General Election 2015

[kaosmark2]

I am a Tory!

I still find it bizarre how anyone with half an inch of sanity and political awareness, that isn't both part of the wealthy upper class and completely callous towards humanity, could consider voting Tory.

[LJS]

So if Tory's get the most MPs, but not enough for a majority, and try a MinGov, the SNP will vote against them. OK. But if Labour don't have enough for a majority either or a coalition, but cobble some kind of agreement together with the SNP - but with Alex wanting to hold the govt to ransom, as he said, then a steady government doesn't look that likely. Could end up with another election, which according to my esteemed fellow posters, will result in a Tory majority.

Seems like the best choice for people who don't want the Tories, is to vote Labour. Who'd have thought it?!

In your neck of the woods, Yes. Because the alternatives (UKiP, LibDems) are more likely to side with your Tories. Up here, In friendly Scotland (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-31816926) any seat the SNP takes from Labour is still an anti- Tory vote. And remember the SNP look likely to capture up to 10 Libdem seats in Scotland changing these from "maybe Tory" to Anti Tory & hence reducing the possibility of a Tory Government. We might even bin our only Tory MP.

[LJS]

It's much more possible than you believe. As an easy examp0le, if they offered him indy, what would he say?

SNP support the Tories from a foreign country - great support that would be. Silly Fuker.

I don't really expect him to do a deal with the tories, but it's not the impossibility you think.

Yes it is

But what does he want? A tory win. Which is why he's out campaigning for the tories, and using their campaign slogans.

Are you really so dim?

What a complete load of utter Bollocks

PMSL - yeah, cos he's all about positive contribution and not wrecking, yeah.

FFS.

Alec is having a bit of fun just now. I don't see how wrecking anything other than a Tory Government is in the SNP's interests. They have got to their position where they now dominate Scottish politics by being sensible & safe - not by wrecking anything.

I don't, but there's much more than just that at play. Why has it passed you by?

Breaking up the UK is not to my benefit and it's certainly not to yours with SNP cuts of 15%, but that's where we're heading. I know you don't care cos y9ou like punching yourself in the face, but some of us do. Whereas snippers express fake concern for Scotland's poor, not all are as fact-free in their thinking.

This election looks like playing out as the election where the effective opposition to the tories gets killed off, and then they rule forever. A perfect result for fact-free you I know, but your countrymen disagree.

It doesn't look like that to me. Although of course there is a part of the Scary hairy scottish bogeyman thing that the Tory Fukers are doing that might make a small difference. Sadly the asinine Labour party are playing the same game & playing into the Tories' hands. Yeah so there is a slim chance that this will win the Tories the election. and that would be because labour hate the SNP more than the Tories.

not at all, they're as capable of reading the Fixed Parliament Act just as Salmond's done. The tories know how it works.

They're loving the propaganda that Salmond is giving their campaign and the votes and seats they'll win precisely because of what Salmond is doing.

And Salmond knows what he's doing.

are you daft enough to think he doesn't?

You think the SNP would rather have a Tory government than influencing a Labour one? I disagree. Neither of us can prove the other wrong. My point above about the SNP how the SNP have built their support is relevant. Salmond may be many things but he is not daft.

yeah, because there's been nothing said about another indyref if the UK votes tory and Scotland votes SNP, and there's been nothing said about another indyref if the UK votes to leave the EU, and Salmond has never suggested that he might even declare UDI.

FFS.

Are you really so thick as to think his sole aim isn't to create divisions wherever he can, to try and bring about indy?

Yes

And really, all of the previous 'insults' you've taken have been banter. I really do mean "thick" there, if that's how your thinking really is. Wake up man, if you want to walk to disaster, at least do it with your eyes open, to know what you're following.

I'm thick. You are arrogant & I think you seriously underestimate Alec.

and the way to indie a very short time down the line, you hope.

Yeah, people in England know.

That's why no one will play with Alex and you'll have wasted all political influence with your vote.

Vote SNP get marginalised.

You can claim that won't happen, but you'll see that it does no matter who wins.

