Corbyn appearing on Pyramid!

[eFestivals]

1 minute ago, uscore said:

I don't think it was a brilliant speech, but it wasn't terrible.  But he was there, and getting across his message of being a proper alternative to the Tory style of government.  I liked that.  I cheered again.

I don't think it was a brilliant speech, but it wasn't terrible.

But what it was was the biggest string of nice sounding platitudes that said nothing at all of any meaning. "let's all be nice to each other and everything will be wonderful".

The sentiment i fully agree with. How it's achieved I've yet to hear anything of much sense.

 

1 minute ago, uscore said:

they had a costed manifesto

No, they had some numbers on a bit of paper, something entirely different.

'Costed' has a relationship to reality. The IFS pointed out what I'd said before they published their report.

If you want to discuss where it was waaaay off reality I'm here all day.

I'd much rather Labour had a manifesto that the tories couldn't very easily rip to shreds (tho of course to do that they have to try to do that, and they didn't bother this time. Next time labour won't be so lucky with that).

 

1 minute ago, uscore said:

I think the press, like eFestivals, are much harder on him than they are on anyone else but he's ridden the worst of it out so far.

I'm hard on everything that's flawed.

[eFestivals]

6 minutes ago, waterfalls212434 said:

 

does your power extend to moderation powers which are used to rid this site of mindless trolls?

Grow up, or keep being the two year old having a tantrum. Your choice.

[waterfalls212434]

Just now, eFestivals said:

does your power extend to moderation powers which are used to rid this site of mindless trolls?

Grow up, or keep being the two year old having a tantrum. Your choice.

go right ahead. youll merely prove my point about yourself throwing your toys out your pram when people disagree with you......oh and whose worse? the troll or he who created him? Not as if I havnt given you a chance to debate with me like an adult on here....but since you time and time refuse you cant blame me for mocking you now can you? 

oh and vpns are fun to use by the way ill just add that in right now  

[eFestivals]

4 minutes ago, waterfalls212434 said:

https://uk.yahoo.com/news/british-social-attitudes-survey-2017-230226737.html

That's heartening, which only makes it all the more frustrating when Corbyn says that 95% of peeps can have it all for free, using a flawed set of numbers that will never work in reality.

If we want extra we have to pay extra which means having less of other things. How evil and unsocialist of me to mention it.

 

4 minutes ago, waterfalls212434 said:

https://uk.yahoo.com/finance/news/5-parts-uk-economy-not-strong-stable-since-brexit-general-election-153218523.html

Sadly, this one only shows how poor your echo chamber is, as apparently falling house price inflation which starts to make house purchasing more accessible to more people is now a bad thing.

[waterfalls212434]

in other words.......

[Guest]

37 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

Like to show me where?

Until you do - you know, facts - it's just another of the mindless delusions from the guy who will never do facts

Waterfalls doesn't do facts - just mindless rhetoric.

[waterfalls212434]

aw someone doesn't like free speech when it embarrasses them? haha I knew id crack you eventually 

[eFestivals]

2 minutes ago, waterfalls212434 said:

go right ahead. youll merely prove my point about yourself throwing your toys out your pram when people disagree with you

It's not the disagreeing, it's the trolling.

Moron.

 

2 minutes ago, waterfalls212434 said:

Not as if I havnt given you a chance to debate with me like an adult on here.

You should take up comedy.

Oh, you have already.

 

2 minutes ago, waterfalls212434 said:

...but since you time and time refuse you cant blame me for mocking you now can you? 

Mock away, just be smart enough to have a brain while doing it.

 

2 minutes ago, waterfalls212434 said:

oh and vpns are fun to use by the way ill just add that in right now  

Go ahead. Oh, and create yourself a new account too, cos you'll need that as well.

Now, the only dilemma for me is how will I spot farterwalls using a new account?

 

[eFestivals]

Just now, waterfalls212434 said:

aw someone doesn't like free speech when it embarrasses them? haha I knew id crack you eventually 

the speech is fine.

It's when you do baby talk that's the problem.

[Guest]

18 minutes ago, waterfalls212434 said:

 

PMSL

[waterfalls21234]

well that was easy..........I can see you having to mute a lot of accounts over the next week pal because im not going anywhere, nor are my views. As for this morning as I said I knew id crack you, see you soon mothertrucker! 

 

[uscore]

6 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

I don't think it was a brilliant speech, but it wasn't terrible.

But what it was was the biggest string of nice sounding platitudes that said nothing at all of any meaning. "let's all be nice to each other and everything will be wonderful".

The sentiment i fully agree with. How it's achieved I've yet to hear anything of much sense.

 

 

Sure. I think that was a tactical decision.  Get on stage and get cheered a lot.  Outline only vague policy.  It's a Glastonbury audience on a sunny day - it wasn't the time for detail.   (That should still come - but not there).

 

I think overall, his appearance will have done him more good than harm.  He won't have converted his enemies - but could anyone do that in 10 minutes?    One of the main criticisms of him before was that he wasn't visible enough.  Now he's visible and he's accused of cheap populism.  It's almost as if he'd get criticised whatever he did.

[eFestivals]

1 minute ago, waterfalls21234 said:

well that was easy..........I can see you having to mute a lot of accounts over the next week pal because im not going anywhere, nor are my views. As for this morning as I said I knew id crack you, see you soon mothertrucker! 

 

Your views are fine. You can show just how stupid some Corbyn cultists are and damage your hero all you want.

When you do two-year-old you'll be treated like a two year old.

Carry on.

