Glastonbury to start Tuesday in 2010?

[talullah]

Yeah but Weds and Thursday are the best days !

[Messy]

Yeah but Weds and Thursday are the best days !

[Bort]

I support this. Missed all of Wednesday because of traffic and tent drama. Ugh. But yes, Tuesday needs to be coaches-only or else it will just be the same traffic and same problem with campgrounds filling up prematurely, just on a different day.

[rexclark]

The only way it would work would be if they limited the ammount of people arriving on the Tuesday or as people said everyone would just turn up but then again, if people didn't arrive till midnight Tuesday they'd still have the whole of Wednesday which they would miss now.

It really is a tough one and hopefully the organisers and the council will make the correct decision.

[Clean Shirt]

When you talk about the need for cars for your stuff, all I think about is this:

The tuesday idea would be good. although that is an idea from thin air on this forum. Sounds like Eavis was joking you know!!

But yeah, i worked there this year and went on the tuesday, took my own beer and food for the week. Didnt need a car. But the public transport only idea I think would work at reducing car umbers. If anbything it makes people think twice rather than automatically using their cars.

But it makes me laugh, about how you say its more awkward if you didnt take a car., This is the problem with sustainability, if people arent even willing to be green for one weekened of the year. How the **** are we going to change our habits to make a genuine real difference. Its sad really.

Anyway the only issue is I wouldnt like to be there for that long without a shower!

[Boris]

Agree with the idea of 'early bird' tix.... but I think they should be more relaxed and let people drive without a stupid surcharge.

100% agree on Tues opening- should bring back the old Wednesday atmosphere. But they should also think about the benefits of staying open till Tuesday,,, it would definitely ease the stress and nightmare of departure.

[llcoolphil]

Some thoughts -

I am constantly fascinated by the number of people who want to introduce new rules and regulations for every aspect of the festival.

The green argument is, in real terms, meaningless. There are oodles of car journeys throughout the rest of the year that people could give up instead of the festival (not to mention the many other aspects of their lives). This year's festival was my main holiday of the year and I did the efest pre-glasto trip to the solstice before (including a trip to the Banksy exhibition in Bristol). That is a completely undoable trip on public transport - Glasto was the third campsite in less than a week. I need my car for the festival and have reduced my carbon footprint elsewhere to compensate for that (although I recognise we could all do more - becoming vegan and reducing the number of cows we need on the planet would be an infinitely better place to start - shall we put ME out of the dairy business to fulfill the green credentials?)

£50 for a car parking ticket? Let's just ban anyone on an income of less than, say, £30k instead? That way we wouldn't have people bringing their own food and drink and make it much easier (though obviously unaffordable to most people) to travel on public transport.

The fact remains that when you have tens and tens of thousands of people all trying to get to the same place at roughly the same time, it's going to be busy. If anyone was on the M25, M3, A34, M40, M42 or M6 yeaterday (and I understand the M4 and M5 were just the same), they would have realised it was the first day of the holidays, it was the busiest day of the year on the roads and there were huge tailbacks everywhere for virtually all of the day and late into the evening. It's what happens. Every major festival has traffic problems going in and traffic problems coming away - it's what happens when you have major events in places that are capable of holding major events.

Scottie's idea of 50000 early bird tickets for the tuesday is the only realistic proposition Ive read.

Face facts - there are 175000 people all descending on a small village in Somerset. It is going to be busy. Factor it into your plans.

[cejx]

Some thoughts -

I am constantly fascinated by the number of people who want to introduce new rules and regulations for every aspect of the festival.

The green argument is, in real terms, meaningless. There are oodles of car journeys throughout the rest of the year that people could give up instead of the festival (not to mention the many other aspects of their lives). This year's festival was my main holiday of the year and I did the efest pre-glasto trip to the solstice before (including a trip to the Banksy exhibition in Bristol). That is a completely undoable trip on public transport - Glasto was the third campsite in less than a week. I need my car for the festival and have reduced my carbon footprint elsewhere to compensate for that (although I recognise we could all do more - becoming vegan and reducing the number of cows we need on the planet would be an infinitely better place to start - shall we put ME out of the dairy business to fulfill the green credentials?)