Thank you as always for your opinion so freely shared. we shall of course see how things turn out. I truly have no idea how things will pan out in this election. although I am pretty confident your predictions are well wide of the mark... we shall see, we shall see.

Edited March 25, 2015 by LJS

[kaosmark2]

Scottish people are more likely to vote for independence if Westminster is fucking their society. That's more likely to happen under the Tories. Ergo, those desperate for independence regardless of the cost want a Tory win.

Not a difficult logical pathway.

[eFestivals]

What a complete load of utter Bollocks

that Salmond is driving votes to the tories? Not bollocks.

That Salmond is using tory campaign slogans? Not bollocks.

Now, all you need to do is ask yourself why he's doing that.

[eFestivals]

I'm thick.

If you say so.

You are arrogant

If you think I've said 'thick' about you, you need to be referencing the facts. But you don't do facts, do you? Which does perhaps make you....?

I think you seriously underestimate Alec.

Not at all. If I were under-estimating him, I'd think him just a lovely fluffy left-leaner whose principles and politics I could support.

But he's not a left-leaner, is he? He's a political opportunist, using whatever's to hand to pursue his dream of indie at any cost. That's what Nationalists do, haven't you noticed with Farage?

He's a wrecker, and I know it. As do the tories, and Labour. He doesn;'t have anyone's best interests at heart apart from his own, and certainly not the population of Scotland who would suffer massive spending cuts and be impoverished if Salmond got his way.

Vote SNP get marginalised. Because that's the only sensible option for the UK.

[eFestivals]

Scottish people are more likely to vote for independence if Westminster is fucking their society. That's more likely to happen under the Tories. Ergo, those desperate for independence regardless of the cost want a Tory win.

Not a difficult logical pathway.

Exactly.

And those who are voting SNP are the same 45% that voted for indie.

It's all a bit transparent.

[Comfy Bean]

" English votes fine - Scottish votes horrendous " I had a wee chuckle at these words as they had a familiar ring to them. Good article with some interesting points I thought

I see you still won`t accept that Salmond may be one step in front of you ( at least ) This guy thinks Salmond is about 3 steps ahead. He`s not even at Westminster and he is all we ever hear about. A bit like on here, Salmond is becoming the only show in town.....how does me manage to do that ? Meanwhile back in Scotland NS continues to take care of business ( according to the polls ).

What`s happened to your often used line about vote Tory get SNP ? Have you dropped it now due to these latest developments ? I wonder if Jimbo will drop it as well on QT tonight ? I doubt it as it`s always been his only line. Like your assurances last September that Labour would win this election they seem to be getting tweaked to keep up. Salmond and Sturgeon have been 100% clear and consistent. There will be NO deal with the Tories. I accept you think you know better but in reality you don`t. Looking at the polls Labour could form an " anti Tory " group of MP`s with the SNP that ends with Ed in number 10 or.......... do a deal with Dave.

Salmond will offer this deal to Labour " unconditionally " if need be as he knows what his opponents will say. The Tories not to mention your good self will need to tweak your position ( again )

I would love to say here that there is 100% no chance that Ed would ever form a " Grand Coalition " with Dave but although I think it is unlikely, I don`t rule it out 100%. This makes me very very sad. The fact you call me thick doesn`t concern me in the slightest but the fact that you have said across both threads that I " don`t care, I want a Tory Government " is poor form. I`ve been around here long enough to know that your hearts in the right place and you do not want to see Dave continuing in number 10. I know you don`t want to see us all subjected to 5 more years of Dave. This is why I don`t understand why you don`t see an " unconditional " offer to form a group of anti tory mp`s to lock Dave out as a good thing. I get that Salmond and his big smug coupon will claim all the credit for it but surely that is a price worth paying ? I genuinely believe that this would be a price worth paying for us all................well apart from Gary

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2015/03/the-tory-partys-attitude-towards-scotlandisasstupidasitiscynical/

[eFestivals]

" English votes fine - Scottish votes horrendous "

yep, this is the sort of self-serving ridiculousness than snippers have to resort to to try and sustain the idea that Scots are hated by the English to drive their indy dream with bullshit.

