General News Discussion

[pink_triangle]

Theres no doubt that there should have been better security processes in place. If the purpose of the call had been of an investigative nature eg to test security procedures, then I would have no problem but would have expected the personal medical information to not be broadcasted and the nurse/hospital to be given a right to reply before it was aired.

To broadcast a persons medical records is not appropriate whether it be the Dutchess of Cornwall or Gordon Brown. It is nobody business and poor security doesnt make it fair game. Im trying to think of when someones medical records would be fair game and Im struggling. It maybe could be argued if the PM or someone high up in national security had dementia. I heard somone else on the same subject sugggesting a celebrity who had not disclosed a HIV diagnosis but was known to be having regular unprotected sex, however I would consider this as information that should be exposed to the police before the public.

[pink_triangle]

I just meant in general.

But everyone does keep saying the nurse should have received more support, what kind of support do you think she should have got?

[Guest]

The radio presenters are not blaming the hospital, though.

[eFestivals]

Neil is

that's because:-

1. they failed in their duty to keep medical info confidential.

2. they failed in their duty to have proper procedures in place to stop a caller gaining confidential medical info.

3. the failed their staff by not supporting them after the hospital's failings had impacted on the staff.

There's not only just the one 'wrong' here. If an employee is sexually harassed the company is not responsible for that harassment, but the employer is responsible for how they deal with that harassment - and if they get that wrong, they have done wrong.

When it comes to a hospital failing in its primary duties as a hospital, then that's a much bigger 'wrong' than that employer might make.

[eFestivals]

How would you know ?

by the fact that one of their staff topped themselves.

It's a bit obvious, that one is.

How do you know they didn't have procedures and that they where simply not followed ?

by the fact that the hospital has said their procedures weren't up to scratch.

[eFestivals]

Well no... Not really... Its a massive assumption...

Really, it's not. If they were giving all the support that was needed then she would not have topped herself.

It might be the case that they might have given all the support that they possibly could have done and she'd have still topped herself, but it's hugely unlikely I reckon that they went as far as it's possible to go.

I must of missed that one... Where was that ?

it was reported in the day or two after the phone call.

I've paid very little attention to everything about the case, but that admission of theirs failed to pass me by.

[Guest]

that's because:-

1. they failed in their duty to keep medical info confidential.

2. they failed in their duty to have proper procedures in place to stop a caller gaining confidential medical info.

[eFestivals]

we have no idea about that

we know for certain that they didn't support their staff enough, else we wouldn't still be talking about it now.

the facts that we know are that 2 people prank called a nurse in the middle of the night. Whether that nurse was already depressed, possibly suicidal, we don't know...

the fact that we also know is that a prank call like that is not enough to make a rational person top themselves. And so the prank call is not to blame here. It is merely one factor amongst whatever others there might be.

If I was to carry out a non-harmful in-itself action something like that prank call and someone topped themselves off the back of it, I wouldn't lose much sleep about it. There's only so much a person can take responsibility for; they can't be held responsible for an unwarranted action which might come off the back of something they've done.

[fred quimby]

If they were giving all the support that was needed then she would not have topped herself.

It might be the case that they might have given all the support that they possibly could have done and she'd have still topped herself

[Guest]

we know for certain that they didn't support their staff enough, else we wouldn't still be talking about it now.

[eFestivals]

They could have given the best support imaginable, and she might still have done it.

in which case the problem would not have been the prank call.

we don't know if she was a rational person

We do. We know that she wasn't.

it wouldn't cross your mind that maybe it would have been better not to make the call?

hindsight is something a person can only have after the event. Perfection is something that no person has.

If you're the only person to ever exist who has not done something foolish - or even not foolish - and from which you've considered every possible consequence, I bow down before you oh mighty god.

But on the basis you're not, perhaps you should apply a bit of the thought you're saying these DJs should have - and then you won't be being more ridiculous than they were in making the call.