 

[priest17]

4 minutes ago, waterfalls21234 said:

well that was easy..........I can see you having to mute a lot of accounts over the next week pal because im not going anywhere, nor are my views. As for this morning as I said I knew id crack you, see you soon mothertrucker! 

 

N'aww man I miss the extra 4.

[eFestivals]

9 minutes ago, uscore said:

Sure. I think that was a tactical decision.  Get on stage and get cheered a lot.  Outline only vague policy.  It's a Glastonbury audience on a sunny day - it wasn't the time for detail.   (That should still come - but not there).

oh, i don't disagree. I wasn't expecting anything different at Glastonbury, but I'd very much like something of greater real substance somewhen. Before he gets elected would be better, as he might then actually get elected.

 

Quote

I think overall, his appearance will have done him more good than harm.

Not entirely sure about that.

a bunch of chanting kids is not going to be particularly attractive to anyone still on the fence who might jump Labour's way.

 

Quote

One of the main criticisms of him before was that he wasn't visible enough.  Now he's visible and he's accused of cheap populism.  It's almost as if he'd get criticised whatever he did.

That original criticism was because he chose for himself to be invisible. It wasn't the media shunning him, it was him shunning the media.

And cheap populism might - does - have its place (such as on stage at Glastonbury or a Corbyn rally), but he doesn't go beyond that.

Just think of the grasp that Blair or even Cameron had on detail, while Corbyn manages to tie himself in knots and fail to explain his own policies, as he demonstrated twice in two days early in the new year when he fucked up his own 'relaunch' so spectacularly it got cancelled.

Edited June 28, 2017 by eFestivals

[babyblade41]

41 minutes ago, waterfalls212434 said:

Corbyn is going to back tories into a corner over this anyway, already plans for an amendment to the queens speech to guarantee a public sector pay rise including the emergency services who have been so invaluable as of late......tories vote that down at their peril! the man even in opposition can make a difference and thats how its done! you back these c**ts into a corner and you keep pushing till you get something out of them or they collapse. simple as.

Public sector pay rise ?? try working in the private sector matey... not a pay rise for years 

[Mardy]

3 minutes ago, babyblade41 said:

Public sector pay rise ?? try working in the private sector matey... not a pay rise for years 

That's just not true, is it? I mean, anecdotally, for you, that might be the case, but every study of the actual data shows that not to be the overall situation

E.g.

http://www.aol.co.uk/money/2017/02/22/private-sector-pay-rises-remain-at-2-compared-to-1-in-public/

 

 

[rubenz]

[eFestivals]

5 minutes ago, Mardy said:

That's just not true, is it? I mean, anecdotally, for you, that might be the case, but every study of the actual data shows that not to be the overall situation

E.g.

http://www.aol.co.uk/money/2017/02/22/private-sector-pay-rises-remain-at-2-compared-to-1-in-public/

Just out of interest, does that comparison include pension benefits?

Cos public sector ones are (as a generality) unaltered, while private ones continue to fall in the benefit they give.

[Mardy]

Just now, eFestivals said:

Just out of interest, does that comparison include pension benefits?

Cos public sector ones are (as a generality) unaltered, while private ones continue to fall in the benefit they give.

I'm halfway through an IFS study (fun times), can't answer that comprehensively at the moment, but i was replying specifically to bb41’s claim that the private sector don't receive pay rises. Which is just not true. 

[uscore]

18 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

 

Not entirely sure about that.

a bunch of chanting kids is not going to be particularly attractive to anyone still on the fence who might jump Labour's way.

 

 

I think, rightly or wrongly, it seems to be that when people look popular, other people start to believe they are popular.   I don't think 10 minutes at Glastonbury is going to change any outcomes, but I think it was a step in the right direction.

[eFestivals]

Just now, Mardy said:

I'm halfway through an IFS study (fun times), can't answer that comprehensively at the moment, but i was replying specifically to bb41’s claim that the private sector don't receive pay rises. Which is just not true. 

depends which bit of the private sector (tho what you've said right there isn't quite what was said). 

This bit right here is currently earning just 2/3rd's of what it was 17 years ago, so there's plenty of reasons why some might say the public sector isn't doing so badly.

[frostypaw]

This thread now:

At least the Tories weren't promising - to quote - "a bonfire of regulation" or that shitty attempt to blame everyone else for Grenfell would be in obscenely poor taste.

[eFestivals]

1 minute ago, uscore said:

I think, rightly or wrongly, it seems to be that when people look popular, other people start to believe they are popular.   I don't think 10 minutes at Glastonbury is going to change any outcomes, but I think it was a step in the right direction.

I defo agree about the first part, for how momentum grows.

But enthusiasm can be over-done, and have the opposite effect too. I'm aware with certainty that the cultish behaviour of some (think waterfalls) is turning some away from Labour. I'm not saying that's smart (or stupid, either), I'm merely saying it's happening with some.

[Mardy]

Just now, eFestivals said:

depends which bit of the private sector (tho what you've said right there isn't quite what was said). 

This bit right here is currently earning just 2/3rd's of what it was 17 years ago, so there's plenty of reasons why some might say the public sector isn't doing so badly.

Sure, I think overall, parts of the public sector are doing OK, if you take into account pensions etc (although a decline in job security, one of the traditional be efits of public sector, changes the balance a bit) but that's surely as it should be. I'm intensely worried about what's going to happen with pensions in 15-20 years time. So many people are going to be so fucked, be it private sector, self employed whatever. And it's not a competition, private vs public,  it's something which everybody, the whole of society needs to think about and share the burden of.