It's not that Scots are voting, it's who those Scots are voting for.

But you stick to your self-serving bullshit, because you know you have nothing without it.

[Comfy Bean]

yep, this is the sort of self-serving ridiculousness than snippers have to resort to to try and sustain the idea that Scots are hated by the English to drive their indy dream with bullshit.

It's not that Scots are voting, it's who those Scots are voting for.

But you stick to your self-serving bullshit, because you know you have nothing without it.

These were the words of Alex Massie ( see the quotation marks ). My own words were that I " had a wee chuckle at them " as I wondered if they would touch a nerve

I linked in to his full article which I thought was of some interest as it covered a few things we have all had a blether about on here.

For the record, wiki describes Massie as a political commentator and a supporter of Scottish Labour Leader Jim Murphy. I have said many many times that I don`t think us Jocks are hated by the English.

" It`s not that Scots are voting, it`s who those Scots are voting for ".... what do you mean by that ?

It reminds me of Gary ( i think ) saying the other day about Scottish voters, MP`s, wanting a say in the big decisions !

I`ll try again with the article, it talks about this sort of stuff.

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2015/03/the-tory-partys-attitude-towards-scotlandisasstupidasitiscynical/

Edited March 26, 2015 by comfortablynumb1910

[eFestivals]

I see you still won`t accept that Salmond may be one step in front of you ( at least )

says the man that can't even see that Salmond's purpose is wrecking and nothing constructive.

A bit like on here, Salmond is becoming the only show in town.....how does me manage to do that ? Meanwhile back in Scotland NS continues to take care of business ( according to the polls ).

by having the brain dead supporting him?

It's not Salmond who is being challenged here, but his faithful - who constantly show they sustain their belief ponly by never facing the facts.

What`s happened to your often used line about vote Tory get SNP ? Have you dropped it now due to these latest developments ?

Not at all.

I know he wants a tory victory, which is precisely why he's out campaigning with the tories line.

You're too daft to see it, or too duplicitous to admit it. Take your pick.

Salmond and Sturgeon have been 100% clear and consistent.

yep, and that's exactly why they're not wanted in govt.

There will be NO deal with the Tories.

yeah, because Salmond would turn down indie if he was offered it on a plate, wouldn't he?

You'd be begging him to take that tory deal yourself.

I accept you think you know better but in reality you don`t.

... says the man who can't face up to GERS.

Looking at the polls Labour could form an " anti Tory " group of MP`s with the SNP that ends with Ed in number 10

yep - tho Labour don't need to give the SNP a thing for the SNP's support, and they won't do.

Salmond will offer this deal to Labour " unconditionally " if need be as he knows what his opponents will say.

and so the point of voting SNP and getting nothing at all will be what?

Scotland would - WILL - get more if it voted Labour.

The Tories not to mention your good self will need to tweak your position ( again )

the tories don't need to tweak their position at all. They say "vote Labour get SNP", Salmond says "vote Labour get SNP", and the tory vote goes up.

Who knows, just that by itself may well give the tories victory.

And Salmond will cheer from the rooftops if it happens.

Edited March 26, 2015 by eFestivals

[eFestivals]

the fact that you have said across both threads that I " don`t care, I want a

Tory Government " is poor form.

and yet if you can't see the effect Salmond has, you've got much more than just poor form, you've got a very poor attachment to reality.

This is why I don`t understand why you don`t see an " unconditional " offer to form a group of anti tory mp`s to lock Dave out as a good thing. I get that Salmond and his big smug coupon will claim all the credit for it but surely that is a price worth paying ? I genuinely believe that this would be a price worth paying for us all

When has Salmond made any "unconditional" offer like that? He's specifically said it won't be an unconditional offer.

FFS, when you never attach the facts to your glorious leader, how much sense do you think you're talking?

But I see you're explicitly accepting the fact that you'll be voting SNP and getting marginalised, which is much more reality than you've managed for months. Very well done.