£50 for a car parking ticket? Let's just ban anyone on an income of less than, say, £30k instead? That way we wouldn't have people bringing their own food and drink and make it much easier (though obviously unaffordable to most people) to travel on public transport.

The fact remains that when you have tens and tens of thousands of people all trying to get to the same place at roughly the same time, it's going to be busy. If anyone was on the M25, M3, A34, M40, M42 or M6 yeaterday (and I understand the M4 and M5 were just the same), they would have realised it was the first day of the holidays, it was the busiest day of the year on the roads and there were huge tailbacks everywhere for virtually all of the day and late into the evening. It's what happens. Every major festival has traffic problems going in and traffic problems coming away - it's what happens when you have major events in places that are capable of holding major events.

Scottie's idea of 50000 early bird tickets for the tuesday is the only realistic proposition Ive read.

Face facts - there are 175000 people all descending on a small village in Somerset. It is going to be busy. Factor it into your plans.

[ThisIsWhereIStand]

I like the idea of opening on Tuesday for people using public transport only. I think it would really have an impact. If you absolutely cannot get by without a car then you can get in Weds. It not like you are missing any entertainment. It may however make some people shift onto sustainable transport modes and should therefor ease the problems on the roads and in the car parks.

[llcoolphil]

I like the idea of opening on Tuesday for people using public transport only. I think it would really have an impact. If you absolutely cannot get by without a car then you can get in Weds. It not like you are missing any entertainment. It may however make some people shift onto sustainable transport modes and should therefor ease the problems on the roads and in the car parks.

[IamChappu]

Hmmmm......not sure whether I like the idea of opening on the Tuesday.

Whilst another day of the festival would be good, I don't like the idea of it being limited to people using public transport - I think this penalises people who don't live within easy access of public transport & could push the costs up for some drastically. Early bird tickets seem a good idea possibly.

If it does open on the Tue (or even if it doesn't), a return back to how Wed & Thurs were until the last few years would be good & cut down the amount of people turning up on the Wed. If you advertise a 5 day festival & put loads of stuff on during Thurs, people are going to want to get there on the Wed - bring back the relaxed, chilled days of old!

Also I don't think it's fair to blame the amount of crap left behind solely on cars. What about people using public transport who maybe bought a bit too much with them & can't be bothered to take it home? Or those who buy cheap stuff at the festival & leave it there? I go in a car & have never left anything behind other than proper rubbish.

[ShadyBlueBell]

Yep run it Tuesday and tell everyone then let them people tell everyone else and hey we are all back to square one a jam packed Tuesday instead of a jam packed Wednesday the residents of the village will have a chance to have another complaint against MR Evis and i am sure he would also have to get a licence for a extra day.

As i am expecting the ticket price to go up to £200 a ticket next year maybe an extra day would be good but unless something is down about the damn parking and road jams opening an extra day will not work

I agree with the extra parking charges after all it would make more money for the charity and may stop the parking issues and road jam s

Do as the campervan fields did have extra security staff on to tell everyone where to park and have a better road system

[cejx]

Yep run it Tuesday and tell everyone then let them people tell everyone else and hey we are all back to square one a jam packed Tuesday instead of a jam packed Wednesday the residents of the village will have a chance to have another complaint against MR Evis and i am sure he would also have to get a licence for a extra day.

As i am expecting the ticket price to go up to £200 a ticket next year maybe an extra day would be good but unless something is down about the damn parking and road jams opening an extra day will not work

I agree with the extra parking charges after all it would make more money for the charity and may stop the parking issues and road jam s

Do as the campervan fields did have extra security staff on to tell everyone where to park and have a better road system

[llcoolphil]

you can only increase the parking fees if you add better public transport. Leominster to Glastonbury doesn't exist... which means is more unethical for me to drive to a coach point, pay to park my car for 5 days and then get a coach. Surely 4 people sharing a car is as good as I can get it. Why should be be penalised?

