made a lot of people very happy.

RIP Gary

[pink_triangle]

Other big teams get advantages as well, Chelski have one at Stamford Bridge, Liverpool at Anfield. Arsenal gain, although I'm not sure quite as much as the others in the old Big 4. I think Man U get more favouritism than most, but they're by no means exclusive.

[kaosmark2]

I heard someone say on sky that it was one of the worst refereeing decisions of all time, absolute rubbish there are loads of similar bad decisions every week that all teams from the premiership down to the lower league gets. I think all big teams get a similar amount of big decisions going in their favour, partly because the referees are subconciously scared about the contreversey from upsetting a big team but also because the big teams have far more posession and chances.

[eFestivals]

I hope people start to take depression etc. more serious.

His family have said he wasn't depressed. His family have said he'd not arguerd with his wife in the hours before.

They've refused to talk about reasons. It sounds as tho they have some idea about the reasons.

If it is anything to do with the baseless twitter rumour (which I'm not going to spread on here until proven or as I'd expect disproven) then that is equally as terrible for many other reasons.

/me goes off googling for gossip, but realises it might be baseless.

But whether it is or isn't, there's a reason somewhere.

[The Nal]

So, Anelka going in Jan, Drogba going in the summer or maybe Jan, Sturridge not happy at being a sub, Torres shit.

Is Roman going to get the cheque book out? Will he give AVB a 100m to spend? I'm not sure.

[kaosmark2]

So, Anelka going in Jan, Drogba going in the summer or maybe Jan, Sturridge not happy at being a sub, Torres shit.

Is Roman going to get the cheque book out? Will he give AVB a 100m to spend? I'm not sure.

[eFestivals]

Torres needs to play to have the chance to improve. He's not the sort of player who'll get goals regularly if he's only getting perhaps 10 minutes on the pitch.

[strummer77]

His family have said he wasn't depressed. His family have said he'd not arguerd with his wife in the hours before.

They've refused to talk about reasons. It sounds as tho they have some idea about the reasons.

[eFestivals]

I didn't think they had made any comments at all yet. And rightly so if they're at all unsure, their comments would only fuel more rumour!

T

The comments I've read came from Speed's agent, who was also his friend and best man at his wedding (I think the agent bit came after those) - and he'd made those comments after leaving Speeds house where he'd been with the family.

(I think I read them on the Telegraph website).

However, people don't always know someone's depressed or if the have mental health issues. On a football forum I use there's a post from a bloke who had his brother-in-law kill himself very recently too. They had no idea it was going to happen but something was clearly up to make it happen. People kill themselves because for them suicide is (in their mind) a better alternative to living. Whatever that reason, I'm fairly sure that is some kind of depression to feel like that. I'm sure Gary Speed didn't put that rope around his neck lightly.

O

Oh, I know. One of my best friends - a "life and soul of the party" type - threw himself out of a 13th story window about 15 years ago. The poor sod lived for quite a while after hitting the ground too.

Given that Speed was a player who played at the top but kept playing as long as he could (which most better players don't), I wouldn't be surprised to hear that he didn't like life without playing football, and that management was no substitute for that.

I guess that something will come out which will indicate what his reasons might have been. As you say, people don't do that sort of thing lightly.

[strummer77]

Oh, I know. One of my best friends - a "life and soul of the party" type - threw himself out of a 13th story window about 15 years ago. The poor sod lived for quite a while after hitting the ground too.

Given that Speed was a player who played at the top but kept playing as long

[TheGayTent]

Where's CBC...?

!

[luckysalt]

Gotta feel for Pompey fans

[eFestivals]

Where's CBC...?

!

I forget: is he the Watford fan?

They scored a great goal for Brizzle City last night, one of the best goals I've seen for a long time.

[eFestivals]

Gotta feel for Pompey fans

Oh, I dunno. If you welcome crooks and gangsters into your club for some fleeting glory then you've got to accept the consequences of what happens due to them.

One day not too far away the Utd fans who have kept supporting the Glazers are going to get the same feeling.

[The Nal]

Andy Carroll managed to play an entire game last night without falling over the ball!!

Liverpool fans obsession with slagging off Torres, needs to stop. A little bit embarrassing to be honest.

Feel bad for Lucas though, looks like hes done his cruciate. Thats the season done for him if so. Just when he was showing a big improvement.

Edited November 30, 2011 by The Nal