[Guest]

hindsight is something a person can only have after the event. Perfection is something that no person has.

Edited December 12, 2012 by tonyblair

[eFestivals]

but you said, even with hindsight, you wouldn't care much, which I think is odd. I've seen parctical jokes backfire, and I think they're not worth the effort usually. I know of the concept that any humour has to have a victim, but it is quite obvious tosh.

it's not the sort of thing I'd choose to do nowadays. Then again I made plenty of prank calls as a kid, and ones with far more obvious wrong consequences too.

But it's the sort of inane humour or 'entertainment' that millions love - otherwise this country wouldn't have so many shite radio presenters who want to think that they're funny, that huge numbers tune into.

If you employ Chris Moyes, it'd be a bit stupid to expect him to not be Chris Moyes, wouldn't it? And when millions tune in to hear Moyes be Moyes, who is giving the encouragement?

I make plenty of mistakes, many of which make me cringe with embarrasement... the answer is to maybe think about doing something differently next time.

and I'm sure those DJs will do.

[hot_ice]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20710644

Do we really need to know that she hung herself?

[eFestivals]

it would come out in the inquest anyway.

[fred quimby]

it would come out in the inquest anyway.

[eFestivals]

And I still wouldn't need to know about it.

so don't be interested enough to read articles about the case then

The inquest needs to know. Inquests are public hearings.

[fred quimby]

so don't be interested enough to read articles about the case then

The inquest needs to know. Inquests are public hearings.

[eFestivals]

Oh I know. Not sure that the press need to report it though. We know they will, while hacking her phone. Just facts I don't need to know about the case really, not relevant.

the press WILL report it - that's a given. Their job is to report things which the public have an interest in; I doubt you're thinking that the press have called this one wrongly.

Unfortunately, that gets to mean that you're unlikely to find anyone reporting the story with an absence of the particular facts which you don't like. Your only optioon is to avoid it altogether.

[fred quimby]

the press WILL report it - that's a given. Their job is to report things which the public have an interest in; I doubt you're thinking that the press have called this one wrongly.

Unfortunately, that gets to mean that you're unlikely to find anyone reporting the story with an absence of the particular facts which you don't like. Your only optioon is to avoid it altogether.

[Rufus Gwertigan]

This is all starting to get silly. A woman separated from her family, with a high probability of being depressed, is unwittingly a minor player in a shit joke. Next there are memorial services in Westminster Cathedral and I am half expecting there be an application for her to be beatified. I understand that the Royal Navy is making preparations to blockade Australian until the presenters are handed over so we can hang them from the Tower.

FFS people need to get a grip.

Edit: Just to add my penneth worth. While there is loads of finger pointing at DJs' and the hospital in all this, I just wonder where her husband was. If this was my wife and she was thrust in the public eye I would tell her to take leave and come home. Surely I am not alone in thinking that ?

Edited December 13, 2012 by Rufus Gwertigan

[Guest]

Edit: Just to add my penneth worth. While there is loads of finger pointing at DJs' and the hospital in all this, I just wonder where her husband was. If this was my wife and she was thrust in the public eye I would tell her to take leave and come home. Surely I am not alone in thinking that ?

[Ed209]

Well the metro was reporting this morning that her suicide note was laying the blame at the hospital. But how they have got hold of that information is a mystery to me, and this is the metro reporting this, so they probably made it up, although its certainly plausible.

[eFestivals]

Well the metro was reporting this morning that her suicide note was laying the blame at the hospital.

the hospital have claimed to be supporting the staff in volved.

But I'd be exceedingly surprised if there wasn't at the minimum a "how stupid were you, putting that call thru" convo with her at some point after it happened.

[Rufus Gwertigan]

the hospital have claimed to be supporting the staff in volved.

But I'd be exceedingly surprised if there wasn't at the minimum a "how stupid were you, putting that call thru" convo with her at some point after it happened.