Like I said, the jams aren't that bad, and were mainly this year down to twatish roadworks on the A303 and a rather unfortunate smash on the motorway. We know there will be queues, just live with it!

The staff in the carparks are shite. They need above anything better training, supervision and to be arsed about what they're doing. They are all up for it on the first day of the festival. come home time they don't give a shit.

I say a big NO to tuesday opening... if nuffink else the rocket in the ticket price to pay for the extra rozzers and security

[mikeb]

you can only increase the parking fees if you add better public transport. Leominster to Glastonbury doesn't exist... which means is more unethical for me to drive to a coach point, pay to park my car for 5 days and then get a coach. Surely 4 people sharing a car is as good as I can get it. Why should be be penalised?

Like I said, the jams aren't that bad, and were mainly this year down to twatish roadworks on the A303 and a rather unfortunate smash on the motorway. We know there will be queues, just live with it!

Edited July 25, 2009 by mikeb

[wweerr208]

people on this site seem to be more like daily mail readers by the day, ban this ban that, charge more etc..

think public transport to festival is saving the world!! if you want to save the world don't have the festival in the first place. I did the maths on the fuel used by a car full (4 people) against a bus 50% full, the car won!

tbh i really don't like cars, but if you think public transport is the savior, think again

opening the site up on sunday, much better (i've been there as early as sat, it's bloody great)

/2p

[llcoolphil]

They may not be even remotely as convenient as a car.

[llcoolphil]

people on this site seem to be more like daily mail readers by the day, ban this ban that, charge more etc..

[mikeb]

I did the maths on the fuel used by a car full (4 people) against a bus 50% full, the car won!

[mandypants]

For me, it worked out that public transport was cheaper than driving, and a damn sight less tiring as I'd have had to drive on my own with no co-driver from the north east. It was more complicated, I had to take a taxi to the train station, train to newcastle, metro to the airport, plane down to Bristol, then a lift from the airport to Pilton, but I'd easily do it again. I know flying isn't the most eco-friendly way, but it was a damn sight better than sitting on a bus getting travel sick or having to travel on uber expensive trains. Plus I travelled on the Tuesday and stayed at a friends house in Pilton so I just walked through the gate on the Wednesday morning, which was ace

[wweerr208]

A typical bus/coach carries at least 50 passengers or so I think doesn't it ? So, what you're saying that the fuel used by a typical car containing 4 people is going to be less than the fuel used by a typical bus carrying 25 people ? Maybe true in absolute terms regarding total fuel consumption per vehicle but almost certainly not true on a per person basis that's for sure ! Of course it's true to say that mostly empty public transport is a bad and inefficient means of travel but I would suggest that the break-even point is highly likely to occur significantly before 50% full.

We're talking 1 bus .vs. 6+ cars doing the same journey here so I'll raise you a gallon of diesel and see your figures ... cos at first thought, the chances of a bus using >>6x more fuel than an average car for the same journey doesn't sound particularly right to me. I would guess a typical modern bus is probably around 10/15mpg and a typical car around 40/50mpg - and please note that those are pure guesses, I may well be completely wrong here.

Unless you can prove otherwise, your argument sounds very much to me like just another one of those "why I can't do it" stylee comments rather than a realistic assessment of the facts and a plausible justification for using a car. I'm happy to be proven wrong, and will apologise accordingly if I am, so over to you. Prove the fuel consumption (and CO2 emission) per person per mile are worse for a half full bus/coach than for a full car

[mikeb]

These are plausible options?