Edited March 26, 2015 by eFestivals

[gary1979666]

" English votes fine - Scottish votes horrendous " I had a wee chuckle at these words as they had a familiar ring to them. Good article with some interesting points I thought

I see you still won`t accept that Salmond may be one step in front of you ( at least ) This guy thinks Salmond is about 3 steps ahead. He`s not even at Westminster and he is all we ever hear about. A bit like on here, Salmond is becoming the only show in town.....how does me manage to do that ? Meanwhile back in Scotland NS continues to take care of business ( according to the polls ).

What`s happened to your often used line about vote Tory get SNP ? Have you dropped it now due to these latest developments ? I wonder if Jimbo will drop it as well on QT tonight ? I doubt it as it`s always been his only line. Like your assurances last September that Labour would win this election they seem to be getting tweaked to keep up. Salmond and Sturgeon have been 100% clear and consistent. There will be NO deal with the Tories. I accept you think you know better but in reality you don`t. Looking at the polls Labour could form an " anti Tory " group of MP`s with the SNP that ends with Ed in number 10 or.......... do a deal with Dave.

Salmond will offer this deal to Labour " unconditionally " if need be as he knows what his opponents will say. The Tories not to mention your good self will need to tweak your position ( again )

I would love to say here that there is 100% no chance that Ed would ever form a " Grand Coalition " with Dave but although I think it is unlikely, I don`t rule it out 100%. This makes me very very sad. The fact you call me thick doesn`t concern me in the slightest but the fact that you have said across both threads that I " don`t care, I want a Tory Government " is poor form. I`ve been around here long enough to know that your hearts in the right place and you do not want to see Dave continuing in number 10. I know you don`t want to see us all subjected to 5 more years of Dave. This is why I don`t understand why you don`t see an " unconditional " offer to form a group of anti tory mp`s to lock Dave out as a good thing. I get that Salmond and his big smug coupon will claim all the credit for it but surely that is a price worth paying ? I genuinely believe that this would be a price worth paying for us all................well apart from Gary

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2015/03/the-tory-partys-attitude-towards-scotlandisasstupidasitiscynical/

I would have thought 5 years of Labour would be a much preferred anti-tory government, as it'll last the distance. Not sure how far a Lab/SNP agreement could last - and when the ground falls away from them, we all know who'll be dangling from a wire above them ready to clean up.

And for the record, could see SNP / Tory more likely than Tory/Lab - neither particularly likely mind.

[Comfy Bean]

When has Salmond made any "unconditional" offer like that? He's specifically said it won't be an unconditional offer.

FFS, when you never attach the facts to your glorious leader, how much sense do you think you're talking?

Time will tell sir. As I said earlier, I expect Salmond to be ahead of the game and I believe him when he says he won`t deal with the Tories.

If Salmond makes an unconditional offer to join a group of anti Tory MPS that will lock Dave out of downing street would you support that ?

Of course this would not be required if Labour could get over the line without SNP MP`s.

[gary1979666]

On a less Scottish subject, any predictions for Paxo tonight?

[Comfy Bean]

I would have thought 5 years of Labour would be a much preferred anti-tory government, as it'll last the distance. Not sure how far a Lab/SNP agreement could last - and when the ground falls away from them, we all know who'll be dangling from a wire above them ready to clean up.

And for the record, could see SNP / Tory more likely than Tory/Lab - neither particularly likely mind.

Gary I accept that mate but we are looking at a situation where Ed will not get Labour over the line. Your last bit I really don`t get. You know fine well that NS and AS have 100% ruled that out. Do you know better than they do so as well

In your view, is Dave more or less likely to find himself in number 10 after this election now that Salmond has made this offer ?

In my view Ed has a chance which I hadn`t thought likely for the last 6 months or so.

[gary1979666]

Gary I accept that mate but we are looking at a situation where Ed will not get Labour over the line. Your last bit I really don`t get. You know fine well that NS and AS have 100% ruled that out. Do you know better than they do so as well

In your view, is Dave more or less likely to find himself in number 10 after this election now that Salmond has made this offer ?

