Time to resurrect Rock Against Racism?

[scrippit]

I have just ordered Daniel Rachel's book, 'Walls Come Tumbling Down', charting the 17 years of Rock Against Racism. Is it time we called for a return to real activism against the creeping facism we are experiencing world wide? (Plus some of the great music it spawned!)

[eFestivals]

2 minutes ago, scrippit said:

I have just ordered Daniel Rachel's book, 'Walls Come Tumbling Down', charting the 17 years of Rock Against Racism. Is it time we called for a return to real activism against the creeping facism we are experiencing world wide? (Plus some of the great music it spawned!)

I dunno about you, but I'm seeing more fascist tendencies from the people labelling others as fascists than I am from those who are being labelled as fascists.

I'd say that needs addressing before those people might be able to launch any successful campaign against fascists.

[Winslow Leach]

Just now, eFestivals said:

I dunno about you, but I'm seeing more fascist tendencies from the people labelling others as fascists than I am from those who are being labelled as fascists.

I'd say that needs addressing before those people might be able to launch any successful campaign against fascists.

[scrippit]

6 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

I dunno about you, but I'm seeing more fascist tendencies from the people labelling others as fascists than I am from those who are being labelled as fascists.

I'd say that needs addressing before those people might be able to launch any successful campaign against fascists.

I'm seeing more Fascists and less condemnation of them. Maybe I am being duped by a bias media...

But I don't think so.

People in the US openly making the salute. The rise of the Alt-right and their unpleasant views. Trumps cabinet. 

[Homer]

19 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

I dunno about you, but I'm seeing more fascist tendencies from the people labelling others as fascists than I am from those who are being labelled as fascists.

I'd say that needs addressing before those people might be able to launch any successful campaign against fascists.

How about Rock Against Rock Against Racism then?

[eFestivals]

1 minute ago, scrippit said:

I'm seeing more Fascists and less condemnation of them. Maybe I am being duped by a bias media...

But I don't think so.

People in the US openly making the salute. The rise of the Alt-right and their unpleasant views. Trumps cabinet. 

while people claiming to be against fascism make up their own versions to lie about what Trump said and what his teams have said and done - or still hold a 35 year old unproven allegation against someone with a spotless record since, allowing no room for intellectual reform (only the self-annointed can be the righteous and everyone else is damned forever  :rolleyes:) - and say that any view different to their own is not allowed.

Or say that all Trump voters cannot disassociate themselves from the worst of Trump while all Muslims cannot be associated with the worst of Islam.

Those with unpleasant views are on both sides of this.

If someone wants to claim the high moral ground they firstly have to find where it is and stand on it.

[eFestivals]

11 minutes ago, scrippit said:

Trumps cabinet.

Care to state the racism in Trump's cabinet?

If you wish to claim it, you should be able to show it.

[Cornelius_Fudge]

As long as there is a criticism of all forms of racism from both ends of the spectrum, then I'm all for it, and not just one way traffic from one group to another.

[scrippit]

15 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

Care to state the racism in Trump's cabinet?

If you wish to claim it, you should be able to show it.

Mr Bannon seems to have views that I find abhorrent.  Trump has failed to simply disassociate himself from some of the less savoury elements claiming his election as their victory. 

Other than that I agree with your assertions. 

 

 

[zahidf]

8 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

while people claiming to be against fascism make up their own versions to lie about what Trump said and what his teams have said and done - or still hold a 35 year old unproven allegation against someone with a spotless record since, allowing no room for intellectual reform (only the self-annointed can be the righteous and everyone else is damned forever  :rolleyes:) - and say that any view different to their own is not allowed.

Or say that all Trump voters cannot disassociate themselves from the worst of Trump while all Muslims cannot be associated with the worst of Islam.

Those with unpleasant views are on both sides of this.

If someone wants to claim the high moral ground they firstly have to find where it is and stand on it.

Is that Jeff Sessions, the guy who voted against every piece of legislation to try and improve civil rights for minorities for the last 35 years?

