Some news...

[Katster]

Yeah ours are NHS ones

[bunique]

No, because as I explained above, a mother-baby dyad (when not under the influence of drugs or alcohol) instinctively positions themselves safely around each other, and rouse and wake simultaneously. Read some of James McKenna's research. And there are multiple set-ups for safe bed sharing, including (as in our case) a cotbed placed next to the parents' bed with one side off, allowing baby to start the night in their own sleeping space and comfortably and safely transition to co-sleeping during the night.

[Katster]

I'm not keen. Not for safety reasons but for me and Dan and our relationship with each other. For me it's not a habit I want us to fall into. It's not something either of us did as kids and we both agree we want it in its own cot and own bedroom as soon as we feel its ready. If anything I will sleep in its room with it, rather than bringing it into our room but even that will only be when it's poorly or whatever.

[bunique]

Like I said each to their own. People do all sorts of crazy shit...

you really are an unbelievable twat. I shall leave you to the Barry Fish School of Parenting.

Best of luck Kat, and Ed

[feral chile]

I'm not keen. Not for safety reasons but for me and Dan and our relationship with each other. For me it's not a habit I want us to fall into. It's not something either of us did as kids and we both agree we want it in its own cot and own bedroom as soon as we feel its ready. If anything I will sleep in its room with it, rather than bringing it into our room but even that will only be when it's poorly or whatever.

I think one thing to remember is to start off with preferences, and be prepared to be flexible if it doesn't work for you.

One of the main sources of parental stress is trying to stick rigidly to your plans, and it's something most of us tend to do as new mothers.

I remember before children, I used to be a list maker, I liked crossing things off and keeping to a timetable.

it took me a while, and a lot of stress, to turn into the disorganised but chilled individual I am now

[Wooderson]

A boorish twat, to be precise yes Baz.

[bunique]

You would have a point, Barry, if I hadn't mentioned breastfeeding in 2/4 posts on the subject; and if I hadn't made reference to there being specific guidelines for safe co-sleeping; and if I hadn't provided the name of two academic, evidence-based sources of information; and if I'd presented co-sleeping as the only option rather than a possible alternative; and if at any time in this thread I had derided your parenting choices as "crazy shit". But as none of those apply, I'll take the "girl" as a compliment given I'm almost 30 and ignore the rest

This is pretty much modern parenting in a nutshell. Whether it's breast/bottle/cot/bed/stay-at-home/go to work/nursery/childminder, someone will be along to tell you you're doing it all wrong. The only thing you can be is open-minded, well-informed and as confident as you can be in your choices, and feck 'em.

So as not to be accused of "lowering the tone" I should probably make this my last post!

[Katster]

Guys none of us are twats! We are all only doing what we think is right for our families. My child isn't even here yet but I've already learnt that the right thing to do is what's right for me AND Dan. We discuss stuff together.

Feral chile I am a fairly laid back person, if anything I reckon I will have to be more of a list person as at the moment I operate in the as and when. Right now I have no idea what I will be eating for lunch or tea today - I'm pretty sure I will need to have a rough idea of things like that once someone arrives who is relying solely on me (and its dad) to be fed.

[Katster]

He's finished the book. He wishes me a smoother ride lol. I'm going to read it

[Essex_George]

Anyone used these NCT antenatal classes? I've heard a few bad things, that basically they gloss over all the gritty, real stuff about childbirth and then try to push a load of quackery and nonsense at you, but would be interested to hear anyone else's experiences.

We did the NCT classes, they were OK but as you suggest did seem to gloss over some of the gritty stuff. We did take away some useful info though but the best thing we got out of it was meeting other people in the area who were also expecting. Our daughter is 16 months old now and we still meet up with the people from the NCT classes so in that sense it was worth it. Are you still in E17?

[Katster]

We are watching the secret life of babies tonight as I don't have normal TV. Looking forward to it

[Ed209]

We did the NCT classes, they were OK but as you suggest did seem to gloss over some of the gritty stuff. We did take away some useful info though but the best thing we got out of it was meeting other people in the area who were also expecting. Our daughter is 16 months old now and we still meet up with the people from the NCT classes so in that sense it was worth it. Are you still in E17?

Yes - still in E17, for now anyway. Looking to buy, rapidly being priced out.

We heard that the best thing about them was meeting parents at the same stage as you. That is the biggest appeal for us for sure because while we have lots of friends in London, it would be nice to know a few more people in the immediate area who will have babies at the same age.