In my view Ed has a chance which I hadn`t thought likely for the last 6 months or so.

My view on SNP/Tory vs Grand Coalition is just a view, a hunch, an inkling. But it's like saying I'm more likely to win the lottery at the weekend than grow a third nipple - probabilities are so low.

I think it's more likely than not that this offer will help Dave. Look at the main voting groups and how they are likely to think:

SNP supporters..."och(sorry), that Alex is going block the Tory's, I can vote for them conscience free, he's such a nice wee man."

Labour voters ...."I'm already voting anti Tory, I'll stick with Ed"

Tory voters...."Thanks Alex"

Undecideds...."ummmm"

OK, that doesn't really tell us much (sounded better in my head), but it's effective shoring up the SNP vote, and may win some of the undecideds over who had concerns over the vote SNP, get Tory.

BUT - by shoring up the SNP vote, they're also shoring up a drop in the Labour vote. Given a potential rise in Tory vote in the next few weeks (historic trends, barring any disasters between now and May), then could see Dave closer to the line. UKIP support is starting to wane a little already. I guess we need to see what the TV events bring, starting tonight.

[eFestivals]

Time will tell sir.

so what you're saying is that you';re still making it up contrary to clear facts*?

(* Salmond's "hold Labour's feet to the flame" comment)

And you wonder why I constantly take the piss.

[eFestivals]

On a less Scottish subject, any predictions for Paxo tonight?

yep, it'll be served up with roasted Chicken Dave.

[eFestivals]

Gary I accept that mate but we are looking at a situation where Ed will not get Labour over the line.

we're looking at a situation where Ed might not get Labour over the line, and where him having fewer MPs than he might otherwiseweakens any claim for him to run the country.

People will accept a clear winner as leader, even if they've not voted for them. They will not as willingly accept a weakened leader as your voting choice will cause Miliband to be.

But you don't really care. You're not voting for good government you're voting in support of Scottish indy.

Edited March 26, 2015 by eFestivals

[eFestivals]

PS: "Scottish indy" is forever more to be called Sindy.

[gary1979666]

yep, it'll be served up with roasted Chicken Dave.

Have to admit that one did make me chuckle.

Apparently after a coin toss, the format will be Dave & Paxo, then Dave & Burley with audience participation, Ed & Burley and finally Ed & Paxo.

[eFestivals]

In my view Ed has a chance which I hadn`t thought likely for the last 6 months or so.

and yet it's your view which has fucked up Ed's chances in the first place.

Not the tories, not Ed himself. You.

You and your fact-free ideas, without referencing anything of the realities of Labour or the SNP.

Edited March 26, 2015 by eFestivals

[eFestivals]

Have to admit that one did make me chuckle.

it was too good an opportunity to not take it.

It wasn't meant as a serious prediction on tonight. Given that Chicken Dave has got his desired format, I'm presuming that his performance will be ok-ish at worst.

[Comfy Bean]

Here`s another interesting general election piece from the Guardian. If Labour`s vote doesn`t collapse in England. Milliband will be PM they think.

Tonight Milliband will quite rightly force home the point that he wants to win. I remain bemused that some on here are not " happy " with the safety net Salmond will provide if that is not the case. Can`t see Dave getting the seats he will need. I think Dave is toast If him and Danny Alexander are shown the door at the same time then I think the SNP will have done us all a favour.

This Guardian fella offers an interesting antidote to Salmond at the end of his piece.

Miliband should call Salmond’s bluff. He should quickly offer the Scots Parnell’s home rule, warts and all. Salmond could take over his full budget, his welfare state and a currency tied to sterling. He should pay for his own pensioners, regiments and wind turbines. He can gather up his subventions and subsidies, as well as his MPs, and take the lot of them back over Hadrian’s Wall, leaving behind little more than a concept of citizenship and some joint services.

Miliband would have hardly any Scottish Labour MPs to object. The Tories would be out of office and no English voter would bat an eyelid. Miliband would get one parliament, the Tories the next................

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/mar/26/alex-salmond-more-powerful-possibly-imagine-snp?