Football 2011-2012

[eFestivals]

We must have heard different rumours, the one I heard was liverpool wanted to make a 15 million profit from the deals and the Carroll price was therefore set at a particular level eg if they had got 35 for torres they would have paid 20 for carrol. As you say who knows what really happened, nobody will convince me that newcastle would have turned down 30 million for Carroll though if liverpool had been adamant they wouldnt pay more.

Lambrini or whatever is name is has come out and said that Ashley got all hard-ball, £35M or nothing.

It was right at the end of the window, Liverpool had no other options if they were going to buy before the window shut, and Ashley knew that and played on that, banking on it being a necessity for Liverpool to buy.

Liverpool then say that that caused them to go back to Chelsea and say "the price is now £50M and not the £45M we'd previously agreed". And Chelsea coughed up, so it all went thru.

Ashley was playing real hard-ball too. The deal included full cash payment immediately, which is apparently very unusual.

If all of that is true, then it pretty much pans out as Liverpool being prepared to pay up-to £30M for Carroll as that's what they'd allowed for. I'm sure if Newc had said £20M Liverpool would have happily paid that lower amount.

That £30M price could have the piss ripped out of it almost as much tho.

Edited May 11, 2012 by eFestivals

[The Nal]

Yeah I like the harsh treatment the Scottish managers dish out personally. I think Moyes is similar at times, even if Benj wouldn't like to admit it. I think journalists get away with writing a lot of rubbish and I'd rather see them put in their place than act like Harry, who they love because he cuddles upto them. Ferguson's press demeanour has certainly worked well for United. They know they don't fuck with him.

[eFestivals]

Agreed thats sounds like normal negotiation with newcastle rejecting an initial offer and hoping the side come back with more. I cant believe if liverpool had stuck to their guns at 30 million, that newcastle wouldnt have accepted.

there just wasn't the time left to play a game of chicken. As it was it all only just went thru in time.

[strummer77]

I'd agree with you on Moyesie too. Shankley was a master at it too. He started that movement.

[kaosmark2]

Agreed thats sounds like normal negotiation with newcastle rejecting an initial offer and hoping the side come back with more. I cant believe if liverpool had stuck to their guns at 30 million, that newcastle wouldnt have accepted.

[eFestivals]

Carroll was hot property at the time as well, ge'd got 11 goals in 16 games, several assists, an England call-up. Spurs had give a half-arsed tentative question about pricing. They were rumoured to have tried 25m with us telling them to piss off. Also, with the situation around us at the time, Ashley/Llambias wouldn't have wanted to aggravate fans further by accepting a low price. Factoring in the whole "local hero" thing, at the time he probably was worth 30m+ to Newcastle, particularly as the team's playstyle was built around him.

Yup. I don't think anyone would have been hugely surprised if Newc did get £30M for him. As you say he was hot at the time, and as a youngster is likely to get better. It would have been at the top end of the price tho, and without results it would have got quickly ridiculed.

It's that extra £5M which makes it look so awful. £30M has pretty much been the top amount paid in the UK for 10 years now, even City's mega-spending has rarely (if ever?) hit £30M on a single player.

So it was always going to be as hard job for that to look reasonable value, even if he'd managed the same form as he had at Newc.

[The Nal]

It works in the long-run though even if it doesn't get you as Mr. Popular, and you get the odd character assassination in the press, the really harmful stories about the club dry up. The FA also are less inclined to mess with you fearing the wrath. It puts the spotlight on the manager but people mess less with the club and think twice before promoting a story that may or may not be true. Mourinho is a master at the game too.

[strummer77]

Madrid are actually the fathers of that movement. It works too. Think about it. You're a football journalist in Madrid but you're barred from Real Madrids place for asking too many questions. Career over!

[kaosmark2]

Yup. I don't think anyone would have been hugely surprised if Newc did get £30M for him. As you say he was hot at the time, and as a youngster is likely to get better. It would have been at the top end of the price tho, and without results it would have got quickly ridiculed.

It's that extra £5M which makes it look so awful. £30M has pretty much been the top amount paid in the UK for 10 years now, even City's mega-spending has rarely (if ever?) hit £30M on a single player.