People have a reason to think his views havent changed in 35 years.

Or self confessed white nationalist Bannon, one of the main people behind the Alt right(nazis by an other name)

Those poor trump voters. All they did was vote for a racist, pussy grabber side by side with the KKK and the American Nazi party, and now all these nasty liberals want them on a register and to make their lives worse.

Boo, nasty liberals. Boo. The real bad guys during cable street were those nasty working class people stopping Mosely's blackshirts from marching. Boooo

[Cornelius_Fudge]

5 minutes ago, scrippit said:

Mr Bannon seems to have views that I find abhorrent.  Trump has failed to simply disassociate himself from some of the less savoury elements claiming his election as their victory. 

Other than that I agree with your assertions. 

 

 

Trump denounced it ages ago and he's said that repeatedly denouncing it would just give them more air time and attention.

http://edition.cnn.com/2016/11/01/politics/donald-trump-kkk-crusader-support/


 

Edited November 22, 2016 by Cornelius_Fudge

[eFestivals]

1 minute ago, scrippit said:

Mr Bannon seems to have views that I find abhorrent.  

"seems"? Or does? Are you inventing this, to suit what you want to "prove"?

He worked for a raving right news outlet, but by the same logic anyone with a job at the Daily Mail or a Murdoch outlet is by-default a fascist.

Meanwhile, it's wrong to mass-label Muslims?

This is the new anti-fascism, is it?

Perhaps you might understand why I see a problem here.

 

1 minute ago, scrippit said:

Trump has failed to simply disassociate himself from some of the less savoury elements claiming his election as their victory. 

To do differently would require Trump to insult his supporters, to call them racists.

I can understand why you (and me) might like him to do what you suggest, but it doesn't take a genius to realise why it's never going to happen in the way you're thinking.

And of course all political parties have their share or moron supporters - who are similarly never condemned by the leader or party they support.

 

1 minute ago, scrippit said:

Other than that I agree with your assertions. 

 

[zahidf]

5 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

"seems"? Or does? Are you inventing this, to suit what you want to "prove"?

He worked for a raving right news outlet, but by the same logic anyone with a job at the Daily Mail or a Murdoch outlet is by-default a fascist.

Meanwhile, it's wrong to mass-label Muslims?

This is the new anti-fascism, is it?

Perhaps you might understand why I see a problem here.

 

To do differently would require Trump to insult his supporters, to call them racists.

I can understand why you (and me) might like him to do what you suggest, but it doesn't take a genius to realise why it's never going to happen in the way you're thinking.

And of course all political parties have their share or moron supporters - who are similarly never condemned by the leader or party they support.

 

 

Bannon is one of main people behind Breitbart. He isnt just a journalist. Is the editor of the daily mail a racist? Is the editor of stormfront news?

[Cornelius_Fudge]

Look, there are a lot of myths supported by liberals and the Left which you should be able to label as racism as well. Racism isn't just inherent on the far Right.

Any extreme Leftie/SJW who cries that white people have ruined the world, that there's white privilege, or institutional racism caused by whites... that is also racism, however you try and spin it.

Pinning all your problems on another race just because of the colour of their skin = racism.

Claiming that any problem you have was created by another race of people, and absolving yourself of any blame or responsibility at the same time = racism.

So, if we really want to beat racism, we have to stop playing this bullshit game where it's all a one way street of racism from the Right to the Left. It's just not true.

[Winslow Leach]

Just now, Cornelius_Fudge said:

Look, there are a lot of myths supported by liberals and the Left which you should be able to label as racism as well. Racism isn't just inherent on the far Right.

Any extreme Leftie/SJW who cries that white people have ruined the world, that there's white privilege, or institutional racism caused by whites... that is also racism, however you try and spin it.

Pinning all your problems on another race just because of the colour of their skin = racism.

Claiming that any problem you have was created by another race of people, and absolving yourself of any blame or responsibility at the same time = racism.