Edited July 25, 2009 by mikeb

[wweerr208]

good post mikeb,

but... in the real world if this car/ bus tax was to be introduced then A.) find nearest bus station to site B.) drive there!!!! x1000's people = problem not solved

for some (including myself unfortunately) public transport is not an option due to distance, lack of flexibility, logistics - my 3 yo son would drive get us kicked off the coach with his actions (whole discussion with in its self)

not forgetting the fact.. it excludes people - this is not what glastonbury and certainly what ME/ EE is about

Edited July 25, 2009 by wweerr208

[wweerr208]

re: coach vs car

i can't remember the exact figures, but thw coaches stats were taken from glasto official site

from memory my workings out were:

car = 4 people doing 45mph = 180 people mpg

coach = 25 people doing 7mpg = 175 people mpg

i've had a few cans and my memory is vague (so they could be totally wrong) but that what i remember

[llcoolphil]

Yes of course the use of public transport might be a plausible option. Just because I was saying in the bit you quoted that it MAY not be [whatever], the point was that you don't actually know whether other options are or are not viable UNLESS you bother to spend a bit of time finding out. The use of public transport was apparently being dismissed out of hand with no justification that I could see. Depending on the specific circumstances involved, public transport could well have been a very viable and cost-effective option - although almost certainly not when compared with a private car containing 4 passengers of course.

I can guarantee you that I get to Glasto each and every year by train a d@mn sight cheaper and more conveniently (although taking significantly longer) than by any other means with the exception of walking, biking or cycling it - sadly none of which are particularly plausible options these days ! I don't have a car for the same reason. I never have, in fact I don't even have a car licence ! I used to ride a huge bike for years but haven't even used that in the last 5+ years. Way too much hassle these days and not cost-effective. Walking, cycling, public transport and the occasional taxi if absolutely necessary saves me a small fortune each and every year over the real cost of buying, keeping and running a vehicle of just about any type. And no, I don't live in London or similar and yes, I do travel as/when required for gigs, festivals, visits and so on. Quite a lot in fact. Sure, private transport is very convenient and there are just a few times when I *really* wished I had a car but I don;'t and it doesn't make economic or environmental sense for me to have one so it's not going to happen.

I was literally implying a blanket reduction (or a lack of increase as the case may be) of £10 on general admission tickets. For a car full of passengers the effective reduction in ticket costs would offset the increased parking. If you chose to drive alone then you effectively end up paying a bit more for the privilege. If you chose to come by public transport then you effectively pay a bit less. It's just a thought, if something like that were ever to be considered by GFL then it would require a *LOT* more detailed consideration of the financial and other implications of course.

All I'm saying is that Glasto is not just any old music festival. It makes a point of trying to educate peeps and encourage awareness of issues be they environmental, humanitarian or otherwise and take positive action where appropriate. Encouraging the use of public transport is a good thing. Just making peeps even think about maybe doing so is a good thing. Public transport just has to be the 'right' solution when lots of peeps are going to the same place at much the same time hasn't it ? What better circumstances can there be for promoting the consideration of and hopefully the use of public transport than a situation where lots of peeps are going from a similar place to Glasto at a similar time ? It's an ideal opportunity to provide and encourage the use of public transport in the hope that it will make peeps think about perhaps using it in other circumstances as well. But it absolutely has to be good, reliable and cost-effective etc. of course. And it has to be considered by the punters as a realistic alternative to driving. A small financial encouragement to do so together with a small financial discouragement to drive on your own may well provide sufficient of an incentive to consider it and bring about a positive benefit. It's the old "would you rather be sat behind 1 bus or 50 cars" stylee thing isn't it. Public transport is almost without doubt the sensible thing but it has to be seen to work.

I think GFL had a real good opportunity when they first came up with the 'n' thousand extra tickets for coaches/trains only. Yeah, I know it was more of a licensing kinda thing but still a good opportunity to make peeps actually think about using public transport in general and promote the benefits. The sad thing of course is that they totally screwed it up bigtime by providing the most cr@p/expensive service possible and it was a complete disaster in so many ways. That one single c*ck up the first year of not doing things properly by choosing a reliable and professional company to organise the coaches did more for turning peeps off public transport in general than all the car manufacturers ever could even if they joined forces !!