So it was always going to be as hard job for that to look reasonable value, even if he'd managed the same form as he had at Newc.

[The Nal]

Definitely. Agree 100%

Bit like the fact that the Messi racism row seems to have dropped. Nobody is going to push that, imagine being denied access to Messi and Barca?! That's game over.

[Benj]

I think Aguero was £37m wasn't he? And Dzeko was upper 20s if I remember right...

But yeah, it's a huge figure. That extra £5m made it a bit more amenable to our fans, as we weren't happy with the "Carroll won't be sold" line not being followed, although there was always the doubt at whether it was going to Ashley's pocket or the club. Supposedly some of it's still left to reinvest...

[kaosmark2]

Surely you were laughing your cocks off!

[Benj]

Not really, I figured it was £35m going to line Ashley's pocket. The last 12 months have made it look a lot better (our good transfer dealings and performances more than Carroll being shit), but things seemed very different back then. We looked like a selling club with no ambition who were just there to make Ashley richer. Now it seems like we're a stubborn club with some ambition who are there to make Ashley richer.

[eFestivals]

Surely you were laughing your cocks off!

Even if the fans weren't, I'm sure Ashley was.

If the story is true, as i've already pointed out, Liverpool won't be feeling too peved about that extra £5M, because they went and screwed it back out of Chelsea.

The bit that Liverpool should be pissed off about is not getting £50M out of Chelsea in the first place as it turned out they were prepared to pay that. That's the place where Liverpool cocked up and where things were most in their control.

[strummer77]

I think Aguero was £37m wasn't he? And Dzeko was upper 20s if I remember right...

[kaosmark2]

Different point, but this is where wages come into the grand scheme of things.

Liverpool could have afforded Aguero or some one better than Carroll... but Aguero costs £5m+ extra a year for Man CIty. That's what sets their spending apart more than their (large) transfer fees.

[eFestivals]

Yup, Yaya, Tevez, Aguero, Silva are all on over £200k/week aren't they? I imagine most of the rest of their squad tops £100k as well.

Abedayor told his Spurs team-mates he was on £225k per week. So I'd guess that many of them are on stupid money.

[kaosmark2]

Abedayor told his Spurs team-mates he was on £225k per week. So I'd guess that many of them are on stupid money.

[kaosmark2]

Changing topic....

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18033752

Is it just me that thinks this is an overreaction? It's not like the club didn't look to speak to a group about it. Are they to blame that there are different groups formed over the disaster, which probably don't agree with each other?

[Ed209]

Total over reaction. Hillsborough was tragic, and the club should never forget what happened, but they can't always be pandering to the families of the victims. Its very much like the 9/11 families in the States.

I actually think that's a really nice kit

[kaosmark2]

Pardew manager of the season and Kompany player of the season.

Delighted Pardew's got it, not just because it reflects how great our season has been, but it's nice that it hasn't gone to the title-winners. A month or two ago I'd have said Brendan Rodgers, but Swansea have cruised a bit since the relegation threat has gone and I think the winner each season should be performing throughout.

I'm surprised by Kompany getting it, I would have thought it'd have gone to RVP, but glad to see him win it. Easily the best defender in the league this season, he's even made Lescott look impressive alongside him.

[strummer77]

I actually think that's a really nice kit

Edited May 11, 2012 by strummer77

[strummer77]

Here is the league as Lawro saw it panning out.

(nicked from someone offRAWK who may have nicked it from somewhere else)

Edit: looks small but click on it and it's fine!

Edited May 12, 2012 by strummer77

[kaosmark2]

Wigan and Swansea on a mere 27 and relegated. QPR comfortable. Us only on 45.... Wolves on 42...

Man U 100 points! Hasn't predicted them a single loss!

Don't know if he's much worse than others, but that's pretty awful predicting.

[pink_triangle]

Wigan and Swansea on a mere 27 and relegated. QPR comfortable. Us only on 45.... Wolves on 42...

Man U 100 points! Hasn't predicted them a single loss!

Don't know if he's much worse than others, but that's pretty awful predicting.