So, if we really want to beat racism, we have to stop playing this bullshit game where it's all a one way street of racism from the Right to the Left. It's just not true.

The gift that keeps on giving:

[zahidf]

The blackshirts and the BNP say they arent racist.

So from now on, as Trump says he isnt a racist, we should definitely take their word on it and ignore all of their words and policies, and take what they say at face value.

[eFestivals]

7 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Is that Jeff Sessions, the guy who voted against every piece of legislation to try and improve civil rights for minorities for the last 35 years?

Different people have different ideas about what are the most important freedoms.

You're labelling him as evil simply because he's failed to support the things you feel he should support,.

That makes you closer to a fascist than him by the evidence, in case you've missed that.

 

7 minutes ago, zahidf said:

People have a reason to think his views havent changed in 35 years.

Every reason but the evidence to back up even that he held those views in the first place.

But even if he did call someone the n-word in 1981, does that mean he's forever damned by his past? 

I'm hoping you're smart enough to wise up about how abhorent you're personally being, but I guess I should just dismiss you as forever a worthless c**t.

 

7 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Or self confessed white nationalist Bannon, one of the main people behind the Alt right(nazis by an other name)

"self confessed"? Is this like your claim he's a "literal nazi"?

He worked for an alt-right news outlet, yes .... so I guess the guy working o the printing for the Daily Mail is an irredeemable fascist too?

As for "white nationalist", that's merely the opposite of those who advocate "minority rights", simply a focus towards particular policies in preference to others. Just as "minority rights" don't automatically equate to fascism against whites, the same is true of the opposite.

It's merely a matter of who benefits by policy, and there's no right by default for the benefits to go in just one direction.

 

7 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Those poor trump voters. All they did was vote for a racist, pussy grabber side by side with the KKK and the American Nazi party, and now all these nasty liberals want them on a register and to make their lives worse.

Those poor Muslims. all they did was associate themselves with a racist misogynistic religion that has its adherents blow people up who disagree with them.

And now those nasty liberals want to bomb the fuck out of them and kill them, which is so much better than Trump.

(I'm pointing out here that there's a moron's opposite view that's as moronic as your own)

 

7 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Boo, nasty liberals. Boo. The real bad guys during cable street were those nasty working class people stopping Mosely's blackshirts from marching. Boooo

I see you cannot spot the difference between a proven fasict as your slurs that write off tens of millions of people as only-evil and never reformable.

Hope, not hate.

But you only do hate, at least as bad as those you condemn.

 

 

[scrippit]

12 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

To do differently would require Trump to insult his supporters, to call them racists.

Oh. That's OK then.

 

13 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

"seems"? Or does? Are you inventing this, to suit what you want to "prove"?

How about: 'Is definitely'?

 

14 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

Perhaps you might understand why I see a problem here.

No. Sorry. 

[eFestivals]

8 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Bannon is one of main people behind Breitbart. He isnt just a journalist. Is the editor of the daily mail a racist? Is the editor of stormfront news?

he's the man who runs the commercial side of things.

He's as evil as all people who accept money for their job on the basis you're giving here.

 

[eFestivals]

3 minutes ago, zahidf said:

The blackshirts and the BNP say they arent racist.

There's proof of their racism.

I've asked you to give me proof of Bannon's racism. Why am I STILL waiting for that proof? :roileyes:

You mentioned the ADL to me as providers of that proof, yet the ADL have made an unequivical statement of there being no proof.

 

3 minutes ago, zahidf said:

So from now on, as Trump says he isnt a racist, we should definitely take their word on it and ignore all of their words and policies, and take what they say at face value.

If Trump is racist, call him out on that racism.

All the rest if just your bullshit, that's as big as any bullshit from Trump. 

 

[zahidf]

2 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

Different people have different ideas about what are the most important freedoms.

You're labelling him as evil simply because he's failed to support the things you feel he should support,.