[Essex_George]

Yes - still in E17, for now anyway. Looking to buy, rapidly being priced out.

We heard that the best thing about them was meeting parents at the same stage as you. That is the biggest appeal for us for sure because while we have lots of friends in London, it would be nice to know a few more people in the immediate area who will have babies at the same age.

Exactly how we were and glad we did the NCT just for meeting people. Not sure we learnt a great deal though. Did one of the NHS classes and wasn't so good for meeting new people.

The house prices round here are crazy at the moment, glad we bought few years ago. E17 has certainly changed recently, now seems like you have to have baby to go to the pubs round here!

[Katster]

I loved the Water Baby stuff, but there isn't much provision near me. How much are your classes Barry out of interest? I'm actually looking at becoming an instructor as there is obviously an opening around here - however there may be a reason for that, I haven't fully investigated it yet! Interesting stuff.

[moheetoes]

Fab news. Congrats. Exciting times ahead.

[Katster]

Yeah I noted that they need to be heated pools but I know of at least two nearby which could possibly be suitable. I have looked into what you need to work for them and they actually offer on the job training so potentially you don't need any qualifications (although I already have a teaching certificate and previously was lifeguard trained. I also have full First Aid qualification.)

I was swimming 25 meters by 4 years of age so I don't think it necessarily advances children in terms of their general swimming abilities, I just like the idea of tapping in to that natural confidence and maintaining it right from the very beginning. My partner used to swim professionally and I swam for the local synchronized swimming team up until my late teens so we may find that ours has some natural ability anyway. If it doesn't like it then obviously we won't force it but swimming could be a big part of our family life if it does.

[Katster]

Agreed, but I didn't do this water baby stuff - I just had normal lessons from age 4. Within a year I could swim 25 meters.

I swam a (continuous) mile when I was 8 years old.

[feral chile]

I really do think it brings the kids abilities on personally. My daughter has now started mainstream classes (doing both until July as a transition) and she is in a level 2 class with much older children. She would be in a level 3 class if she could master back crawl - she can nearly do it. I think that shows it does progress them quicker. But all kids are different.

When she swims she doesn't just do the sort surface flapping you see a lot of kids do. Its a proper adult style of swimming, submerged push off from the side, streamlined body shape, head in the water while doing strokes, coming up taking breaths with head to the side. You don't just pick that up naturally, you have to be taught it.

She could under water swim without help from two, although she couldn't take breaths. You don't have the physical ability until you are at least three/four.

I am sure you didn't just get in the water and do 25 meters. Someone was obviously helping you learn I think my daughter could manage 25 meters but we don't have a pool available which is big enough and would allow me to be there in case she gets tired. They all go too deep after a certain point.

There are other options as well. The ducklings stuff is alright but personally think its way lacking compared to waterbabies. But its cheaper and there is more availability.

My daughter is insanely confident in the water. She has been from being a baby. She goes down big watersides by herself now and doesn't batter and eye lid (although the life guards do They presume she can't swim when they see her height / age - which we find funny ). Got some great videos of her doing it at centreparcs a couple of weeks back

Like you say I think natural ability counts. Me and my wife both swam for our towns etc

Good luck whatever you decide.

Oy! surface flapper, kids, non adult swimmer indeed!

I'll have you know I have an amazing talent for displacing lots and lots of water while staying in exactly in the same place!

[Katster]

We all have our own talents Feral Chile

[Paul ™]

Kat it was lovely to see you (and bump) at Bearded

[Katster]

Ahhhh thanks Paul. It was good to be there, to see everyone, and to realise that festivals can be just as much fun for me without being completed wasted. Good times!

[atomised]

Glad you enjoyed it Katster. I guess it can be pretty liberating to do these things sober occasionally

[Katster]

Sunday was 24 week point. It is now officially a human being.

The worst part for me so far is what I can only describe as "the rib thing". It's a strange feeling, which lots of other women have described and discussed both online and in real life, but nobody seems sure of exactly what it is. Other than that I'm just me, with a swollen belly and feeling a bit tired. I think I have done remarkably well so far. Third trimester time for me now though, eek.

Aqua Natal was cancelled, which is a bummer, but I'm keeping up with Pilates and walking, with the occasional swim now and then.

[Katster]

How's your Mrs doing Ed209??

[Katster]

http://www.justgiving.com/Katy-Sales1/

If anybody here would like to take part, I have organised a sweepstake for guessing the gender, weight and DOB of my baby - to raise funds for families and babies less fortunate than me and mine