That makes you closer to a fascist than him by the evidence, in case you've missed that.

 

Every reason but the evidence to back up even that he held those views in the first place.

But even if he did call someone the n-word in 1981, does that mean he's forever damned by his past? 

I'm hoping you're smart enough to wise up about how abhorent you're personally being, but I guess I should just dismiss you as forever a worthless c**t.

 

"self confessed"? Is this like your claim he's a "literal nazi"?

He worked for an alt-right news outlet, yes .... so I guess the guy working o the printing for the Daily Mail is an irredeemable fascist too?

As for "white nationalist", that's merely the opposite of those who advocate "minority rights", simply a focus towards particular policies in preference to others. Just as "minority rights" don't automatically equate to fascism against whites, the same is true of the opposite.

It's merely a matter of who benefits by policy, and there's no right by default for the benefits to go in just one direction.

 

Those poor Muslims. all they did was associate themselves with a racist misogynistic religion that has its adherents blow people up who disagree with them.

And now those nasty liberals want to bomb the fuck out of them and kill them, which is so much better than Trump.

(I'm pointing out here that there's a moron's opposite view that's as moronic as your own)

 

I see you cannot spot the difference between a proven fasict as your slurs that write off tens of millions of people as only-evil and never reformable.

Hope, not hate.

But you only do hate, at least as bad as those you condemn.

 

 

Come on. If you vote against equal pay legislation and take people trying to register black people to court, thats a very strong indication of you being racist.

Im not saying they will never be reformed btw. they need to want to reform first though. Zero indicatioms of sessions wanting to reform.

Also, Does trump look like a calm leader who wont start a war?

[eFestivals]

5 minutes ago, scrippit said:

Oh. That's OK then.

Have you ever heard the Labour party state before each election that they don't want the votes of racists?

It's not about "OK" or not, it's about reality.

 

5 minutes ago, scrippit said:

How about: 'Is definitely'?

Then how about the proof?

 

5 minutes ago, scrippit said:

No. Sorry. 

What, not even when you say "I agree with your assertions" and then suddenly you don't?

 

[eFestivals]

8 minutes ago, zahidf said:

Come on. If you vote against equal pay legislation and take people trying to register black people to court, thats a very strong indication of you being racist.

"Man has different views to me" does not prove fascism or racism.

 

Quote

Im not saying they will never be reformed btw. they need to want to reform first though. Zero indicatioms of sessions wanting to reform.

just like there's zero evidence of him needing to reform in the first place, you mean?

FFS.

 

Quote

Also, Does trump look like a calm leader who wont start a war?

I dunno, tho that's fuck all to do with racism or fascism. 

And, alongside his statements of less involvement in warring, how does the person who's personally authorised the bombing of EIGHT different countries - including extrajudicial killings  - stand up as a better alternative?

Edited November 22, 2016 by eFestivals

[stuartbert two hats]

7 minutes ago, eFestivals said:

There's proof of their racism.

I've asked you to give me proof of Bannon's racism. Why am I STILL waiting for that proof? :roileyes:

You mentioned the ADL to me as providers of that proof, yet the ADL have made an unequivical statement of there being no proof.

 

If Trump is racist, call him out on that racism.

All the rest if just your bullshit, that's as big as any bullshit from Trump. 

 

Proof is a strong word, but here's some evidence on Bannon's prejudice:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/election/trump-campaign-ceo-bannon-complained-jews-daughters-school-article-1.2767615

Quote

 

Mary Louise Piccard said in a 2007 court declaration that Bannon didn't want their twin daughters attending the Archer School for Girls in Los Angeles because many Jewish students were enrolled at the elite institution.

"The biggest problem he had with Archer is the number of Jews that attend," Piccard said in her statement signed on June 27, 2007.

 

 

 

[eFestivals]

So far we've had:-

1. guilt without evidence.

2. damned forever by an unproven alligatuion

3. double standards being applied to the heinous.

Can someone tell me who the fascists are, please?